Pictures of Girl turned animal after she threw Quran

[-Serenity-]

Rahima,

 

In my experience, when a learned person/sheikh quotes a hadeeth, they mention the precise time, the circumstances under which the prophet said so and explain the context of the hadeeth. (and if it was an academic discussion, include the chain of reporters!). So YES, the hadeeth are STRAY for you have failed to accompany it with any of the above!

 

I’m not in the habit of quoting hadeeth or the Quran, for you simply cannot quote a text without providing the context or atleast having some knowledge of when it was said and under what context. I agree that some of the hadeeth are quite clear, but the ones you have quoted ARE NOT and I’m sure 90% of the people reading them have some or the other misunderstaning of either the applicability or the context! Any Muslim can benefit from reading hadeeth from al-Bukhari and Muslim, whether on his own or with others. As for studying hadeeth, the science of hadeeth deals with a vast and complex literature, a tremendous sea of information that requires a pilot to help one navigate, without which one is bound to run up on the rocks. In this context, "Whoever doesn't have a sheikh, the Devil is his sheikh, in any Islamic discipline." Without a guiding hand, the untrained reader will misunderstand many of the hadiths he reads, and these mistakes, if assimilated and left uncorrected, may pile up until he can never find his way out of them, let alone become a scholar.

 

In other words, there are benefits the ordinary Muslim can expect from personally reading hadeeth, and benefits that one cannot, unless one is both trained and uses other literature, particularly the classical commentaries that explain the hadeeth meanings and their relation to Islam as a whole. The benefits one can derive from reading al-Bukhari and Muslim are many: general knowledge of such fundamentals as the belief in Allah, the messengerhood of the Prophet scw, the Last Day and so on; as well as the general moral prescriptions of Islam to do good, avoid evil, perform the prayer, fast Ramadan, and so forth. The hadeeth collections also contain many other interesting points, such as the great rewards for acts of worship like the midmorning prayer (duha), the night vigil prayer (tahajjud), fasting on Mondays and Thursdays, giving voluntary charity, and so on. Anyone who reads these and puts them into practice in his life has an enormous return for reading hadeeth, even more so if he aims at perfecting himself by attaining the noble character traits of the Prophet scw, mentioned in hadeeth. Whoever learns and follows the prophetic example in these matters has triumphed in this world and the next. What I’m saying is reading and quoting hadeeth from Al-Bukhari and Muslim on your own at any given opportunity is not advised. From your discussions, I have noted that this is the case and you, like myself are a student of Islam and not in a position to quote hadeeth in any discussion you feel it applies.

 

You and others on this board, have a habit of decidedly quoting hadeeth and then presenting it as ‘this is it and there is nothing more or less to it’, all the while using a patronising tone of 'its clear' and 'obvious' and 'I cant make you understand more'. I find this approach dangerous and quite misleading. Those hadeeths make no sense, unless you substantiate them with a context and an explanation. Also, unless you’re claiming to have learned the hadeeth science and Islam in an academic context, I don’t think you should be presenting hadeeths here and there to support an argument that’s completely unrelated. This is commonsense! While I believe your intentions are good, I have seen your arrogance take over sometimes. It would also be of some benefit, if you included links in your quotes so people can further look into it (and check your source if it’s the internet for various sites are purposely misleading albeit genuine looking to some1 who doesn’t really have the Islamic text or some1 to verify it otherwise). Otherwise, Illahay qofna kama xigtid, and I don’t have to believe what you write.

 

Allah swt is a loving God and he forgives and doesn’t punish his people unnecessarily. The Quran is full of examples of the power God possesses and ill-fate that has befallen those who have gone stray. So there is nothing new here and nothing related to this discussion.

 

Furthermore, it was you who questioned the hadeeth I posted with:

 

quote:

 

Are you sure deformity referred to transformation into animals Rahima? Cuz I thought it meant deformation in physical features due to illness and other genetic and natural defects.

 

So I elaborated and gave more specific hadiths and proof from the Quran! Nothing more dear .

 

In future perhaps you should be following the sequence of the posts more closely- it would make more sense

See my sister, when I questioned that hadeeth, you didn’t explain it and you went on to gimme more stray hadeeth (and then even retracted one as you couldnt elucidate it nor verify the authenticity). This comes across as deflecting my question and bombarding me with a lot of hadeeth that are STRAY and not interconnected. A person of cilm would easily support the above statement and provide details of the same hadeeth and then only substantiate it with further hadeeth. I personally found your quotes out of context. I simply dont have the time to find the context at the moment but since its you who quotes them, this should be your exercise

 

I’m not in anyway trying to discredit you. This has been a good exercise for me for I had to once again go and re-read the science of hadeeth and other related articles.(some of which have been quoted but not referenced).

