Australia's big Mufti calls uncovered women uncovered meat . Outrage follows!

[Khalaf]

Originally posted by Valenteenah:

 

Most of you live in the West. You probably interact with women who don't wear a hijab through work or school, or you sit next to them on trains or you buy stuff from them in the shops.

 

If you get aroused at every turn or if you can't control urselves, then why don't we see more of you chasing 'uncovered' women around town with your weenies? Eh?

 

Ridiculous and illogical, is all I can say. [/QB]

Because we are not those whom the Quran describes as "those whose hearts there is a disease". But there are sick dudes that is why Allah has prescribed hijab for both men and women. Preventive measures. Agree with it or not, that is what the religion teaches.

[Paragon]

If you get aroused at every turn or if you can't control urselves, then why don't we see more of you chasing 'uncovered' women around town with your weenies? Eh?

 

Ridiculous and illogical, is all I can say.

Val, you must be a man to come to such conclusion. Judging with logic that which hasn't been felt (cannot be felt) or experianced by you, seems to go against the appropriate use of logic, don't you think? Isn't it abit too much to dictate to men (as opposed to their natural disposition), how they should at first feel when they see half-clothed women, and secondly, how they should control their reactions?

[Captain Xalane]

Originally posted by Khalaf:

[because we are not those whom the Quran describes as those whose hearts there is a disease. But there are sick dudes that is why Allah has prescribed hijab for both men and women. Preventive measures. Agree with it or not, that is what the religion teaches.

Khalaf ,heedhe now its u who misunderstood adeer.Gabadha is asking about the reactions sxb,how u react to them 'uncovered women' since in one way or the other,u would have to interact with them.

This is gonna land me in to trouble,i already can see an incoming fire.

[Khalaf]

Originally posted by Lieutenant Xalane:

Khalaf ,heedhe now its u who misunderstood adeer.Gabadha is asking about the reactions sxb,how u react to them 'uncovered women' since in one way or the other,u would have to interact with them.

This is gonna land me in to trouble,i already can see an incoming fire.

[/QB]

What I am talking about is society and solving its problems-in this case sexual violence against women. Islam unlike christianity believes ppl are inherently good, and it is satan that deceives them. To protect against satan Allah has told us what rules to follow. Its natural ninyahow to be excited by women-men were created weak nooh. That is why Allah has said the women should cover themselves, we should lower our gaze, women shouldnt travel alone, not be alone with women, and we should marry early, ect. This solves problems.

 

 

Um out. Good day my ppl.

[RendezVous]

..................

 

Some nomads are so obssessed with mis-translation of articles their own ways..a need to "express their hatred for anything close to Islam"..If these are muslims..what about the Non-muslims..

 

No wonder the whole world has a problem with Islam "NOW"..

 

The Mufti was just trying to say...Be modest and Fear your Lord(God)..God doesn't like people who are nude or semi-nude..The way "wannabees" like to dress(which is moving them away from their creator anywayz)..God wants his servants(people) to dress modest (like muslims), Man/Woman, I guess..Being Modest will reduce the chances of getting attraction from Men/Women...which in turn will help reduce Rape and Gang-Bang...Both Women/Men(Muslims and Non-Muslims)..Period

 

Real Facts...

 

I remember one young somali lady(a refugee in Kenya) gang-raped in the streets of Nairobi sometime back in 98' after clubbing the whole night in Florida2000..albeit, dressed semi-naked(was she a prostitute)..?????

 

 

& Then More freedom turns to Rape.........

 

Originally posted by Khalaf:

quote:

 

Rape Charts prove 59% of rapes go unreported. America has the largest cases of rape(In the world) not Saudi Arabia:

 

Somewhere in America, a woman is raped every 2 minutes, according to the U.S. Department of Justice, this is result of their immoral culture. Aids is least spread in Islamic countries Alhamdulillah, Somalia Included....

 

And this is in America which has law enforcement, judicial system, resources, what about the countries who have none of this in place? Do you think it would be safe for women to walk the streets in mini-skirt? No that is why hijabed is prescribed, mahram, islamic guidelines which protects the women.

