Losing her faith

[ReccomendMe]

Indhahayga miyaa mise waxaan ujeedaa some posters mentioning their adimiration for the sister. Bisinka, Waa gabar xadka kadhacdee ee Allaha soo hanuunsho. Iyada iyo wiswaaskaas kuwada jiraan . Aaamin kudara!

[Abtigiis]

Your last paragraph has some truth. But interpretation is not the only thing that is there in Islam. First, we have to agree on some core tenets. The existence of God, the acceptance of Quran as his words, and Mohammed as his prophet are the starting points. It is after this that the issue of personal interpretaion on many issues arises.

 

Adigu laakin, it seems you are not in agreement with the very critical foundations of this faith or any other religion for that matter. If you were honest enough like you were in your past life here in SOL- that is an atheist, you would have had the luxury of refuting the very existence of God and hence the whole debate would have moved to a different direction.

 

Now that you have decided to alter yourself for tactical reasons, it is difficult to get hold of what the essence of your argument is. Are you saying Islam is subject to many interpretations? Why is that a news. Don't we see it by the way it is fought out in Somalia and elsewhere. Or are you trying to say because there is no 'pure' Islam, and because we don't know which interpretation is the right one, we don't know whether the whole thing exists in the first place? Meel kale ayaad uga soo wareegtay sheekadii laga daalay ee hore ee ahayd diima oo dhan waxba kama jiraan.

 

The only difference this time is you are using a more bottom up approach, oo waxaad rabtaa inaad marka hore disprove gareysid in wax 'pure' ISlam la yidhaa jiro, so that you can go to the next conculsion oo ah 'pure christianty'na' majirto, pure judaism na majiro, hence waxba majiraan in the end. A truth which is not denied but whose premises are rationalized, in the end is prone to be doubted.

 

markaa adigu nin weyn noqo oo boodhka ha isku qarine, arintaada ka hadal. And please don't insult our intelligence further (walooow horey aad noogu sheegtay inaynaan isku garaad aheyn), and don't try to hoodwink us.

[Abtigiis]

War Gheele,

 

waan daalay oo waan iska seexane, gaalkiyo Maaddeeyba inaga sii qabta.

[Prometheus]

Abtoow, whenever you address Maaddeey, I find myself gleefully nodding in concurrence. I could have easily written the exact words. You're against lopping off limbs, you appreciate the value of music, you think apostates should be ignored, not beheaded. You surmise that Islam should be tailored to our modern needs and sentiments. You don't believe in a puritan form of Islam. You're definately not of the terrorist persuasion. Dee maxaad maantoo dhan ii xiijinaysay, caano waa ee. Laakiin nin xarshin ka yimi oo xagxagsho jecel baad tahay oo waad yara sal fududdahay, xogay naaqusinimo baad la nuux-nuuxsanaysaa, sidaa uma fogid, anaa ku idhi.

[Cawaale]

loll@sidaa uma fogid. wallee e-dacwo aa kugu socoto Sheekh.

 

PS. there is no puritan form of Islam!

[NGONGE]

Originally posted by Maaddeey:

Kan oo kale Gaal lama yiraahdo, waa Zindiiq! 'hoos ka gaal' raba in si uu moodo iney cilmiyeysantahay Diinta u dura!, been & runna isku dara, waxyaabaha muqadasaadka ahna dadka qalbigooda ka siibo, bal fiiri sida uu Tawxiidka ugu yeero 'The so called' ama uu gabadha gaalowday oo Aakhiro & Abaal marin ma jirto leh uu 'Mufakkira' & 'Intelligent' ugu yeero, Culimada oo la istikhfaafsado IWM.

 

Ngonge, maxad ku raacsantahay Zindiiqa?

Adna Zindiiq ku sheeg isna Safeeh ayuu kugu tilmaamay.

 

Waxan ku raacsanahay hadalko qoray, saaxib. Anigu sidiina ma ahe, waxa qalbiga ku yaala ma akhrisan karo oo qofka waxan ku raaca wuxuu halkan ku qora (only).

 

Rhazes, despite all your protestations, has not written anything that I can pick him on or tells me he is not a Muslim (indeed, he even confesses to be one).

 

P.S.

This business of scripts, two names and other nonsense should really stop. It is becoming very tedious and silly. Let them have ten names for all you care, as long as they're coming here with something worth reading/debating.

[Abtigiis]

Ngonge, waad qaldantahay oo waad isyeel yeelaysaa. Ninkan ilaahay ma aaminsana oo way iska cadahay. Hadaad leedahay muuna si toos ah u odhana, hada ayaan waydiinaynaa'e dhagayso.

 

Rhazes, "Ilaahay inuu jiro iyo ma aaminsan tahay?"

 

Ama kama jawaabi doono ama wuu ka warwareegi.

 

NG, adiga iyo anigu isku xer ayaan aheyn laakin ninkan ku hoos gabanaya su'aalaheena oo kale balse wax kale aaminsan yuuna kuu dhuumanin.

