Islam is coming, Islam is coming

[NGONGE]

Just got back from the gym having let out lots of steam. The testosterone has been regulated and the senses are calm.

 

Baashe,

 

You say:

 

Ngonge,

 

I don’t see anything wrong with Khayr’s post. For crying out loud the man has only posted Qur’anuc verses. Where has Khayr gone wrong saaxiib?

You also said:

 

 

Amigo Castro has yet to acknowledge, in practice (virtual), the care and foresight these kinda topics need

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but would you not consider the abuse and impulsive use of Qur’anuc verses a more alarming offence than all that Castro could ever be accused of?

 

What do the verses he (Khayer) used insinuate? Are they correct or is he making an assumption? Who here has confessed to worshipping their own desires? Does Castro own a hidden stone (I own none)?

 

 

I am more than happy to throw a couple of lines from a poem into a discussion. You do too and so does Xiin (and many others). We know it’s simply a poem and even if we used it out of context it really is not the biggest of felonies. Verses of the Quran are not like lines from a poem. They should not be cited in every topic (and certainly not in the way that Khayer and others use them). How can you not see the wrong in that when you yourself do not do the same?

 

This is a quote from you in another topic:

 

 

FYI there is an ayah in the Qur’an that commands the faithful to obey whatever the prophet asks them to do and vice versa. It goes like this: Maa aataakumu rasuulu fakhuthuuhu, wamaa nahaa cankunm fantahuu. Nomads plz correct me and if you would please find the chapter and verse numbers for SB.

 

Allahu Yaclam.

Why did you not do what Khayr did and just post the verses without any caveats or qualifications? After all, for crying out loud, you’ll only be posting Qur’anuc verses (ironically enough, yours was even more relevant and answering a direct question).

 

What is the more serious issue, Baashe?

[Haaraahur.]

Baashi writes:

 

Roob, Emotions are getting in the way but Ngonge has good thesis. In case you didn’t noticed he is of the opinion that our energy are spent on matters of lesser concern given the enormity of challenges faced the ummah and too often these challenges are coming from within the ummah rather than from outside.

Baashi Whenever an ayah is quoted or someone praises Islaam there he comes rushing to declare his disapproval. Is that the good thesis I failed to notice?

 

He seems to be stuck at how screen characters are reacting to his posts and other trivial stuff instead of penning some good recommendations as food for thought for discussion.

Well, perhaps the name calling and accusing others of lacking the ability to understand and even read contributes to such reactions,wouldn’t you say?

 

As for the discussions he did say that he only debates with like-minded people. What do you make of that?

[Nephissa]

Sad to say, even those of us who'r open-minded, educated, and informed do occasionally get out of hand. As of late religion debates of SOL turn into battlegrounds, thus leads to arguments and hostility.

 

Don't ruin it for those who want to broaden their horizons. Wax inaan faa'iidaysano baan u nimid, not inaan odayo is caayayo akhrino!

 

Thank You.

 

PS. Castro: Stay safe buddy! Goodluck, I'll keep you in my prayers.

[NGONGE]

^^^ First appearances can be deceptive. There is plenty of benefit in this thread. The argument of ‘odayal squabbling’ that you and Seven of Nine are talking about is merely the noise that a machine makes as it whirls around and does its work. The older the machine, the louder the noise.

 

Do not worry about it and practise skim reading.

 

Roob,

 

I will not accuse you of not being able to read in case it upsets you. I will not even bite that bait you’ve dangled in front of me and go into one of my usual rants. I’ll simply ask you to go back and read my exchanges with Nur (and Baashe) on this thread. If you still insist on your idea, I still would not say that you can’t read, but I will not waste my time and yours by having any discussions with you (the like minded people comment).

[-Serenity-]

Roob, you simply spend far too much time speculating about the motives of those who post instead of putting forth your reasons for disagreeing with them, ma istidhi? Believe me, this discussion would get far if you didn’t have the ‘bad habit’ of seeing a conspiracy or an ulterior motive with posts. Indulge and participate in topics one at a time…sticking to the points being discussed. Its not that hard if you have anything meaningful to say.