Some serious Quotes

 

Originally posted by Paragon:

Beyond what the sheikh has said, do we dispute the fact that a half-clothed woman doesn't arouse a man?

All men in the world agree that a semi-naked woman will arouse them with all factors being constant..

 

Originally posted by AAliyah416:

The shiekh might have went a bit too far, but to think about it , if we women wear tight clothing or mini skirts what do we expect??

 

Molestation..Rape..Gang-bang..and even filth

 

Originally posted by Cara:

A woman is safer in a miniskirt in New York City than she would be in a burka in Cairo.

Is that what they "taught" you..I am in arabia..and there was no a single rape reported in my place..

 

Originally posted by Khalaf:

Cara

 

Originally posted by Valenteenah

It's sad for Muslim society that learned men have become advocates for rapists and adulterers. ]

Ahura I think you are misunderstanding. All the Imam said was these women who uncover and show their bodies do attract negative attention. Just look at when a woman with revealing clothing walks by men look at her back and front and compare it to the reaction a covered women gets no one looks at her sexually.

Those were just "similitude" of words...Not real meat

[Captain Xalane]

Originally posted by Khalaf:

quote:Originally posted by Lieutenant Xalane:

Khalaf ,heedhe now its u who misunderstood adeer.Gabadha is asking about the reactions sxb,how u react to them 'uncovered women' since in one way or the other,u would have to interact with them.

This is gonna land me in to trouble,i already can see an incoming fire.

What I am talking about is society and solving its problems-in this case sexual violence against women. Islam unlike christianity believes ppl are inherently good, and it is satan that deceives them. To protect against satan Allah has told us what rules to follow. Its natural ninyahow to be excited by women-men were created weak nooh. That is why Allah has said the women should cover themselves, we should lower our gaze, women shouldnt travel alone, not be alone with women, and we should marry early, ect. This solves problems.

 

 

Um out. Good day my ppl. [/QB]

Abtiyow kheyr Allah hakusiiyo.Runbaad kasheegtey arinta tani laakin gabdhahayaga garina magasho mana kabaxdo ee waxbo yeesan nadaalinin.

[SOO MAAL]

Media blamed for Islam bias

Jeremy Roberts

October 27, 2006

AUSTRALIAN Federal Police Commissioner Mick Keelty believes the media is fuelling a growing bias against Islamic Australians, warning that increased vilification of Muslims is fomenting home-grown terrorism.

In a speech delivered in Adelaide, Mr Keelty played down Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali's inflammatory comments on women, asserting that "many in the community also say offensive things and many of them are white Caucasian Australians".

 

He said rising vilification of Muslims was being fuelled by irresponsible media outlets which sensationalised terrorism-related stories with little basis in fact. And he called on Australians to teach the values of democracy and multiculturalism to the younger generation so that "our future is not worse than our past".

 

Mr Keelty - who clashed with Foreign Minister Alexander Downer in 2004 after the commissioner blamed the suicide attacks on Madrid train system on the war in Iraq - said he met privately with Muslim groups in Adelaide yesterday.

 

"You hear more and more stories of treatment of the Islamic community that really is substandard by members of our own wider community," he said at a lunch hosted by the South Australian Press Club. "It is vilification, picking them out of the crowd because they dress differently or they speak differently.

 

"If we are not careful we risk raising a generation of Australians who will have a bias against Islam."

 

He said to avoid terrorism, the country must not marginalise people. "We don't want to provide them with more reasons to be further marginalised or disenfranchised to the point where they will take their own life in order to kill many others."

 

Mr Keelty's comments differ in emphasis to John Howard's singling out in September of a minority of Australian Muslims. He said a "small section of the Islamic population (was) very resistant to integration".

 

A spokesman for Mr Howard said the Prime Minister would not comment on Mr Keelty's speech.

 

But Parliamentary Secretary for Immigration Andrew Robb said it was the terrorists who were to blame for increased "anxiety in the community".

 

And he said the onus was on Muslims to put the rest of the community at ease. "The actions and the statements of the terrorists is leading to stigmatisation of Muslims in Australia," Mr Robb said. "To minimise the anxiety in the community Australian Muslims have to accept they face a problem with Islamic terrorism - a problem which is not of their making but a problem nonetheless.

