Dubai City of fake dreams.....

[raula]

^^nimependa hiyo karate style kali kabisa

[NGONGE]

Smith,

 

You didn’t answer the questions I put to you, saaxib. Shall I add one more? What was the aim of your thread? Now take your time, think clearly and post back a wholesome reply.

 

Juma,

 

The issue here is not one of what camp one cheers for, or at least that’s how I’m approaching it. I don’t care for the Arabs either way. I care for “my†people though. I’ll expand on this as this post goes on.

 

 

“Calow niicda iga daa carabi waa naagee!!â€

Someone above posted this comment. Baashi, my good sir, tell me, is this short sentence the invention of our witty brother above? Ever come across it before? All the questions you’ve asked are good (in fact deserving a thread of their own), however, on this occasion at least, I suspect that you already know the answers.

 

 

Of course, anyone willing to go to Somalia and every place Somalis live to conduct a survey on our people’s opinions on Arabs is free to do so and will be doing us all a huge service. In the meanwhile, I’ll continue basing my judgments on information from websites such as this one, word of mouth and personal encounters (as we all do). If all of this is good enough when it comes to Somali news and people’s reactions to them, it’s good enough for judging Somalis as a whole too.

 

 

Still, the issue here is not Dubai or what the people of Dubai do; the issue is one of bandwagons. All the accusations made against the Arabs are mostly true, their failures, extravagance and occasional indifference to Muslim suffering is exacerbating at times. However, none of this explains the obsession many Somalis have with the Arabs in general and the Gulf States in particular! Why for instance did we have FOUR concurrent and long threads about the Arabs on this site? What is the reason for this fixation and why the need to put them down?

 

Some people have decided to view the exchanges on these threads as those of two camps, The Arab haters against The Arab lovers! This, I suppose, is an easy mistake to make. Though I personally view it as a half-wit’s way of interpreting matters. When I read a piece on this site, I expect to understand the author’s points, motives and conclusions. I don’t want to guess or assume. I might be too much of a dreamer but I was under the impression that intelligent and rational people populated this site! So, when I read pieces that could have been written by the uninformed attendant in my local coffee shop, I can’t help but look down my nose at the whole thing.

 

Yes, you read it right. It might sound patronising and condescending and so it should be. Foolish opinions based on nothing but feeling and “Waxa la yedhi†deserve nothing less. When these empty opinions are accompanied by a sanctimonies and holier-than-thou attitude, I despair! Ignoring them from time to time might be the best option, however, it’s much better to point them out and shame our “intelligent†and “rational†brothers and sisters into revising or better elucidating their hasty judgments (I‘ve long given up on reason).

 

I really don’t expect many readers to instantly “understand†my gripe (even though I clearly explained it above). Still, maybe if I keep on repeating myself each time I see similar ill-thought threads, the sheer boredom and numbness of it all will present some with moments of clarity where they’ll finally see the errors of their ways.

 

Some good souls might advice me to stop trying to blow burst balloons, but hey, you really never know if under that heap lie a few that are still intact.

[Shirwac]

There are always haters around

[Baashi]

Ngonge, I think I understand where you are coming from and you are right some Somalis say bad thing about Arabs and more often than not their judgment is based on unsubstantiated facts. I give you that much. However, that doesn’t mean all Somalis or for that matter most Somalis hold the same view. I beg to differ. I can’t help but notice that you are making the same mistake - that is generalizing a whole people (Somalis in this case). At least that’s how you come across in your posts. I too read the said threads and I deal Somalis all the time but I don’t view them the way you do. Yes, some of them are opinionated, yes some of them don’t meet my high expectation, yes some of them are misinformed on many things but that doesn’t give me a license to make premature judgment of the character of the generic “Somaliâ€. Do that and you are as bad as the ones you are criticizing.

