Marry a guy who delivers pizzas?

[Animal Farm]

I think people without education lack many characteristics in life. Say for example understanding the complexities of life. They lack rationality, and they get amused by the most simplistic things in life. But than again, we do need people to hand us our burgers, wash our cars, clean our houses --- without you’re simplistic view of life none of this would be possible. Create kids as an investment, ten is a good number. I mean look at our parents, what they got for having 10+ children – they forgot to understand that we’re not on farms anymore, children cost money, when will they get it, kids are not assets, they’re a liability.

[Viking]

If a young man is not motivated enough to improve his mind, his financial position, his immediate family's, what friggin chance will a woman who married him for his character have of getting anywhere but backwards? Good character does not nullify irresponsibilty.

sheherazade,

I don't know how you misread my example of the Prophet SAWS and somehow ended up attributing backwardness to the picture I was trying to put up. This post was about Somali men who are "underarcheiving" in secular education as compared to their female counterparts. I just went out to show that a profession (pizza delivery in this instance) or secular education are not good criteria to use when in search of a husband (hence my example of the Prophet who was a perfect human being despite lacking the criteria mentionned).

 

I know the next thing on your mind would be 'we are living in different times etc.' which also is true, but a higher education does in NO WAY guarantee a happy marriage, so why should it be a major criteria?

 

PS: Good character does not nullify responsibility but enhances it.

 

 

Fidel,

Education is neither mutually exclusive with having a good character nor with being a good muslim. A person SHOULD have all three. Why is this simple topic being twisted to mean those with education lack character and deen.

A person should (optimally) have all three but it isn't the end of the world if he lacks a higher education; but you made it seem that way in your post. Plumbers and gas engineers (I've heard) make as much money as doctors in the UK, so if a person has a good character, is pious, honest and respectable (with an income)... should they not be appreciated as much because they don't have a BSc that will (only) earn them a few grand amore a year? A BSc doesn't make a happier marriage, we should therefore be more concerned about the moral decadance than we are about the economical decline of Somali men abroad.

[Paragon]

^^^ To the thinking being, a BSc or MA in any social science subject (granted the generation of material gain), may likely lead to unhapiness and disatisfaction in regards to knowledge of humanty's situation. In a capitalist state/society however, I must confess, if the human bolt (the so-called educated or programmed-for-purpose human) that is part of the bigger economic machine, is content with the position he/she holds, then he/she can surely enjoy elusive and temporal/material happiness (but never the joys of life ). But such temporal happiness in no way guarantees to translate itself into marital bliss.

[Castro]

Originally posted by Viking:

A person should (optimally) have all three but it isn't the end of the world if he lacks a higher education; but you made it seem that way in your post. Plumbers and gas engineers (I've heard) make as much money as doctors in the UK, so if a person has a good character, is pious, honest and respectable (with an income)... should they not be appreciated as much because they don't have a BSc that will (only) earn them a few grand amore a year? A BSc doesn't make a happier marriage, we should therefore be more concerned about the moral decadance than we are about the economical decline of Somali men abroad.

Brother Viking, I accept your argument hook , sink and barrel. It is however an argument that would be made to the statement or question: does a higher education ensure a happier marriage? Or does wealth contribute to a happier marriage? Important questions worthy of a study in their own right but not related to this study in any way. The latter looked at the mismatch between the number of women graduating from college and that of men today. Given the current rate of mismatch, it predicts what the future holds in terms of women and men in higher education. The chances of a plumber (male) marrying a doctor (female) are infinitely smaller than a doctor-doctor marriage. However, if the former do get married, their happiness is not what the study looked at. Who knows how happy they would be? It's the possibility or availability of equivalents to marry that it talked about.

 

That's about it.

 

Oh and a decadent person, educated or not is no good, we agree. Again, the study made no note of the character of men who drop out of school or the women who get a college degree. That was really not the point.

 

Cheers.

[Jacpher]

I think some of us think or believe a degree is all you need to succeed in life and/or happiness. A degree is useful but does not dictate your talent, success, and the ability to accomplish your dreams. We know that Dick Cheney, Rush Limbaugh, Jesse Ventura and late Peter Jennings were all dropouts. These men didn’t get a degree from a prestigious school to be influential people. They had what it takes to succeed in real world and their talent enabled them to reach their goal. I recently noticed that Somalis tend to brag about their degrees thinking they’re better than those with no or less education. Now the talk of degree has become sort of Shukaansi line. Ever wondered why many nomad matrimonial sites highlight the importance of their degree in their ads? To impress others? 50% of what you studied in school won’t help or directly affect the work you do in real life.