 

"But they are best placed to do something about it, by denouncing it and by asserting their Australian-ness and being confident in all of that."

 

Mr Robb has proposed a tougher test for people seeking citizenship, including an English test and knowledge of some elements of Australian history and society. Speaking about "partnerships" with different communities, Mr Keelty appeared to take exception to yesterday's front page report in The Australian on Sheik Hilali. "The other partnership which is important - and if you have seen The Australian newspaper today you would understand why - is with the Islamic community," he said.

 

Later saying the story was "balanced" by female Muslim input, he said Muslim vilification was fuelled by a sensationalist media. But he said the solution to the risk of bias against Muslims was a return to "teaching the values to the future generations that we were brought up with".

 

"One of our great strengths as a community is that we do have a very open democratic system in this country ... one of the strengths of this country is multiculturalism."

[SOO MAAL]

 

Is One Offensive Cleric More Important Than 38 Reasonable Ones?

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Why do so many reasonable Islamic scholars get such little attention in the news media when compared to the relatively few offensive ones?

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

By Firas Ahmad, October 27, 2006

 

 

 

On October 12th of this month, 38 highly respected and theologically diverse clerics from the Muslim world wrote what is widely considered a respectful and engaging "Open Letter" to the Pope in response to his controversial comments about Islam made during his Regensburg address in September. Not only was the letter of historical significance, but it also represented an articulate and reasoned invitation to dialogue from Muslims with the Papacy on matters of theology and faith. The signatories included top scholars from Bosnia, Croatia, Egypt, the United States, the United Kingdom, Jordan, Kosovo, Oman, Russia, Turkey, Uzbekistan and Iran.

 

Around the same time, a single Muslim cleric in Australia, Sheik Taj Aldin al-Hilali, delivered a sermon to about 500 followers where he allegedly compared some women who do not dress modestly to uncovered meat being left out for a cat.

 

I wonder which story received more news coverage.

 

If we follow the Google news aggregator as a gauge, at the height of the news coverage of the Open Letter to the Pope, the story appeared in about 220 different news sites across the world. The only major English language news web site to carry the story on the front page was BBC. Most notably, the major US media outlets almost entirely ignored the event. With the exception of a front page story that week in the Christian Science Monitor and a small story aired on CNN, the letter came and went without much fanfare.

 

As the fury over Hilali's remarks continue to gain momentum, according to Google there are currently over 800 news services carrying the story. That is quadruple the coverage of the Open Letter. I would expect this to increase before it subsides. The cleric's remarks are drawing furious reactions from around the globe, and the life of the story is likely being extended by the already tense debate over Muslim women who wear veils in the UK.

 

The open letter signed by 38 scholars, who represent all eight major schools of thought in the Islam, is more representative of the global Muslim community than this one lone Australian cleric. However, judging by the prevailing media coverage any casual reader would think the exact opposite.

 

When Pat Roberston or Jerry Fallwell make embarrassingly ignorant comments, they are dismissed as the rantings and ravings of old senile men. When any Muslim cleric does something similar, in the court of public opinion Islam is guilty of the offense until proven otherwise. When it comes to the media, Muslims can hardly catch a break.

 

The sad reality is that if the 38 scholars who wrote the Open Letter really wanted the world to hear what they had to say, they should have first congregated in Cairo and burned an effigy of the Pope.

 

Firas Ahmad is Senior Editor of Islamica Magazine.

[Valenteenah.]

Originally posted by Paragon:

Val, you must be a man to come to such conclusion. Judging with logic that which hasn't been felt (cannot be felt) or experianced by you, seems to go against the appropriate use of logic, don't you think? Isn't it abit too much to dictate to men (as opposed to their natural disposition), how they should at first feel when they see half-clothed women, and secondly, how they should control their reactions?

LoL, did you take exception to the use of 'illogical'? Fear not, because I don't presume to know what men feel or think.

 

I do know, however, that they are fully capable of controlling their baser desires. If, as the mufti and some of you claim, they lacked control to the level whereby they weren't responsible for their actions, then they wouldn't be able to fulfil their Islamic role.