 

Rhazes,

 

Intaan kuu jiro waxay ku xidhan tahay inaad tawxiidka aaminsantahay iyo jiritaanka Ilaahay. Hadaad aaminsan tahay arintaas, waan isku dhow nahay oo makala fogin. Oo Alshabab iyo Maaddeey iyo mintidiintaba waan iskacelinaynaa.

 

Hadii aadan Ilaahay aaminsaneyn isku xanaaq ma nihine xanaaqa inoo kala leexi. Adiguna waxaad ka xanaaqsan thay dadkan Ilaah iyo diin ayaa jira leh; aniguna kuwa Diintii inta dadka lagu dhibayo uun ka soo qaatay ee ku mashquulay. Markaa, waan wada cadhaysanahay laakin isku cadho ma nihin.

[Maaddeey]

NGONGE, Safaaha iyo Fitnah 'fatina yaftinu fahwa fatinun' ma Muktasab baa mise Allaa bixiya? Alle safaahada ha naga bixiyo. Ninkana markuu soo galee yiri Bukhari waxba ka akhrisan meyno ilaa hadda uu gabar diinta ka tagtay u hambalyeynayo oo Tawxiidka 'so called' leeyahay, baad waxba kuma arag leedahay?

[NGONGE]

^^ "So called" what dee? Gabadha aniga ba 'pioneer' ku sheegay, maxaad igu odhan wayday NGONGOW bila diin baad tahay? Ninyaho dee nagaa daa (there is an excuse and explanation for every word he wrote there, the ones I saw at least). Hadaad wax kale ku tuhmaysid, dee daliilka la kaalay.

 

 

A&T, waad suaalo badantahay, saaxib. He already answered here:

 

Originally posted by Rhazes:

As a muslim (this might come as a suprise to the miserable miscreants who would sooner excommunicate me from Islam), I think these kind of questions do not always lead to a denouncment of religon, rather it creates a refined, reformed interpretation of religion that does not clash with our modern sensibilities. And God knows too many interpretations of Islam are at loggerheads with rudimentary ethics and human ideals.

[Abtigiis]

Ngonge, even the man himself could not have come with that much defense of his utterances. Waad u qiil samaynaysaa and for once I have to say you are not convincing here. Ninkaasi wuxuu yahay isaga iyo ilaahiisa ayaa og, laakin siduu u hadlayey nin muslim ah ma aha.

 

Hadaad adigu leedhaya gabadhu waa 'pioneer'na waxba ma dhaantid. Laakin before we say you are so and so, tell us why you think she is pioneer. Hadhow sidaa uma jeddin iyo I didn't say that ha ku meeraysan.

 

Waxa aad so quote gareeysay eed leedhay wuu ka jawaabay su'aasha waa rubbish. It has not problem as a statement, laakin it doesn't prove our doubts about him wrong.

 

Su'aashana in la is waydiiyo waxay naga caawinaysaa in qofku meeshu ka socdo la fahmo. You cannot argue about why religion needs to be reformed with an atheist who doesn't belive in religion at all. Yacni waa wareer uun sidaa hadii la yeelo.

 

Ngonge, is cadee adeer oo waxaad aaminsanthay sheeg. Anigu Maaddeey'na waa la iga shidaa, muslim'na waan ahay, Ilaahay jiritaankiisa iyo rasuulkiisana waan adeecsanahay. Sida muslimka 1 billionka ah u nool yihiin uun aan u noolaano unbaan leeyhay. Ninkani laakin afaaro kale ayuu ku jiraa'ye indhaha ha isqaban.

[NGONGE]

^^ I think the bit I qouted could not have been clearer. In fact, you should be supporting it 100%. For you were saying mor or less the exact thing on another thread. Marka, saaxib, I have no idea what personal problems you and Rhazes have, nor do I want to get caught in the middle (not yet anyway).

 

P.S.

Calling the girl a pioneer was in this first page of this thread. Go and read it in it's original context and don't do a Maaddeey.

[Maaddeey]

^^Aniga miyaa hadalada 'out of context' u qaata? cajiib.

[NGONGE]

^^ Hada kuma?

"So called" baad nago waashay lakin ila hada "So called" meel aad ka keentay i maad tusin.

[Maaddeey]

^Indho miyaan kuu ahay? orod oo raadso. hadaadan ogeyn meesha aan ka keenay ma 'out of context' baad igu accuse gareynee?. haddii sidaa ay tahay sow 'pioneer'ka kuguma qabsadeen?

[Maaddeey]

Well said, NGONGE. To say that the erosion of her faith is merely a symptom of her lack of islamic instruction is an all-too-convenient (and lazy) solution . It's possible that this Mofakkera knows the niceties of tawhed al olohiya, robobiya, and asma wa elsefat - the so-called essence of monotheism. It's possbile she studied the seerah of the prophet, from the early Meccan days to the pivotal Medinian phase, wherein most of the Shariah became a full-fledged code of conduct. Perhaps she understands Maqased El Shariah and the islamic narrative. What then?

Intaan haddeysan Zindiiqnimo ahayn wax Zindiiq ahba ma jiraan, intaasna waad garan kartaaye 'Well said, NGONGE'da uu ku billaabay baa ku indho tirtay, malaheyga.