 

p.s. Just incase the word stray was misunderstood... I meant random, not stray as in out of the scope of Islam.

[Rahima]

Not that he cant do it. But you understood it as that I denied Allahs ability to do it. So you dig into the Hadiths to prove wrong what you think I meant, but what I havent meant.

No that is not how I understood it, I got you perfectly, because you once again state

 

I have talked about this with people recently as it was the hottest topic of the last week. The punishment of deformity by Allah wouldnt be as drastic as to change one into an animal.

I was responding to your point concerning that Allah does not (note: not cannot) people into animals. If I was responding to any doubts you may have over the power of Allah I would be quoting hadiths regarding the powers of Allah , but as you can see I was very specific with my quotes in that they were referring to the point you do not accept that Allah turns people into animals.

 

Anyway like I said to kaleida and as I’ll respond to her also, the other hadiths are clear cut, perhaps they shed better light on the situation.

 

As for my attitude, whilst in all honesty I didn’t mean it out of arrogance (I re-read my response to you and perhaps I see things differently, but no arrogance attached walaahi ) inshallah I shall keep this in mind. Likewise allow me to throw some advice your way-keep your emotions in check and be very careful about what you say about diinta .

 

In my experience, when a learned person/sheikh quotes a hadeeth, they mention the precise time, the circumstances under which the prophet said so and explain the context of the hadeeth. (and if it was an academic discussion, include the chain of reporters!). So YES, the hadeeth are STRAY for you have failed to accompany it with any of the above!

This is not a scholarly report sister ; it is a discussion in a forum. If you wanted to verify it, all you had to do was a google search (which I always do if I want to verify a hadith I have never heard and even if possible search for it in authentic books) even if someone is too lazy to reference in detail because at the end of the day it is your religion.

 

I agree that some of the hadeeth are quite clear, but the ones you have quoted ARE NOT and I’m sure 90% of the people reading them have some or the other misunderstaning of either the applicability or the context!

Ok, so the question was, does Allah turn people into animals? Is this the part you question :confused: ? I’m not exactly sure as to where your argument is directed, are you disagreeing with the point that Allah does in fact turn people into animals or just the fact that I did not referenced my sources? You don’t have to accept anything anyone writes (because I sure as hell don’t) and likewise I don’t believe the issue of hadith status and classification is in doubt, but just for ease of mind, allow me to provide you with the links-perhaps this will clarify any other issues you may have for according to your last post no one was denying this and I was trying to convince others of this hoax (both as I highlighted you were wrong about)!

 

All in all girlfriend this is a point of no contest. I provided hadiths, if you want the chain of narrations, I don’t think SOL is the place to go off posting names, all we need to know is that the hadiths are Saheeh, that they are in Bukhari and Muslims hence there is no question upon their validity (we don’t need to bother ourselves with chain of narrators like I said Bukhari and Muslim). Furthermore, both Bukhari and Muslim are available in most Islamic book stores, if the net is not sufficient you could always buy them As for the context, although to me they seem pretty clear and it isn’t one hadith or are there others stating otherwise, I have provided the links. Any more than this, you need to question the culamaa’. I did not post my opinion, rather what Allah and His prophet stated-I’m sure that is not a point to be tense over . Differences of opinion according to some arise on almost all issues, we need to assess what can and cannot come under this banner-if we pay too much attention to differences of opinion then even the five prayers come under scrutiny, all points/sources posted are those in accordance with Ahlus-sunnah wal jamaaca.

[Rahima]

Say (O Muhammad to the people of the Scripture): "Shall I inform you of something worse than that, regarding the recompense from Allah: those (Jews) who incurred the Curse of Allah and His Wrath, those of whom (some) He transformed into monkeys and swines, those who worshipped Taghut (false deities); such are worse in rank (on the Day of Resurrection in the Hellfire), and far more astray from the Right Path."

 

Surah Al-Maidah Ayah 60

In context, the full surah http://quranicfinder.com/index.php?translator=muhsinkhan&surah=5

 

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "A group of Israelites were lost. Nobody knows what they did. But I do not see them except that they were cursed and changed into rats, for if you put the milk of a she-camel in front of a rat, it will not drink it, but if the milk of a sheep is put in front of it, it will drink it." I told this to Ka'b who asked me, "Did you hear it from the Prophet?" I said, "Yes." Ka'b asked me the same question several times; I said to Ka'b. "Do I read the Torah? (i.e. I tell you this from the Prophet.)"