 

In fact, such claims are in direct contradiction to men's roles in Islam. Someone with no control over his faculties can not be the head of a household, let alone head of state. Neither could he be given the responsibility of protecting women and children. In fact, the only rightful place for him would be in a cage in a zoo, where righteous and responsible people could throw him dry pieces of bread.

 

To try to convince us otherwise is to try and incorporate women-hating cultural believes, which we all know exist in abundance in Muslim societies, into Islam.

 

Whether women should cover up or not isn't the issue here. What is under discussion is the condonement of rape and blaming the sinful actions of men on women as the mufti attempted to do.

 

My question is simple, if the urge to rape a non-hijabi is so natural, why are you not all out there raping every woman who crosses your path?

 

Yes, I thought as much. Ridiculous and illogical!

[SOO MAAL]

West supported the Pope over his offensive comments about Islam

German Chancellor Angela Merkel

defended the pope on Saturday, telling the mass-circulation Bild newspaper that the pontiff had merely been calling for dialogue with other religions.

"Whoever criticizes the pope misunderstood the aim of his speech," Merkel was quoted as saying, according to Reuters.

"It was an invitation to dialogue between religions and the pope expressedly spoke in favour of this dialogue ... What Benedict XVI emphasised was a decisive and uncompromising renunciation of all forms of violence in the name of religion."

 

 

Bush

addressed the issue during his meeting Monday with the prime minister of Malaysia.

"The president noted that the pope had made some apologies for his remarks and the president believed that the pope was sincere in those remarks and that's where the discussion was left," Dennis Wilder, senior director for East Asian affairs for the National Security Council, told reporters during a briefing on the meeting held on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly.

 

Now, I believe the Sheikh is innocent and sincere in his comments

[Caano Geel]

people what are you deffending. This is an idoit that is is ridiculing your faith. An idoit because you'd have to politely ask your brain to disengade before you come out with the corker that he did. the man was not fuelling the vilification of islam but quitely building a possitively interminable fuel source for it.

 

Sooomaal, a valid reason to point out Angela Merkel 's comments would be to show the double stantards and show that you are willing to accept niether. Not to score an own goal, by tying to make one for us, one for them at the cost of half the population

 

sheer fcking lunacy

[N.O.R.F]

Good to see some of the sisters back in action!

 

A woman is safer in a miniskirt in New York City than she would be in a burka in Cairo

Now, that is an interesting discussion!

[SOO MAAL]

Sheikh apologises for comments

 

[This is the print version of story "]http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2006/s1774835.htm]

 

 

AM - Friday, 27 October , 2006 08:00:00

Reporter: Lindy Kerin

TONY EASTLEY: After coming under intense pressure over his comments that scantily-dressed women provoke sexual violence, one of Australia's most senior Muslim clerics has been given a slap over the wrist by the organisation that employs him.

 

Sheik Taj din al-Hilaly's comments made during a recent speech in Sydney, sparked widespread condemnation and calls for his resignation.

 

Late last night, the Lebanese Muslim Association of New South Wales met to review the Iman's address and consider his future.

 

The cleric has apologised for his comments, but many of his critics, particularly those within the Muslim community, say he must go.

 

As Lindy Kerin reports the Sheik's story has been broadcast around the world.

 

(sound of BBC News)

 

BBC NEWS READER: Australia’s top Muslim cleric says sorry after comparing uncovered women to raw meat.

 

LINDY KERIN: Sheik Hilaly's comments have made news around the world.

 

He's under fire over a recent speech given during Ramadan where he suggested immodestly dressed women provoked sexual attacks.

 

Last night he apologised for any offence caused but he said he would not be resigning. He told Channel Nine that his comments had been taken out of context.

 

TAJ DIN AL-HILALY: Is misunderstanding. I'm very, very sorry for that. People misunderstanding my talk in my mosque.

 

LINDY KERIN: Nada Roude from the Islamic Council of New South Wales and the United Muslim Women's Association says she was shocked by the comments and immediately sought an explanation from Sheik Hilaly.

 

NADA ROUDE: He basically tried to explain that the whole thing wasn't intended in the way that it came out and that he was quite, I guess apologetic about what had happened, but I think for me it was about expressing how disappointed and upsetting his comments were.