 

Mr.Kheyr is well known 4 his ‘bad habit’ of showing up every now and then and sprinkling us with random hadeeth or verses from the Quran, insinuating that the nomads who he disagrees with are the devils incarnate or infidels. He really doesn’t add much to any discussion in terms of content or even explain what he means (he counts on people not arguing over the divine texts) and worst of all, he doesn’t see how his implications are contrary to Islamic etiquette. Please don’t turn into another Kheyr… the board cannot take it.

 

[Edit]

NG, you beat me to it.

[Jacpher]

Although it’s not a habit of mine, I see no harm in throwing in ayah or hadeeth which fits the topic well.

[-Serenity-]

Originally posted by

Ducaqabe

:

Although it’s not a habit of mine, I see no harm in throwing in ayah or hadeeth

which fits the topic well

• [25:43] Have you seen the one whose god is his own ego? Will you be his advocate?

  [25:44] Do you think that most of them hear, or understand? They are just like animals; no, they are far worse.

So you think the verse suits the topic well? How so? Perhaps you can point the finger at the 'ego worshippers' who are worse than animals on this thread and let me know how you’ve arrived at that conclusion.

 

While I understand where your disagreement with some of the participants on this thread comes from, its reprehensible to praise Kheyr and agree with him just to spite them. How dare he use God’s words to dismiss and insult others? Its hypocritical to let your own egos stand in the way of advising Kheyr to stop abusing the Quranic Texts. Since when is it acceptable to refer to other posters on this site like that? Infact, isn’t one of the fastest ways to leave Islam to proclaim that another muslim is ‘evil’ or ‘manifestation of Satan’? Here is a hadeeth to support this (and it 'fits my argument’ well)

 

• It is reported on the authority of Ibn `Umar that the Prophet (may peace and blessings be upon him) said: Any person who calls his brother: O Unbeliever! (then the truth of this label) would return to one of them. If it is true, (then it is) as he asserted, (but if it is not true), then it returns to him (and thus the person who made the accusation is an Unbeliever). [Muslim]

I would also like to tell you that nabigu scw never called any1 a kafir even on the grounds of not believing in his claims.

 

Two wrongs don’t make a right, and I for one despise the one using my religion to give his claims a glow of authenticity by dipping into the holy texts that I hold in highest regard.

[Nur]

Johnny B bro.

 

You write:

 

Having said that , i second my Graad (Bashi) and favor the tea peace confrence , becouse the alternative is e-Nuri´s ruin and that is not what NGONGE or Castro want as they CARE about the consumers just as much , if not more .

 

 

Brother Johnny

 

Could there be another alternative, like a wining of the right concept, a win for Allah SWT ?

 

 

You see Johnny, whenever I engage in a debate, I wish the other party is right, why? because in that case I would learn a new lesson, by insisting to win at the expense of the Xaqq ( what is absolutely right ) is indeed a weakness of character, great men admit their mistakes, it takes other great men to take a notice.

 

One last thing bro, Do you beieve that e-Nuri business is a monopoly? I hope not, I am for free movement of goods and ideas, I am against violence and insults to get ones point across and i see a lot of it being exchanged, here an I am not comfortable with it. I do not expect that you agree woth me with JZK, may be praying for a brother to be rewrded is not your conventional wisdom at this point, what I expect from you though is some impatiality, that you agree with what makes sense no matter who says it, that way you will add real value, that advice goes to everybody on SOL including me, I am working on an essay to highlight this principle.

 

 

Nur

[Jacpher]

I don’t dig your abrupt judgment my dear. I was merely making a general statement regarding the topic at hand. Neither was I patronizing Kheyr, nor annoying any participant of the discussion. Personally, I don’t indulge myself to cast label at someone’s faith. Not in my nature. My intent was to simply state my humble opinion. Perhaps you misunderstand it and thought I was involved in a rescue operation.

 

I concur. It’s absolutely inappropriate to toss up verses to undermine one’s faith and ability to participate a discussion. It’s despicable act the least to say. However, I still hold my stance. One can state or paraphrase a verse or hadith given it is relevant to the topic, fits well and explained thoroughly.