 

Bukhari

http://www.islam.us/hadith/bukhari/054.sbt.html

 

Abu Sa'id reported that an Arab of the desert came to God's Messenger1 and said: I live in a low land abounding in lizards, and these are the common diet of my family, but he (the Holy Prophet) did not make any reply. We said to him: Repeat it (your problem) and so he repeated it, but he did not make any reply. (It was repeated thrice ) Then God's Messenger1 called him out at the third time saying: O man of the desert, verily God cursed or showed wrath to a tribe of Bani Isra'il and distorted them to beasts which move on the earth. I do not know, perhaps this (lizard) may be one of them. So I do not eat it, nor do I prohibit the eating of it.

 

Muslim

http://www.isna.net/library/hadith/muslim/021_smt.html

 

NOTE: Even if someone were to argue that all the other proofs do not mean literal physical transformation, the two above hadith are clear unambigious proofs that the transformation can be physical, hence Allah does turn people into animals for their transgressions.

 

Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari:

that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. And there will be some people who will stay near the side of a mountain and in the evening their shepherd will come to them with their sheep and ask them for something, but they will say to him, 'Return to us tomorrow.' Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection."

 

Bukhari

http://www.ummah.net/Al_adaab/hadith/bukhari/had69.html

Narrated Abu Amir or Abu Malik:

AbdurRahman ibn Ghanam al-Ash'ari said: Abu Amir or Abu Malik told me--I swear by Allah another oath that he did not believe me that he heard the Apostle of Allah say: There will be among my community people who will make lawful (the use of) khazz and silk. Some of them will be transformed into apes and swine.

 

Abu Dawud

http://www.2muslims.com/Quran_and_Hadith/hadith/abu_dawud/032.sat.html

[Curly]

I think the whole thing was a hoax but I was quite surprised at how some people think that Allah is not capable of turning people into animals.

 

A major example of this is in Surah 7. Al-A'raf

ayaat 166. Allah says regarding the Jews...

 

"So when they exceeded the limits of what they were prohibited, We said to them: be you monkeys, despised and rejects"

 

My mum translated that into they were actually turned into monkeys.

[-Serenity-]

Rahima,

 

It seems to me like you’ve completely ignored the underlying message in my earlier reply. You’ve also mastered the art of selective response.

 

I’ll quote myself earlier

 

In other words, there are benefits the ordinary Muslim can expect from personally reading hadeeth, and benefits that he cannot, unless he is both trained and uses other literature, particularly the classical commentaries that explain the hadeeth meanings and their relation to Islam as a whole

My post was not about the authenticity of Bukhari and Muslim or even if Allah swt could turn people into animals, but who should quote hadeeth. Simple. I see from the way you post, that you do not qualify! I felt the hadeeth you quoted needed to be put in a context to make sense or make your point clearer as it was said in a specific time to a specific person (this does not mean it cant apply for all times, but it just means that the accompanying circumstances form a important part in relaying the point) . If you cant explain and expand on a hadeeth, I sincerely blv you shouldnt be quoting it as you only muddy the waters further. Infact, looking at the string of hadeeth you linked me to… no person without sound knowledge will make a head or tail of them! A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

 

Ok, so the question was, does Allah turn people into animals?

No. I never asked this question. Perhaps ur confusing me with Sky.

 

Rahima, I say what I’ve to say and I leave it at that. I don’t like going on and on about the same point as I easily reach saturation point with any topic. So re-read the 1st post on this page again, reflect and be careful about quoting hadeeth if you're not learned in the science of quoting hadeeth and making sense of them. This is our religion and its not about proving your point by hook or by crook.

 

p.s. I have made some general points, but I blv they serve the overall purpose of my argument.

[Cawaale]

salaam alaikom

since " dayniile.com" posted this thread i had this feelin dat dis pic is ** fake.. u kno this world is full of photoshop stuff.. now now take a lok f this pix.. blz

hmm Guys how about this pix... i can tell wat ever u see n this network.s not reall..

bay de way.. u can find this pix on the site wich posted it .. n now they r sayin it's fake. 4 more info.. go to ;-

al-niileyn

bay de way.. bro haddad was tottaly ryt.. .. n the quran doesn't need 4 maricule 2 happen.. cozz the quran is mircule it's self..