 

LINDY KERIN: Sheik Hilaly was appointed mufti by country's peak Islamic body, the Federation of Islamic Councils of Australia.

 

That organisation is holding elections early next year and is refusing to make any comment.

 

Sheik Hilaly is no stranger to controversy - and it's not the first time he's been in trouble for his remarks.

 

Nada Roude says the Sheik should have been more careful in his choice of words, but doesn't think he should resign.

 

NADA ROUDE: If I was on the board of the LMA, obviously I would be looking very seriously about perhaps putting some fairly strict guidelines around the activities of the Iman.

 

In the sense that any comments and lessons and sermons that he may wish to make, it has to be made clearly to him that certain languages and colourful descriptions that he may consider from his own cultural perspective to have no meaning or may be harmless, that he should refrain from.

 

TONY EASTLEY: Nada Roude from the Islamic Council of New South Wales and the United Muslim Women's Association.

 

Sheikh invokes Pope's defence

Email Print Normal font Large font October 27, 2006 - 11:25AM

 

Muslim cleric Sheik Taj Aldin Alhilali believes his comments have been misinterpreted in the same way the Pope was misunderstood in a sermon on Islam.

 

The mufti has triggered a storm over a sermon in which he blamed women for sexual assault.

 

Sheik Alhilali has been stood down from giving sermons at his Lakemba mosque in Sydney for the next two to three months, a mosque spokesman said this morning.

 

Abdul El Ayoubi, from the Lebanese Muslim Association (LMA) which administers the Lakemba mosque where the mufti is based, says the LMA board was not happy with the sheik's sermon.

 

"But we did accept his apology and we want to move on,'' Mr El Ayoubi told AAP.

 

"We feel at this stage that is only fair that he be stood down for the next couple of months."

 

Earlier this year Pope Benedict XVI outraged Muslims by quoting a 14th century Byzantine emperor who said innovations introduced by the Prophet Mohammed were "evil and inhuman".

 

Sheik Alhilali says he was quoting an ancient Islamic scholar to make a point when he compared immodest women to "uncovered meat" to a Ramadan sermon at Lakemba mosque in Sydney.

 

Mr El Ayoubi said the mufti feels like he has been misinterpreted like the Pope.

 

"He keeps harping on the fact that he was quoting some ancient scholar, and he was, and compares it to the situation with the Pope," Mr El Ayoubi told AAP.

 

"The Pope quoted some Byzantine leader and had a go at our prophet, and the sheik goes `look there's no difference', except that this may offend more people than the Pope's comments offended."

 

Mr El Ayoubi said the sheik was not talking about rape in the sermon, he was talking about adultery, and he was quoting some other person.

 

AAP

[SOO MAAL]

Two Canadian ministries, Peter MacKay (the current foreign minister) and Belinda Stronach (Former Human Resources and Skills Development minister) share a laugh as they attend the East Coast Music Awards, Sunday, Feb. 20, 2005, in Sydney, N.S.

 

Stronach demands apology from MacKay for ‘dog’ reference

 

Meagan Fitzpatrick

CanWest News Service

 

 

Friday, October 20, 2006

 

 

 

CREDIT: Fred Chartrand, Canadian Press

Belinda Stronach.

 

OTTAWA - Belinda Stronach demanded an apology from her ex-boyfriend, Foreign Affairs Minister Peter MacKay, today for allegedly referring to her as a dog.

 

Following question period Friday, Stronach rose on a point of order to ask for an apology.

 

“Mr. Speaker yesterday during question period the minister of foreign affairs used a very inappropriate word to describe me,” Stronach said, adding that those kinds of comments have a “chilling” effect on women who contemplate entering politics. “For that Mr. Speaker, I simply ask that the minister of foreign affairs apologize to this House,” she said to a round of applause.

 

The Speaker Peter Milliken ruled that he and his staff had reviewed audio tapes and official transcripts and could find no reference to the alleged slur.

 

“I am unable to confirm any of the suggestions that have been made,” he said. “Under the circumstances, there’s nothing further I can do at this time.”

 

MacKay has denied making the comment, which about 10 Liberal MPs say they heard.