 

On the Arab issue that got you started in making these remarks about Somalis, it could be that some Somalis have bad experience in dealing with Arabs. Still they shouldn’t badmouth. If you could make the comments you’ve made about Somalis and justify yours on what you have read in the internet and or your experience in your daily encounters what prevents them doing the same thing to Arabs and justify theirs on their personal experience.

 

BTW, since when having opinions on particular issue became the yardstick of the character of whole people. This is forum after all and all kind of opinion are bound to appear here. You could refute them or presents facts and educate them along the way you know. All I’m trying to say here is: let’s not generalize whether the issue is about the Arabs or Somalis.

[bilan]

salaam

some people when the hear the name of arab country assume that the person must be hating them, relax people, he just talked about one country,and dubai does not represent entire arab world, he just shared what he saw in dubai. few years ago this forum some people talked about pakistanis tradition of women paying dowry and honor killing, as far as i remember no one accused them of hating pakis. and i bet if someone posted exact samething smith said but not dubai,instead malaysia, pakistan,or brunei,no one would have said anything. so if someone says something about one arab country that does not mean it applies to all arab countries or all arab people, this topic was about one muslim city, but some of you turned it into arab issue. why?

[NGONGE]

Ngonge, I think I understand where you are coming from and you are right some Somalis say bad thing about Arabs and more often than not their judgment is based on unsubstantiated facts. I give you that much. However, that doesn’t mean all Somalis or for that matter most Somalis hold the same view. I beg to differ. I can’t help but notice that you are making the same mistake - that is generalizing a whole people (Somalis in this case). At least that’s how you come across in your posts. I too read the said threads and I deal Somalis all the time but I don’t view them the way you do. Yes, some of them are opinionated, yes some of them don’t meet my high expectation, yes some of them are misinformed on many things but that doesn’t give me a license to make premature judgment of the character of the generic “Somaliâ€. Do that and you are as bad as the ones you are criticizing.

I beg to differ, saaxib. First of all, let me address the comparison with the Arab bashers! I am a Somali; I speak about my people, that I live amongst and interact with on daily bases. I don’t speak about Ethiopians or Ugandans that I have the loosest of connections with. When I criticise my people, I do so because I want the best for them. When I point out our shortcomings I point them out so we can banish them and correct are failures. I do so laden with a lifetime experience of knowing, dealing and observing my people. I don’t do it out of observations I made on a three-week holiday!

 

The judgments I make about my people, and here I speak about the average Somalis, are not made out of whim or impulse (though I’ll admit to some frustration). These judgments and opinions are made as a result of studying our situation, looking at our problems and observing the ways we deal with them and comment on them.

 

Need I remind you of where we’ve been for the past fifteen years? (I’m talking about Somalis as a whole and not the broken down versions and divisions). What are the causes of such a situation? Why does the tribal problem persist? Is it a mistrust of only big tribes? Are the clans within each tribe in harmony? Are the sub-clans within each clan on friendly terms? Are the sub-clans of each sub-clan doing better? Shall I go on to the smallest branches and the mistrust there too?

 

When you look at such a mess and think about the millions of people that makeup all these divisions, don’t you wonder what is wrong with your people? Does it not tell you something about the current Somali character?

 

Sure, there are many good individuals out there who resent this whole thing and resist being dictated to by the mob, but, as I’m sure you know, mobs are loud and their rhetoric is enchanting. As a result, they constitute the majority and theirs IS the public opinion. Now, if at home we were disparaging and spiteful against each other, would it be a great leap to conclude that this attitude would also be applied to our opinions of everyone else?

 

Of course, the Arabs (and those of the Gulf States in particular) occupy a special place in the Somali bosom. The average Somali gets to hear about them because of our vital trade with them. The bans they imposed on the purchase of Somali goods and the recent banning of Somali passports, only gave our brethren who are conditioned (see tribe comments above) to readily hate, a reason to despise the Arabs!