------------

allah a3lam

[NGONGE]

Miracle lovers can check out this website:

 

Knock yourself out

 

 

I’ve recently stopped passing my e-mail address to first time acquaintances for fear of receiving such nonsense. In the past, I used to receive an endless number of e-mails with the title “please do not delete - See the miracles of Islamâ€. Out of curiosity, I’d, almost always, open the e-mail and eagerly try to view its content. What do I find? Pictures!

 

We’re in an age where people want to see everything in order to believe. Even the most dogmatic of people, the ones that KNOW they are right and would tolerate no argument when it comes to the way they apply and practise their faith! They that forbid the use of cameras and photos; even they would join in this madness and start sending e-mails containing pictures of deformed cucumbers (with the deformity approaching, but not really matching, the name of the almighty!)! The rigidity knows no bounds. When told that Allah is everywhere, they set out to find him (and find they indeed do). They see the name of the almighty in vanishing clouds, in soon to be rotten melons, on the wool of sheep, on birth marks, on cracks on walls, on weather maps, on anything and everything that is out of the ordinary!

 

Some gobble up such media out of a mistaken sense of duty (and in the hope of getting closer to god), while the majority of others do it out of guilt! Once upon a time, the popular belief was that even if you can’t see god, HE subhanahu wa ta’aala, Can see you! Now, with the help of some fanatical brothers and a bit of technology, we (far be it from being true) can see HIM! Hey akhi, don’t go forgetting your prayers, you’ll be punished, here have a look at this photo of a tomato if you don’t believe that Allah is everywhere! Hey sister, where is your hijab? Have you not seen the name of the prophet on plant Mars?

 

Does one really need such pictures, questionable stories and guilt-ridden tales in order to believe in the oneness of the almighty?

 

Even if this photo were true, what difference would it have made to you? Did we not believe before the photo? Were we not Muslims? Surely one couldn’t even argue that it would have strengthened our faith, for a weak faith is likely to be one concerned with slack devotion and waywardness rather than the questioning of the power of the creator!

 

Still, in this age of speed, a take-away is the norm, not only in food but life in general, and now, even in faith! A picture paints a thousand words, they say. Therefore, why should one contemplate! (I recently received an SMS du’aa!).

 

 

I would imagine that some of the thoughts that first crossed the minds of most people when they saw that photo was “is this true? Where does she live? Why is it not in the news? Why has this never happened before? Why did I never hear of such things taking place during my lifetime or that of my parents and their parents?â€

 

 

Most of the questions above would only lead to more questions about circumstances, situations, precedents and proofs! When awe finally arrives, it laughably and easily can be wiped away by the confirmation that this photo was, after all, a fake! Once one receives one too many of these ‘false’ miracles, god only knows what the state of one’s faith would resemble (my guess would be a squiggly cloud)!

 

Those searching for miracles already know where to find them..

 

PS

 

Waxa la yedhi, gabadh ayaa...........

 

 

[Rahima]

Kaleida,

 

You’re doing it again dear-going on about non-issues. First your points were specific, which I addressed and then you generalized which warranted my response.

 

Whilst each of us is entitled to our opinions, allow me to direct you towards a small matter in the hadeeths quoted. Some as you will note speak of specific incidences in the past, however there are others where Rasuallah explicitly states that there will come a time (given with stipulations) where such a calamity will once again occur-hence the argument of restrictions to specific times is fallacious (for this discussion anyway).

 

Perhaps if you came down from the high horse of deciding who and who cannot quote from our nabi scw, you would notice that your points are of almost next to no relevance for this discussion (unless of course you are referring to other threads which I sense you are). If you want to make an analysis of the intentions, actions and ways of Rahima, do so for it is not like I can stop you, but make that the topic and not the hadiths I posted. These hadiths, like I’ve said are clear and do not have others which contradict. The context is provided for some, if you were interested in a historical review of them, like you said no person is closer to Allah and this religion than another-go and find it! Perhaps we don’t have the time to go off stating every single person in the chain or even the whole story behind it, but the status of the hadith has already been established and the actual matn is explanatory. If it is not clear to you, certainly criticizing an individual is not a way to question and if you feel that there is no other way, this is your religion and your responsibility. Don’t expect others to spoon feed you, like I said take the initiative and search before you go off accusing others. This is a discussion forum dear, we are Muslims hence I know when an individual quotes from Bukhari and Muslim, there is no cloud over the hadith (and If I doubt it, all I have to do is get my Bukhari and Muslim out-if you don’t have it get it for clearly it is an issue). As for understanding (whilst I do agree some hadiths if not put into context can be misleading) these are like I said perhaps for the billionth time clear! These are not issues of intricacy.