 

I must admit I haven’t read the whole thread. Though I read the verses in question, I couldn’t quite understand the point Kheyre was trying to get across so I ignored. Those verses didn’t come to my attention until your post. I had to look them up in the Kitaab. Usually when I read quranic verse in English, I try to come up the verse in Arabic right at that moment. If I couldn’t and no Mus-haf is near, I simply pass.

 

I would never disrespect, or call a Muslim a kafir or make hypocritical assumption as you presumed. Never have done so my dear friend. Hasty judgment isn’t part of my routine.

 

Ma meel la isku hardinayo ayaan mijaha la soo galay? I better go back to my Mustamiciinal Kiraam status.

[Haaraahur.]

Ngonge writes:

 

Roob,I will not accuse you of not being able to read in case it upsets you. I will not even bite that bait you’ve dangled in front of me and go into one of my usual rants. I’ll simply ask you to go back and read my exchanges with Nur (and Baashe) on this thread. If you still insist on your idea, I still would not say that you can’t read, but I will not waste my time and yours by having any discussions with you (the like minded people comment).

I was generally referring to your Islamic posts not just this one in particular. Calaa ku xaal ha kuu macaanaato.

 

Roob, you simply spend far too much time speculating about the motives of those who post instead of putting forth your reasons for disagreeing with them, ma istidhi? Believe me, this discussion would get far if you didn’t have the ‘bad habit’ of seeing a conspiracy or an ulterior motive with posts. Indulge and participate in topics one at a time…sticking to the points being discussed. Its not that hard if you have anything meaningful to say.

You really don’t have the slightest clue on the amount of time I spend on anything walaal. So stop speculating yourself! Neither do I see any contribution you have made so far except the whining on how these nomads are arguing. As for the lecture you are in more need of it than I do. Markaan ra’yigaaga u baahdo anigaa ku warsan.

[Khayr]

Salamz,

 

Originally posted by 7 0f Nine:

• [25:43] Have you seen the one whose god is his own ego? Will you be his advocate?
  [25:44] Do you think that most of them hear, or understand? They are just like animals; no, they are far worse.

Aad baa uu maxad qabta, this is the translation that I was looking for!

 

 

So you think the verse suits the topic well? How so? Perhaps you can point the finger at the 'ego worshippers' who are worse than animals on this thread and let me know how you’ve arrived at that conclusion.

 

While I understand where your disagreement with some of the participants on this thread comes from, its reprehensible to praise

Kheyr

and agree with him just to spite them.

How dare

he use God’s words to dismiss and insult others? Its hypocritical to let your own egos stand in the way of advising Kheyr to stop abusing the Quranic Texts. Since when is it acceptable to refer to other posters on this site like that? Infact, isn’t one of the fastest ways to leave Islam to proclaim that another muslim is ‘evil’ or ‘manifestation of Satan’? Here is a hadeeth to support this (and it 'fits my argument’ well)

 

• It is reported on the authority of Ibn `Umar that the Prophet (may peace and blessings be upon him) said: Any person who calls his brother: O Unbeliever! (then the truth of this label) would return to one of them. If it is true, (then it is) as he asserted, (but if it is not true), then it returns to him (and thus the person who made the accusation is an Unbeliever). [Muslim]

I would also like to tell you that nabigu scw

never

called any1 a kafir even on the grounds of not believing in his claims.

 

Two wrongs don’t make a right, and I for one despise the one using my religion to give his claims a glow of authenticity by dipping into the holy texts that I hold in

highest

regard. [/QB]

-Ayats of Quran was posted with no particular reference to ANY ONE NOMAD .

 

So why do you and Ngonge have an issue with it??? :confused:

 

 

In anycase, qadraAllah Mashaa Fa'al.

[-Serenity-]

Ducaqabe,

 

I’m not judging you. But you must admit, your ‘contribution’ at that precise time does not come across as motiveless considering the topic isn’t about quoting hadeeth or Quranic verses where they fit (I’ve done it too… and you’d be hard pressed to find some1 who doesn’t understand my point..unless they were being obtuse). Anyway, its best we don’t get hasty in responses.

 

Roob,

 

No, I don’t. However, I’m not impressed with ur trailing of certain members and trying to character assassinate them in heated debates. People like you take the discussion to the rotten end.