 

I believe that the average Somali is quicker to hate than like, quicker to disparage than praise, quicker to accuse than excuse! I don’t believe this to have always been the way. I believe our conditions, paranoia, unsatisfactory social structures and thirst for gossip are to blame (not forgetting the prevailing ignorance).

 

This was a description of average Somalis as I’ve found them, I’m happy to be corrected where people might think I’ve erred (in fact, I’ll be elated to be proven wrong). Now, let me talk about those that I’ll class to be above average. Those that managed to get some education, were fortunate enough to be exposed to other cultures, norms and attitudes (good and bad). These brothers and sisters of ours should be armed and equipped with the ability of looking from the outside in! They should be able to see the pointlessness and futility of many of our practises and paranoia! Do they though? Why when presented with the opportunities to better themselves (mentally) they still choose to follow the rabble? Even when the ignorant majority is correct (as they’re occasionally are), our “intelligent†brothers and sisters regurgitate the views of the mob with no proper analysis of their own! They ride whatever wave is coming next! This is not a case of meeting high expectations; it’s a case of meeting basic ones, saaxib. For when the educated, well off and intellectuals of a nation allow their thoughts to be ruled by the gutter dwellers (harsh I know) the nation itself ceases to exist. It merely becomes a collection of sheep leading the Shepards that, in turn, sensationalise rather than rationalise events!

[OG Moti]

Maandhow iga daa carabi waa naagee...

 

All Arab grouped together, proved they worth nothing, in this case generalization is well applied.. Substantial evidence? look around you, they are getting killed with their money, muslim under their protection are suffering and non muslims are well respected and do what they please.. From Dubia to egypt to Jordan to North Africa.. so anyone who says something about Arab, s/he is not hating, they are just stating facts.. Besides these ****** claiming they are arabs aint real arabs, real arabs are no where to find.. so the so called arabs now days, are simply humans without dignity.. sheeps so to speak...

 

Allah kariim

Peace

[Baashi]

Ngonge wrote

Need I remind you of where we’ve been for the past fifteen years? (I’m talking about Somalis as a whole and not the broken down versions and divisions). What are the causes of such a situation? Why does the tribal problem persist? Is it a mistrust of only big tribes? Are the clans within each tribe in harmony? Are the sub-clans within each clan on friendly terms? Are the sub-clans of each sub-clan doing better? Shall I go on to the smallest branches and the mistrust there too?

 

When you look at such a mess and think about the millions of people that makeup all these divisions, don’t you wonder what is wrong with your people? Does it not tell you something about the current Somali character?

Understood. You have a point there Ngonge. You've touched a soft spot... For that I have to concede!

[shyhem]

Whether its about dubai or not.I never really liked the Arabs nor do i intend to like them.They are even lucky i'm not cheering for the young marines wiping their azz.I wish i was the president of somalia.We will never have associated with the damn Arab league or the organisation for islamic countries O.IC.

 

Both have failled us miserably, and i believe it's time to have a union with the likes of Israel and America,atleast we would have been guaranted security by now.

[Haddad]

Originally posted by Shyhem:

Both have failled us miserably...

Elaborate.

[shyhem]

Which part of this planet are u from?do u see any arab or muslim country for matter comig to stabilize somalia.Oh please don't say they came with USA in 93 or do muslims go anywhere only when America goes?

 

What happened to the notion, "we all brothers and sisters" or "we are first muslims and than somalis"?There are less than 10000 armed militias in somalia creating havoc on the lives of seven million innocent somalis.All the so called muslim nations can do was contribute 500 well armed soldeirs each,backed by heavy ground and air power and boom somalia and the rest of the muslim world would have benefited.Is that a hard thing to ask from people who claim to be compasionate or better than christians and everyone else?

 

But guess what who cares about abunch of skinny azz black kids in somalia,who cares whether they are muslims or not,who cares about their future as long as the Americans are not interested.why should muslim bother about somalia,they are not somalis right?The irony is americans are not muslims and they have no obligation whatsoever to help muslims,why should americans help folks they don't share the same faith and values with? U got my drift?

