IS THIS LIBERATION OR EXPLOITATION???

[RendezVous]

Much has been said of this thread

 

Some learned ladies who appear to refute anything I say about "the reality of life" of our modern world where being a "Muslim" you are seen as backward, not liberated and uncivilized...

 

liberated ladies with absolute freedom to arrest their husbands, more westernized, so civilized that to appear with proper clothes on them appears "uncouth"

 

My "head"..

 

Gosh see this..

 

Someone is obsessed with Western women. Or is it a fetish?

 

Naked sluts and prostitutes, alcoholic killers who can't succeed in business without using their bodies...depraved and dangerous women (prolly white and blonde to boot - ooweee). Sounds like the stuff of a pubescent boy's wet dream. Lord help us.

Flip, you're flooding the site with same-y topics! Post your articles under one and the same thread, man.

I think The Rendezvous is doing what all men in all cultures do: reducing women to sex objects. A woman is walking genitalia. Whether she's being covered up and hidden away or used to sell sports cars, a woman is first and foremost for the edification of men. The important thing is to recognize and pinpoint this constant belittlement.

 

Why does this Rendezvous person think that...

I am a simple Faarax who happens to

"preach" to my fellow Nomads of what is happening in "reality" nowadays..we see many "changez" and nobody can deny that..

 

Many of you think I have a business discussing about women all the time..Nooooooo , you are all my fellow nomads, god-fearing muslim ladies and I have the "Hobby" of just keeping in touch with all of you,I love you all..

 

Anti-ISLAM groups have the "Tendency" to infiltrate ISLAM through the women..See what Ayaan was saying about ISLAM..She has not read her ISLAM properly and goes ahead to "Blasphem" ISLAM..and our religion..

All around me,

 

I have a mum, a sister, a cousin lady and many other group of women around me who read this posts on SOL...I mean you are not alone, we have a sizeable number of ladies who are more "learned" and "Liberated" without throwing their "clothes" off..I am with them..I want them to continue reading this posts so that they can atleast adjust what has been planted in their minds that:

 

ISLAM mistreats women, Islam refuses education to their women, Muslim woman are punished to cover themselves, Muslim women have no rights so on and so forth..

Point Blank,

 

If Muslims do not let their daughters take advantage of their life as stipulated in the Holy Quraan and Hadith, the daughters who gonna be the roots of muslim societies, the daughters we will rely on to teach our kids morals, the daughters who gonna help families.

 

Then I think better we better not discuss this issues in length..No better name calling and bored illusions will ever help us..

 

There are so many sisters who are more learned than us, who know more than us, who are more liberated than us, who have much freedom than us, and still God-fearing than us, people we can depend on later as muslim leaders,

 

This are the people we genuinely know are "Liberated"..

 

The rest are just suckers are "mere" skeezers..

There are some who don't know ISLAM liberated women 1400 years ago..

 

This are the guys we are posting the thread for...Not you ..

[sheherazade]

Originally posted by Tahliil:

I truly believe some of the concepts preached in the western world are meant to confuse not to help at all.. Women are victims all over in this universe but I think they are exploited more and victimized more when they don't see and feel and understand the depth of the deceit they are in....

I was responding to the above where u suggest some Western concepts are meant to confuse women. You claim they’re more victimised as they’re unaware of their plight. I suggested the same or worse can apply to victimised women elsewhere. I made it very clear I wasn’t sweeping all other cultures with the same brush. Victimised women in the West(as you suggest) and victimised women elsewhere; that was the comparison. I asked how these women are less exploited. How can these women who have little information of the outside world analyse what they don’t know make comparisons and come to conclusions. The Western women can, the information is there for her, educated or not. We were not talking about education or knowledge but their appreciation of their reality- do they know they’re victimised or not? That was your line of thinking.

 

Yet you say:

I think it may come to you as a shock but let me enlighten you a little. A research done by three different anthropologists in Australia and UK concludes that women receive a better justice and get treated with far greater respect in some very "primitive" cultures in Africa and South America than they get in the West (1999).

 

The respect and justice women claim to receive under the west's civilized penal and justice codes and their equality and fair share concepts have long time ago be proven to be a mirage, a deceit my dear.

No it does not come as a shock that women receive better justice in SOME so-called primitive cultures. I have seen so-called less primitive cultures where women are treated with greater respect for myself. I have also seen and spent a little time amongst matriarchal societies(right here on planet earth!) but how does any of that help you or me make your point about the unaware female victims of society?

 

Still I’d like to understand why you think an unaware woman in the West is more of a victim than an unaware woman elsewhere? Doesn’t one at least have the possibility of clarity and recognition. Surely this woman would be less of a victim or is there an assumption that she will always remain unquestioning of the information available to her? That would be patronising.