 

p.s. My contribution is telling you off… isn’t it clear? :rolleyes:

 

Kheyr,

-Ayats of Quran was posted with no particular reference to ANY ONE NOMAD .

 

So why do you and Ngonge have an issue with it???

So what was the point of posting those particular verses in this particular thread Kheyr? Please dont insult our intelligence any further.

[Johnny B]

Originally posted by Nur:

 

 

Brother Johnny

 

Could there be another alternative, like a wining of the right concept, a win for Allah SWT ?

............................................

 

One last thing bro, Do you beieve that e-Nuri business is a monopoly? I hope not, I am for free movement of goods and ideas, I am against violence and insults to get ones point across and i see a lot of it being exchanged, here an I am not comfortable with it.

I do not expect that you agree woth me with JZK, may be praying for a brother to be rewrded is not your conventional wisdom at this point,

what I expect from you though is some impatiality, that you agree with what makes sense no matter who says it, that way you will add real value, that advice goes to everybody on SOL including me, I am working on an essay to highlight this principle.

 

 

Nur

Dear NUR,

I hate to take NGONGE´s path and be dissappointed in you as you Thwart anyone´s effort to neutralize a situation ignited by what is seen as a tiny misunderstanding (from your side to be frank ).

 

Obviously you do believe that you´ve a concept a winning one , that may so be ,but i fail to find another concept in the thread to compare, be it presented by NGONGE or Castro.

 

It goes without saying that NGONGE, CASTRO and many others inclding myself idolize you as a talanted , respected brother with a stable, well-built knowledge of Islam( Maybe we´re having too higher hopes on you )

 

Actually NGONGE beat me to questioning your Autopilot status,becouse this e-nuri episode cotains the subtle undercurrent msg that Castro points at and the wishy washy conspiracy theory Against Islam which forced NGONGE to rush to the GYM.

 

If you fail to realize that ( which i doubt you do ) You´ve lived far shorter within your limits.

 

I hope the reason why i favored Bashi´s tea peace confrence instead of this wangled epidose of e-nuri is clear now.

ofcourse you are not to expect JZK from me in every e-nuri episode ,and if i could i´d reward you personally, but i lack the wisdom, maybe a clap on the shoulder or a blow in the chest are more likely to be expected from me;).

 

As for the case with Castro i feel the need to share with you an event that took place when i was younger.

That winter day as we left school heading home , i was having rift with Joakim a huge but coward guy of my age ,it was getting colder and darker as we were fighting ,since he was stronger he´d me on the cold snowy/icy ground, but he was too afraid to hit me as i was threatening him with everything i knew he was afraid of would happen to him the minute i get onto my feet, I should mention that we were not alone that day, a 'freind' of mine by the name Mathias was with us , not interferring, but was enjoying the show.

after an hours a school teacher was passing by and asked Mattias what was happening?

my 'Friend' Mattias answered " inget , de skojar bara ". meaning "nothing , they´re just kidding".

 

only heaven knows what i thought about Mattias at that very minute.

 

Now Castro is your Mattias in this case. he just wanted the subtle undercurrent msg to surface either way.

 

Originally posted by 7 of 9:

So what was the point of posting those particular verses in this particular thread Kheyr? Please dont insult our intelligence any further.

Don´t missunderstand Kheyr and co, the little i´ve seen of him/her is what you could call a slightly fanatic Muslim, the kind of person who thinks , "it is my Islam , my faith in my own way" and anyone who don´t see it that way can and will be refered to ' those animals , who don´t understand'.

 

Xiin of diffrent clibre though, but basically intolerant to figuratively stinging inputs that may come from some of us , or from what he refers to as "The provocative swing".

[Baashi]

This is tiring wallahi.

 

Ngonge,

Saaxiib in general yes tossing ayat carelessly and without aim, context, or purpose is not only recless but also dangerous. However, in this case, I took Khayr's post as a reminder for all of us that following our whims could lead us to hell literally. That's how I read it.

 

After all we are discussing religion, Islam in particular. We are disagreeing with each other and even some of us are arguing excessively to no avial. Some of us are implicitly asserting that "Islam is not coming" (note my boy JB's post) and they have their own "reasons" to say so. Ayat serving as a reminder, in this context, can only be beneficial methinks.