 

If you believe that I was doing injustice by quoting these hadiths and in fact the meaning is not apparent, why don’t you address that instead of going on about non-issues. Provide your proof which states otherwise, this is the way you address issues, because going by your opinions, we laywomen and men cannot discuss Islam for God forbid we don’t quote the isnad or complete historical context of the hadith. We are here to learn from one another, if any person questions anything quoted by another user, the solution is simple, SEARCH. Like I said, this is your religion, your responsibility, don’t loose your head because someone did not according to you sufficiently give you the whole context

 

As for my art of selective response, it comes in handy sister when you can see that there is no point to it

[Haddad]

I wonder why Dayniile hasn't yet retracted the story.

[Muhammad]

the story even made it to Sky news, but this one is said to be in India:

 

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30200-13313217,00.html

 

 

interesting time we live in, when people seek 'signs' inorder to strengthen their faith - it is a sign of the weakness of imaan.

 

Allah knows best!

[sahal]

interesting time we live in, when people seek 'signs' inorder to strengthen their faith - it is a sign of the weakness of imaan.

Very True

[-Serenity-]

LOL @ Rahima. That last reply was seriously disappointing. Its not the 1st time I've come across an amateur-hadeeth-waver and I reckon it wont be the last... but hey,

 

Summary:

 

Kale: Don’t quote hadeeth if you cant explain the context. Except for one, all the rest of the hadeeth quoted is ambigious.

 

Rahima: I’ll quote random hadeeth as I see fit. Its your job to find the context if you don’t blv or understand it.

 

Kale: Since you brought it on...share the knowledge. Its better way to have an islamic discourse.

 

[amatillah]

the whole is story is a hoax.belive it or not.you r right NGONGE.same thing is happening with me over here .now i have to think twice b4 i forward any email to friends.

 

the story even made it to Sky news, but this one is said to be in India:

funny is that.so it means, it have been decorated with all types.it is a sign of the weakness of imaan really.if it's not a sign of the day of judgment.what a interesting time we live in with "Miracle lovers" as NGONGE mentioned.

[Rahima]

Kaleida,

 

You’re still going on about irrelevant issues I see! Like I said dear, be specific and come up with an issue of substance then perhaps we can have a productive discussion instead of this embarrassing exchange which you somehow seem to be relishing. I posed an issue to you, and instead of addressing that all you seem to be preoccupied with is play-ground teasing. Under a more joyous circumstance I’d be more than happy to , but this is disheartening to say the least.

 

You can’t be complaining about nothing. Is not that hadith (which you finally conveniently admit is within context) sufficient, or even the ayah? Could it be you just don’t get it (It makes perfect sense to me honey ) or just wanting to argue for the sake of an argument. Me is thinking it is the latter (very obvious) so with that i'll leave it and return to my exam preperation .

[-Serenity-]

Rahima, suck it up. I’m bored of your repetitive and meaningless posts. The discussion has ceased to be meaningful. I have said everything I wanted to say in my 1st post. I don’t need to continue this because unlike you, I actually have better things to occupy my time with than a nonsensical argument.

 

You went and searched for a hadith to justify something ridiculous. Found some irrelevant hadiths, some unauthentic ones and some ambiguous ones. Since they clear to you, you might want to explain then, ok?. But, for my own part, it was Greek to me.

 

Lets leave the snide remarks there and get back to the hadith, shall we?

 

Here goes…

 

3. Rasûlullâh sallallâhu ‘alayhi wa sallam said that at such a time, expect the following punishments: a red hurricane will come and some people will be drawn into the ground. Stones will rain down from the skies. The appearance of people will be transformed, i.e. they will be turned into pigs and dogs. Many other calamities will follow one after the other in quick succession just as when a string of beads breaks up and the beads begin falling off in quick succession.

I asked you politely to explain this hadith since you brought it on ….

 

You reply,

 

As for the third, inshallah i shall try to find the exact source. I remember studying it years ago, i just googled to find it based on my recollection. I'll get back to you as soon as i can

 

 

As for people being trasnformed at the time of Rasuallah i do not know, but like i said Bukhari and Muslim are as about authentic as the hadiths get.

1. You never explained or went back to it.

2. Evidently from your OWN statement, you didn’t know about the issue, YET just to win the argument, you give us more ambiguous hadith to justify that same point you admitted to NOT KNOWING.

