Libya court finds foreign medics guilty in HIV case

[N.O.R.F]

Libya court finds foreign medics guilty in HIV case

Agencies

 

 

 

Tripoli: A Libyan court on Tuesday sentenced to death five Bulgarian nurses and a Palestinian doctor for infecting 426 children with HIV.

 

Judge Mahmoud Haouissa gave the verdict.

 

The six are accused of intentionally infecting the children with HIV at a hospital in Benghazi in the late 1990s.

 

The prosecution had demanded the death penalty. More than 50 of the infected children have died.

 

Source

[Cara.]

Compounding tragedy with gross injustice.

[N.O.R.F]

^^ Injustice? Have they not been found guilty? Or is a court in Africa less important than 'our' courts in the west? Why is the media not analysing the details but rather automatically believe they are innocent because they are Europeans? Would the world (and you) even care if they (the doctors) were from Africa/Asia?

[Cara.]

Northerner,

 

Please don't play the ethnocentric card. The doctor is from Palestine. I think that's in Asia. And even if he wasn't, are you claiming that Libya's justice system is infallible? Is being found guilty the same as being guilty?

 

The evidence has been analyzed thoroughly. Neither the nurses nor the doctor is likely to have deliberately infected those children with HIV.

 

Here's a good breakdown .

 

In a paper published online in Nature last week1, an international team led by researchers from Oxford, Edinburgh and Rome showed that the strain of HIV with which the children had been infected was already present and spreading locally in the mid-1990s, long before the medics arrived in Libya in 1998.

[N.O.R.F]

Ok 1 Doctor from Palestine and Nurses from Hungary. My bad.

 

are you claiming that Libya's justice system is infallible?

Does this:

 

Or is a court in Africa less important than 'our' courts in the west?

constitute such a claim?

 

ps you didnt answer my last q. Would you or your media care if the nurses were not from Europe?

[Cara.]

Northerner,

 

Originally posted by Northerner:

Ok 1 Doctor from Palestine and Nurses from Hungary. My bad.

Actually, they are from Bulgaria. I sense you're going on autopilot here. Are you even familiar with the case?

 

quote:

---

are you claiming that Libya's justice system is infallible?

Does this:

 

Or is a court in Africa less important than 'our' courts in the west?

constitute such a claim?

The question makes no sense otherwise. Miscarriage of justice is common everywhere, so why does a rejection of THIS particular verdict equate a believe that African courts are less important? What has one thing got to do with the other?

 

ps you didnt answer my last q. Would you or your media care if the nurses were not from Europe?

Not in the least. Just as you don't care since they ARE European (well, except for the Palestinian, which throws your argument for a loop).

 

And you didn't answer my question. Is being found guilty the same as being guilty?

[N.O.R.F]

Actually, they are from Bulgaria. I sense you're going on autopilot here. Are you even familiar with the case?

Hungary/Bulgaria, whatever - Europe.

 

so why does a rejection of THIS particular verdict equate a believe that African courts are less important? What has one thing got to do with the other?

Are you not rejecting the judicial system of Libya?

 

Not in the least. Just as you don't care since they ARE European (well, except for the Palestinian, which throws your argument for a loop).

European, Palestian or Somali. I haven’t seen any denials from the accused but I have heard they confessed! Oh don’t tell me they were tortured (very convenient ey :rolleyes: ). Why should I care?

 

And you didn't answer my question. Is being found guilty the same as being guilty?

When you confess to the crime yes it is!

[Cara.]

Northerner,

 

Originally posted by Northerner:

quote:Actually, they are from Bulgaria. I sense you're going on autopilot here. Are you even familiar with the case?

Hungary/Bulgaria, whatever - Europe.

I think that says volumes right there.

 

Are you not rejecting the judicial system of Libya?

I am questioning this particular verdict, because the evidence presented against the healthcare workers is flimsy, and does not establish their guilt beyond reasonable doubt. The Libyan judicial system is indeed deeply flawed and prone to manipulation by the government, but so is every judicial system to some degree or other. Courts are meant to follow due process; if they fail to do that, their verdicts should be rejected. Do you disagree with that?

 

European, Palestian or Somali. I haven’t seen any denials from the accused but I have heard they confessed! Oh don’t tell me they were tortured (very convenient ey :rolleyes: ). Why should I care?

Again, this says volumes about your peculiar mindset. If you don't care, why did you post the article? Even if you don't care that possibly innocent people are sentenced to be killed for a crime they did not commit, could you at least look beyond your petty biases and consider the repercussions for Libya? If those children were infected with HIV because of unhygienic hospital practices, will finding a handy scapegoat protect future Libyan children from the same fate?

 

When you confess to the crime yes it is!

Well, they do claim they were tortured. Do you find that farfetched in general, or is your faith in the Libyan judicial process particularly robust?

[N.O.R.F]

I think that says volumes right there.

Eastern europe is not my area of geographical expertise. Russia is the same as Serbia for all i care.

 

Courts are meant to follow due process; if they fail to do that, their verdicts should be rejected.

A confession(s) was made. What due process is required? How will the scientific evidence fair against the confession of injecting HIV blood in kids? The scientific evidence is on the hospital being already contaminated and not on the nurses 'injecting'.

 

Again, this says volumes about your peculiar mindset. If you don't care, why did you post the article? Even if you don't care that possibly innocent people are sentenced to be killed for a crime they did not commit, could you at least look beyond your petty biases and consider the repercussions for Libya?

A crime they did not commit? they have been found guilty TWICE!

 

If those children were infected with HIV because of unhygienic hospital practices, will finding a handy scapegoat protect future Libyan children from the same fate?

You seam to be ignoring the report by the Libyans. Why? Because its not accurate according to the western media? What does that say about your mindset? Volumes or apples and pears?

 

Well, they do claim they were tortured. Do you find that farfetched in general, or is your faith in the Libyan judicial process particularly robust?

Very far fetched. Do you believe it because you respect the media thats telling you this? Is your faith in your media that strong?

[Cara.]

Northerner,

 

Originally posted by Northerner:

You seam to be ignoring the report by the Libyans. Why? Because its not accurate according to the western media? What does that say about your mindset? Volumes or apples and pears?

You've said several times that I'm getting my information from biased Western media, am I to understand that you have a different media source which contradicts the information you've posted? Could you present this alternative news source?

 

So far, the facts as I'm aware of them are:

 

1. 400+ Libyan children were found to be infected with HIV in 1998.

 

2. Five Bulgarian nurses and a Palestinian doctor were charged by the Libyan gov't with deliberately infecting the children with the virus. Some of the nurses confessed to the crime, but later retracted their confessions, saying that they were tortured.

 

3. A study funded and released by the Libyan gov't concluded that the physical evidence does not rule out foul play. They didn't actually present any evidence, however, that directly implicates the accused of the crime.

 

4. Two teams of international virologists present evidence that the healthcare workers could not have introduced the HIV strain found in the children, since a) an epidemic involving this specific local strain was already underway before they arrived, and b) half of the children are co-infected with Hepatitis viruses, indicative of poor hospital infection control.

 

Are you contesting any of these points on factual grounds? Do you have access to non-western media which failed to inform you that one of the accused is Arab but which at the same time gives you reason to confidently assert that the accused are guilty of the crime?

[N.O.R.F]

I see your hanging onto the Palestian doctor, carry on,,,,,,,

[Cara.]

Well, I suppose that's a concession of sorts.