 

Fidel: It’s possible you’re becoming more of an over protective dad?

[Haddad]

Originally posted by Ducaqabe:

50% of what you studied in school won’t help or directly affect the work you do in real life.

That's a higher percentage. I would say about 15-20% of what you study would relate to your job. If we take an example of a Bachelor's degree in Computer Science, about 50% doesn't relate to the study of Computer Science; humanities, social sciences, extracurricular activities, etc. And about 30% is purely theoretical. As I said before, education today is inflated and diluted, for the scope of maximizing profits.

[Castro]

Originally posted by Ducaqabe:

Fidel: It’s possible you’re becoming more of an over protective dad?

No sir, not at all. If my children go through the effort and hard work of higher education, no man, no matter how good his character is, will marry any of them without having an equivalent level of education. That's not over-protective, it's just my law as a father.

 

Degrees do matter my friend, Ducaqabe. If you don't think they do, even in matrimony ads, please pay a visit to any of the Indian matrimony sites where parents of the potential bride and groom not only list their child's educational credentials but also that of their desired mate. Some of those ads read like a resume. What do they know that we Somalis don't?

 

Education was big in Somalia before Siyaad Barre came along. We had doctors, engineers, economists and all sorts of people trotting the globe for higher education. Then disaster hit. And the culture changed to one that believes somehow higher education is not what it's hyped up to be. Let's get back to the basics and put education above anything else. It's the only way to get ahead in this world.

 

I bet you, Ducaqabe, that you would kick your sons behind (you won't have to worry about your daughter ) if he decided to drop out of high school. Are you gonna tell him about Peter Jennings and Bill Gates and encourage him to leave school at 16. I think not my friend. So why would you throw around your argument above?

[Jacpher]

Fidel: Not if he gets the million dollar idea.

 

You’re absolutely right! Education matters and I didn’t say it doesn’t. It’s one of the best tools we can use to achieve our goals in life. Education should be our priority #1 in our country, not military power. I personally value education as much as you do and I would still be studying at age 50 to obtain my doctorate degree. You hit in the nail. I would extremely be disappointed if my son decides to leave school. That would be a disastrous mistake. But I would love him even more for him to pursue Islamic education and become a Muslim Imam than a doctor, engineer, etc. Whatever type of education he decides is his personal choice and should be respected. People should study whatever they’re good at and enjoy doing it even if it means qabri qode. That’s my philosophy.

 

I have seen some of the Indians sites you mentioned but I think it is naïve to assume a fancy resume means a bright marriage. Is it possible they are after pride & self-respect? I would be happier if the potential bride/groom has the best possible Islamic character and practices faith. Education will be on the list but not on top.

 

Haddad: You’re right. Most of the required courses are just a waste of time and energy. Unless you’re in the doctor, engineer career fields, most of the curriculums aren’t going to be your day-to-day work activity.

[Castro]

Originally posted by Ducaqabe:

Fidel: Not if he gets the million dollar idea.

A guy shows up at my door with a million dollars, I'm gonna marry him!

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by Fidel:

"This year approximately 200,000 more women will receive bachelor's degrees than men," Mortenson says. "That means 200,000 women will not find a college-educated husband to marry. Next year there will be 200,000 more, and on and on. Women are being faced with two bad choices: not to marry at all, or marry a guy who delivers pizzas."

 

In a more general sense, he argues that a culture filled with ill-educated, drifting men does not add up to a pretty picture for anyone, including women. Mortenson cites a conversation he had with the president of an historically black college where the female/male ratio had reached the startling figure of five to one. Read the whole

article

.

 

 

These numbers in the article are in the United States. Any idea what the ratio is in the expatriate Somali communities? What about in Somalia? A father to two girls (with hopes of being a grandfather someday), this is very disturbing indeed. I wonder what it will be like in 20-25 years.

[Ibtisam]

A guy shows up at my door with a million dollars, I'm gonna marry him!

u can't get more honest than that!! money talks for sure

[sigma]

i'm just looking for a guy with his own teeth and can get to the toilet on his own at night

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by sigma:

i'm just looking for a guy with his own teeth and can get to the toilet on his own at night

QaTarRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!Meaning many get blackout at night and can't get to the toilet.That is serious..Is that X-rated?