 

Then you gimme this Surah which is the only explicitly clear one and it specifically refers to a certain time in history:

 

Say (O Muhammad to the people of the Scripture): "Shall I inform you of something worse than that, regarding the recompense from Allah: those (Jews) who incurred the Curse of Allah and His Wrath, those of whom (some) He transformed into monkeys and swines, those who worshipped Taghut (false deities); such are worse in rank (on the Day of Resurrection in the Hellfire), and far more astray from the Right Path

And then:

 

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "A group of Israelites were lost. Nobody knows what they did. But I do not see them except that they were cursed and changed into rats, for if you put the milk of a she-camel in front of a rat, it will not drink it, but if the milk of a sheep is put in front of it, it will drink it." I told this to Ka'b who asked me, "Did you hear it from the Prophet?" I said, "Yes." Ka'b asked me the same question several times; I said to Ka'b. "Do I read the Torah? (i.e. I tell you this from the Prophet.)"

 

Bukhari

This hadith conflicts with the above verse for the jews in the Sura were turned into monkey and swines(pigs NOT rats) and then the hadith says Rats. The hadith was posted NEXT TO THE verse, yet seems to contractict it. And this my dear, constitutes MIS-QUOTING and MISUNDERSTANDING in my books! This is why THE CONTEXT is important. Something I subtlety tried to tell you in my 1st post…. !

 

Also the hadith seems illogical in context: The prophet scw says he DOESN’T KNOW what the jews did and HE DOESN’T SEE THEM but he is SURE they were changed into rats? HOW? And the rest of the stuff about milk and rats…. Not a clue here!

 

 

Like I said to you Rahima, there are benefits one can gain from reading the hadith on their own… but you cant understand it all unless you not only speak the language and understand Arabic (which I assume you don’t), but read other literature concerning hadith and preferably have a teacher. Hadith complements the Quran, not the other way around. And every sura was revealed at a certain time and the hadith must also be time lined. And as authentic as Al bukhari and Muslim are, they still not 100% accurate or infallible like the Quran.

 

Again this hadith is even more unclear!

 

Abu Sa'id reported that an Arab of the desert came to God's Messenger1 and said: I live in a low land abounding in lizards, and these are the common diet of my family, but he (the Holy Prophet) did not make any reply. We said to him: Repeat it (your problem) and so he repeated it, but he did not make any reply. (It was repeated thrice ) Then God's Messenger1 called him out at the third time saying: O man of the desert, verily God cursed or showed wrath to a tribe of Bani Isra'il and distorted them to beasts which move on the earth. I do not know, perhaps this (lizard) may be one of them. So I do not eat it, nor do I prohibit the eating of it.

 

Muslim

This hadith conflicts with the verse in the Sura AGAIN for it says beasts. Also, does this mean the fact that they were turned into lizards is clear and the specific lizards have no identifying ways or whether they turned at all is unclear? Does it refer to the same time as the Sura?

 

Am I the only one who feels these hadith do an injustice to the prophet scw when put here like Rahima did?

 

And more:

 

Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari:

that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. And there will be some people who will stay near the side of a mountain and in the evening their shepherd will come to them with their sheep and ask them for something, but they will say to him, 'Return to us tomorrow.' Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection."

 

Bukhari

I personally do not follow this entire hadith. The 1st part seems general, while the second part specific. Care to elaborate?

 

Lastly,

 

Narrated Abu Amir or Abu Malik:

AbdurRahman ibn Ghanam al-Ash'ari said: Abu Amir or Abu Malik told me--I swear by Allah another oath that he did not believe me that he heard the Apostle of Allah say: There will be among my community people who will make lawful (the use of) khazz and silk. Some of them will be transformed into apes and swine.

 

Abu Dawud

This isn’t authentic, so no need to go into it. The authentic ones are ambiguous enough.

 

Final note, NONE of these hadith prove anything. No1 questioned IF Allah swt could turn people into animals for that’s a ludicrous thing to say. There have been instances were whole tribes were cursed – im sure every muslim who reads the Quran is aware of this. Since then, there have been no reported and proven instances of this happening (unless you have prove of this as I haven’t heard!).

 

I think its rude and quite disrespectful the way you address people in religious matters Rahima and quite contradictory to Islamic mannerism. All I asked was for you to clarify the hadith that you brought forth and you started to foam at the mouth instead and ask me to get the books! Either you know and you’re willing to share dear, or you don’t and in which case you aught to put a sock in it.

 

Like you said, this is turning into a "humiliation session", so turn this around and dont adress me, exclusively address the hadith!