 

Forget about the formalities and the cheap words daily printed on papers: Respect, Equality, Justice, Better Treatment, Human Rights Issue, Abuse (my favorite), Education, Scholars, Activists (my second favorite), Progressive, Liberal, Open-minded, Hip, With the time, Happening, Lean, Fierce, Fighters, Struggle, Feminism, Today’s Women, Vagina Monologue…coded and loaded words like that, forget them…you know…I’d simply die for the honor and respect of my Somali women…. period…forget them those mind controlling words…pure and simple game meant to confuse the narrow-minded of course…

 

This is too much to bare. Ignore all the words in the media and accept yours! Your word that you'd die for the Somali woman. Sorry, I don’t believe you. You will fail at this task that you have set yourself, how many lives do you have to lose- Somali womens' honour and respect are often under attack, Sir Die-A-Lot.

 

Your words are quite hypnotic(though u warn against this, ironically), that repetition, the listing of important issues with less important ones(to dilute all) and then a deletion of all that's in the mind. Not so easy, not so many narrow-minded(perhaps u mean gullible) women amongst us either- shock, horror.

 

P.S: It would be nice if you contributed more regularly. Fresh blood and all that. Slurp.

 

 

Someone here is obviously trapped in the illusive sense of freedom, or probably taking advantage of it, but in reality such people are the ones whose intellegence is mounted in their eyes, believing only what they see.

 

To them, I send a personal condolence to their passed away morality!

And to you they send a one-way ticket to hell. Admin xaafadiisa sii mar though. He has something for you.

[Socod_badne]

Has anyone else noticed how EVERY topic covering women's rights (the West vs muslim/3rd world) degenerates into the female body and what she wears? Very telling given these who assail against rights alloted Western women are the same self-appointed champions of muslimahs. But the first thing that springs to their minds when discussing women's right is the female body and what she wears trumping all other considerations. Duplicitous, smarmy bunch!

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by Socod_badne:

Has anyone else noticed how

EVERY

topic covering women's rights (the West vs muslim/3rd world) degenerates into the female body and what she wears? Very telling given these who assail against rights alloted Western women are the same self-appointed champions of muslimahs. But the first thing that springs to their minds when discussing women's right is the female body and what she wears trumping all other considerations. Duplicitous, smarmy bunch!

call yourself SB or whatever,..

 

First of all, I respect your ways of liberal thinking.We are in no business discussing about "female body" here as you try to imply.. here on this board.We are talking about what some people call "Liberation" and others at the same time call "Liberation"..

 

No wonder Bush calls "war against Terror" to mean war against Islam while we can see a lot of terror in the palestinian lands..This is NEVER called "War of terror"

 

Listen nomad, we are here to post items that are confusing muslims in general like telling the world "Muslim women are denied rights"..They have no rights and so on.

 

Many atimes I talked about our "genuine concern" to preaching to non-muslims and muslims alike that Islam grants women more rights than any other religion in the world...

 

Compare this with the propaganda against ISLAM where our "own" like AYAAN HIRSI have digested that idea planted in their brains that "ISLAM has no rights for women".. thereby causing ISLAM to go consume time to explain that The rights of a western woman in modern times was not granted voluntarily out of kindness to the female

 

Therefore after so much comaprison between (WESTERN read Christianity and ISLAM) both modern and old cultures, It was found that Islam was 100% better than any other religion in providing rights for women and still does.....

 

No wonder so many people have started "embracing Islam" in the whole world right from the Western world, USA/CANADA/UK and European countries..Australia and Africa Included.

Today I was praying friday prayers with some Chinese muslims...who recently embraced ISLAM

 

They are all crazy many think...they don't know about western women rights...walking almost like a nude person calling it "Freedom"

 

[-Lily-]

I don't think it is necessary to whine about how abused and lost western women are in their dresscode in order to uphold the nature of hijab and the Muslim woman. A woman who has decided to cover up for the sake of Allah does not need moral boost by looking down on non-hijabified unbelieving women or indeed Muslim women.

 

The hijab is a sacrefice that Muslim women in the West and elsewhere take up on their own account, and it's sole purpose is to please Allah. Therefore it is irrelevant how many books, shows or articles are broadcasted or published about the opression of the hijab if Muslim women continue to wear it proudly.

[Tahliil]

Sheherz:

I like your pick and choose style most of your arguments are based upon...generalizing the specifics, personalizing, ignoring the intent, translating and most of all leaving too many details out because those little extra details may put a little dent to your way of thinking...that's a good way of debating thou...good signs of future post in politics for you...lol

 

You said the question is: do those women know that they are victims, victimized???? Do they have the information; basically questioning if they have been Fed-xed the western feminist code of enlightment??

do they know they’re victimised or not? That was your line of thinking.

So now you are, directly or indirectly, whether you know it or not, insulting our parents...and saying that perhaps they are too dumb to figure out the difference between GOOD and BAD?? too ignorant to know if they are victims, more victimized, treated well or played? Unable to know If they are exploited? Lol I beg to differ and I hope our parents, yours and mine of course, are a bit more complicated than your insinuations. Because Gregor Mendel says it is all genetics...and it's really getting scary to think that way....genes.

 

P.S.

My apologies if i misunderstood and missed your point/s

[sheherazade]

^

You started this line of thinking and then u have the audacity to say to me:

 

do they know they’re victimised or not? That was your line of thinking.