[Haddad]

Originally posted by Shyhem:

do u see any arab or muslim country for matter comig to stabilize somalia.Oh please don't say they came with USA in 93 or do muslims go anywhere only when America goes?

Indeed, at least Pakistan, a Muslim country, came with USA in 93.

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

What happened to the notion, "we all brothers and sisters" or "we are first muslims and than somalis"?

What happened is lack or absence of Islamic leadership. Without Islamic leadership, no meaningful Islamic actions can be implemented.

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

There are less than 10000 armed militias in somalia...

That's not a realistic figure. Maybe yours is a typo.

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

All the so called muslim nations can do was contribute 500 well armed soldeirs each,backed by heavy ground and air power and boom somalia and the rest of the muslim world would have benefited.

Do you think they would have succeeded where the US, the sole superpower, has failed?

 

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

Is that a hard thing to ask from people who claim to be compasionate or better than christians and everyone else?

Maybe not.

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

why should muslim bother about somalia,they are not somalis right?

Other Muslims care about Somalia, it's just the care isn't reported or they don't like it to be advertised. But, sometimes you hear or read about it, like the sufferings of poor and orphaned Somalis kids because the US cut and banned Islamic aids.

 

Originally posted by Shyhem:

The irony is americans are not muslims and they have no obligation whatsoever to help muslims,why should americans help folks they don't share the same faith and values with?

Well, they help because they got ulterior motives. Don't you know nothing comes free?

[Faarax-Brawn]

Originally posted by NGONGE:

Yes, you read it right. It might sound patronising and condescending and so it should be. Foolish opinions based on nothing but feeling and “Waxa la yedhi†deserve nothing less. When these empty opinions are accompanied by a sanctimonies and holier-than-thou attitude, I despair! Ignoring them from time to time might be the best option, however, it’s much better to point them out and shame our “intelligent†and “rational†brothers and sisters into revising or better elucidating their hasty judgments (I‘ve long given up on reason).[QB]

 

 

You should take back the foolish opinion thing. I will come back to the foolishness in a minute, but let me adress one particular thing you said up there.“Waxa la yedhi†: Now lets disect this in regards to the above topic shall we?

 

Now, Tourist Smith, goes to a hot 'Newyork',a newyork that speaks a foreign language, sees(with 2 eyes mind you) about the stunning attempt at trying to imitate a culture we(they?),the towel heads call a zionist and islam haters.

He comes back to a forum, reports back about what he saw,Now i dont know what the word 'waxa la yidhi' means in arabic, but in somali it means when you actually dont see something but you hear it from a third(Nth) person.as opposed to , yap you guessed it, a MAN, Mr Smith,going to a place and seeing with his very own eyes,what he calls a 'fake city'.

 

Now you will probably come back and say, well you only picked two Words(badly used ones as such)out of the entire gibberish you wrote there. Well, sorry in advance,actualy i take that back am not sorry, because like baashi said , you generalised the entire somali population, on how they dwell on 'waxa la yidhi' and how they go on about being negative everything negative.

 

What i fail to Understand,honestly i dont even want to know why, but i wonder why you have to come day in day out and 'defend' arabia when its not even neccesary to be defended, coz honestly, theres nothing mr smith said that needed defending, all he merely did was point out how fake dubai is. How and why you are ranting about somalis A B and C, Astonishes me.

 

 

I promised to come back for the foolish statement, I will come back for it, coz i dont wannt to do it again. as you will probably say something worse.

[NGONGE]

If. You. Can’t. Understand. What. Was. Written. Above. I. Recommend. A. Short. Course. Of. Reading. Comprehension.

 

Failing. That! Some. Tranquilisers. Might. Be. In. Order!

 

 

Hope the above was clear enough for you, saaxib.

[Faarax-Brawn]

I will give you one more shot at being foolish

 

i will adress it once you do it again.

 

Maybe i need to write in Arabic