 

Now, I prefer to reason and state my take, agree with my oponent when such action is warranted and if necessary back up my claims with evidences from my principal sources. Khayr is different character. May be he doesn't feel the necessity of going through such exercise or may be he is not clever enough to try to see things from other prespectives and put himself their shoes and try to understand what makes them tik! There is room for improvement, I say!

 

As to being unfair to my boy Castro, it's possible. Castro and I have an understanding though. We communicate in other venues and I'm confident he would let me know if I inadvertently went too far on this sport.

 

Roob,

I don't have issues with Ngonge. I disagree with him on some issues. I don't approve how he's handling the debates relating to Islam. Nevertheless, the man is clear on one thing. He is for Islam. He is for Muslims. He has chosen his camp time and again. He has some strategies in mind (that could put us on the right track) that he would like us too see discussing. He is mainly thinking along political lines, media utilization, and getting into the ring sort to speak with the very folks who malign us with intent to win the argument for our side. Concenterate in Diaspora first. This is how I understood him. Is this a winning strategy? That is debatable! Are there other strategies that can get us to the promise land? Here is where he needs to give other opinions a receptive ear.

 

He is not doing his theisi a favor when he starts with topic sentence like "Islam is the problem". By and large, the man is talented. He can pen a very impressive, coherent, and rational argument. I don't want you to look for cilado. Let's root out the minor obstacles (tone, emotions, and what not) and have Nur, Ngonge, Viking, Mutakalim, Xiin and other knowledgeable fellas who are in the same camp pull the robe for us. Opinions, different takes and views, and dissent as long as they are reasonable and within the "camp", they are all welcomed. Opinions from other camps are aslo welcomed as long as their adherents do not hide (with intent to blurr the lines) the camp they really belong to.

[Khayr]

This is tiring wallahi.

 

Ngonge,

Saaxiib in general yes tossing ayat carelessly and without aim, context, or purpose is not only recless but also dangerous. However, in this case, I took Khayr's post as a reminder for all of us that following our whims could lead us to hell literally. That's how I read it.

 

I agree with you saxib on this. When a debate is done for the sake of debating, when someone argues just to show and disapprove someone else, then the Shaytan takes over in the discussion

and Dhikrul Allah is thrown out the window. In actuality, it becomes dhikr al-Xawa/Ego

 

i.e. i am right and what I "think" etc. becomes the focal point.

 

After all we are discussing religion, Islam in particular. We are disagreeing with each other and even some of us are arguing excessively to no avial. Some of us are implicitly asserting that "Islam is not coming" (note my boy JB's post) and they have their own "reasons" to say so. Ayat serving as a reminder, in this context, can only be beneficial methinks.

 

Now, I prefer to reason and state my take, agree with my oponent when such action is warranted and if necessary back up my claims with evidences from my principal sources. Khayr is different character. May be he doesn't feel the necessity of going through such exercise or may be he is not clever enough to try to see things from other prespectives and put himself their shoes and try to understand what makes them tik! There is room for improvement, I say!

 

I've been here since 2002 and people's

 

nature's are the same and I have heard the same

 

story retold over and over again, just not by the

 

same characters.

 

The net is not the proper forum for Taaleem, teaching deen because the Net fosters

 

1) Impatience in people (if it doesn't load up in

 

5 sec, it ain't worthy of viewing or listening

 

to)

 

2) Anonymity-Meaning there is no real,

 

substantive relationship that MOSTTTT people can

 

develop with each other. Someone can say what

 

they want and feel 'unaccountable' for their

 

words.

 

Therefor, the net is mostly for Entertainment

 

purposes for most of us but as a muslim on SOL,

 

I hate it when someone mocks the deen and muslims

 

so they can Entertain themselves.

 

Where I can interject, inshallah I will and

 

sometimes an ayat or hadith will be quoted

 

because it best illustrates a point that

 

I am trying to make!!!

 

Sometimes discussion for the sake of discussion

 

when it lacks sincerity, becomes very redundant

 

and tiresome.

 

 

Fi AMANILLAH