 

U’re quoting my words but the whole process was instigated by you and I was digging further into it. Perhaps there isn’t far for you to dig- though a hole it is. U have still not explained why an oblivious, victimised woman in the West is more of a victim than one elsewhere.

 

You started the ‘unaware victims’ thought-process or have u forgotten?

 

I truly believe some of the concepts preached in the western world are meant to confuse not to help at all.. Women are victims all over in this universe but I think they are exploited more and victimized more when they don't see and feel and understand the depth of the deceit they are in....

 

 

I asked (sigh) why this woman was worse off than an unaware woman in some other part of the world. I was pointing out that a woman could be an unaware victim anywhere and asked u to clarify why u thought one was in a worse position than the other. I also asked..

 

How can these women who have little information of the outside world analyse what they don’t know, make comparisons and come to conclusions. The Western women can, the information is there for her, educated or not. We were not talking about education or knowledge but their appreciation of their reality- do they know they’re victimised or not? That was your line of thinking.

 

Comparisons! That was the point all along, not what each group of women could do with the information immediately available to them without outside influence. And what they could potentially do with that information- make comparisons and analyse.

 

I did not judge the non-Western woman’s ability to differentiate between good and bad. Merely that they have less info available to them, less to draw upon and analyse. I would say the same had the Western woman had little information available to her.

 

You drag in the feminist thinking in order to dismiss my view; who said anything about selling feminism to the non-West? Who said anything about the information reaching them having to be from the West alone? Your narrow-mindedness in pursuit of dragging feminism into something where it was not needed has made u make an emotive, play-ground taunt- nya, nya, u dissed the parents!!

 

Come on.

 

You started it all by saying:

 

Women are victims all over in this universe but I think they are exploited more and victimized more when they don't see and feel and understand the depth of the deceit they are in....

 

Now stand by your words and say why the above can be said about women in the West and not about non-Western women- without insulting either side's intelligence- if that is what you believe and if not why!

 

You still haven't made your point well, so analysing my technique is somewhat ambitious. Lol. Easy does it.

[Alle-ubaahne]

^^I don't understand why the Admin is keeping you here to dictate over every body with your undeserving poor reservations, laakiin, isku day inaad kasoo dhaadhicisid Admin siduu meesha adoo kale ugu soo reebi lahaa.

 

Alaha ku caafiyo, Eedo!

[Pi]

Alle-Ubaahne, let it go, dude. Some people just have a low tolerance threshold for nomadic nonsense.

[sheherazade]

Meel aad adigu joogtid, maxaa u hadhay?

 

Waa ba la gaa neefiyey for too long. Axsaantu dadka qaar ma deeqdo!

 

Haven't u got anything better to do? Other than sniff around after me? Uff. Naga durug oo sii soco....fortunately for you yr ticket won't expire.

[juba]

if this subject is sooo cliche why do pple continue to respond into the pages and even say the same things?? obviously this subject is very popular although i can't see why. :rolleyes:

 

Rendevous, u seem to really like to stress the OBVIOUS! ok we get it, women have a perfect life in Islam and it SUCKS to be a Western women, but i have a feeling u have other motives than "keeping in touch"

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by a "Pie":

...let it go, dude. Some people just have a low tolerance threshold for nomadic nonsense.

So, can you please change "Some" to "I" ...like "Some people Like myself"..

 

Originally posted by juba:

 

Rendevous,

u seem to really like to stress the OBVIOUS! ok we get it, women have a perfect life in Islam and it SUCKS to be a Western women, but i have a feeling u have other motives than "keeping in touch"

No, it doesn't SUCK to be a western woman, You can be a western woman and still on Islamic norms and ways of life..Or what do u call western anyways. . I just want to separate what some fellows call "a liberated woman" and others call the same..

 

Ever wondered why Bush calls "War on Islam" War on Terror..

 

Now everyone clearly understands that ISLAM has liberated the women to an extent dedicating a whole verse in the quraan specifically dealing with women issues, (It doesn't matter as some verses were meant for the 6th century but the idea and meaning are same for the 21st century), so that some fellows do not come up with what they call "A liberated woman" to mean ISLAM oppresses women..

 

You get my Point...Thank you all..

 

Sheh...Take it easy eedo..

[Tahliil]

Did I tell you that I don’t take sugar in my coffee any more…flavors…I flavor my coffee with something else…but If I would have taken up singing when I was young I could have all these liberated women throwing their hands in the air, in their bikinis, in wet T-shirts, the ones with big visible stuff you know being up front, and ugly ones like her you know being kept in the back while I sing my songs….jamming…rocking and rapping…

 

I'll still die the honor of my Somali women thou…multiple deaths...even on stage as I sing my hit songs one after another...regardless...they'll still keep their Hijabs on and their Bikinis stashed securely underneath...is it gain it or lose it...? A real battle huh? Have fun y'all...au revoir

 

Note to myself:

 

Never, ever, ever think of having a relationship with a woman in jeans. Simply hate it. P.O.V. &.N.P

[RendezVous]

Originally posted by Tahliil:

Note to myself:

 

Never, ever, ever think of having a relationship with a woman in jeans. Simply hate it. P.O.V. &.N.P

cajeeb?????????????? But why do u say so?