 

The alleged slur occurred during Thursday’s question period after Liberal MP David McGuinty asked MacKay how the Conservatives' newly unveiled green plan would help MacKay's dog in Nova Scotia. MacKay allegedly looked up, pointed to Stronach's empty chair and said "You already have her."

 

Liberal MPs immediately labelled the comments sexist and degrading to Stronach and all women. Stronach was not alone in asking for an apology on Friday with several of her colleagues as well as an NDP MP came to her defence.

 

“Will no one in the Conservative party condemn these sexist actions?” asked the NDP’s Judy Wasylycia-Leis. Speaking to reporters later, she said that while asking that question a Conservative MP yelled “stop whining.”

 

“Do they not know what kind of environment they’re creating? I thought we’d struggled and won the battle to be able to work and speak without feeling degraded or demeaned,” she said. Wasylycia-Leis even proposed that the House of Commons should perhaps introduce a sexual harassment policy.

 

Stronach said the comments were hurtful and insulting and she was disappointed to not receive an apology. “It goes beyond this. It is really, I think, a reflection of the character and of the attitude of this government towards women. The fact that no one would take responsibility for this kind of a comment today, I think shows that,” she told reporters.

 

Stronach and MacKay had a stormy breakup following her defection to the Liberals in May 2005. MacKay, stung by what he described as his girlfriend's betrayal, said he would seek comfort with his dog, Jack, because "at least dogs are loyal."

 

© CanWest News Service

 

 

CANADA'S EMBARRASSING FOREIGN MINISTER

A Man of Poor Character and Thin Talents

 

John Chuckman

 

Were a senior member of any national government to insult a woman in public, there would be reason for concern. An apology might put the act down in the public's mind to poor judgment in the fierce heat of partisan debate. Were the senior member then to refuse admitting what he had done, despite many witnesses, surely a question of character is raised.

 

But reportage of Peter MacKay's sleazy remark in Parliament about Belinda Stronach has revealed other behavior far more disturbing. Apparently for months, MacKay has been glaring and making faces at Stronach. His abusive behavior continued with such intensity that her party changed her seat to one behind another member.

 

This is not the mooning of a lovesick pup or the melancholy of a jilted lover, although the mainline press has tended to treat it in this light fashion. This is aggressive behavior by an obsessive personality, carried out repeatedly in a public place without any concern for embarrassment or shame, behavior typical of a stalker, warning signs of a dangerous personality.

 

We already knew there were serious flaws in MacKay's character. There was his unapologetic, hasty breaking of a written agreement made at the former Conservative Party leadership convention. He simply brushed it off with saying politics was a blood sport, a rather odd choice of words coming from the representative of a party trying to promote itself as doing business in a new and ethical way.

 

Following Stronach's crossing the floor to the Liberals, MacKay busied himself doing simpering interviews about being abandoned both as deputy party leader and as lover. In fact, without MacKay's bizarre little press blitz, most Canadians would never have known about his affair with Stronach.

 

This, too, was commonly attributed to the freshly-jilted lover's overwrought emotion. His words and tone in these interviews seemed tailored to give that sympathetic impression, but they were quite unconvincing coming from a self-professed, blood-sport politician. What MacKay was actually doing was character assassination only slightly disguised as sympathetic pouting.

 

What also bothered me at the time was that no one in the press raised the important issue of a senior executive in an organization, the deputy leader of the new Conservative Party, having an affair with someone directly under his authority. This is not considered ethical in the business world, a situation fraught with many possibilities for abuse, and is often a reason for dismissal.

 

MacKay has shown himself unfit for high office, not because of an affair, but because of his repeated display of questionable character and personality traits, and these traits are accompanied by what can only be called a slim endowment of talent. MacKay has made blundering statements as foreign minister several times that certainly have embarrassed his boss. It really is time for him to go.

[SOO MAAL]

At least the Sheikh Hilali apologized to women, But Mr. Mackay (Canada’s Foreign minister) even rejected to apologize after he referred his female colleague in the Canadian parliament Ms. Stronach “Dog” !!!

 

I cannot believe how some westernized people argue without supporting evidence that west respects more women then Islam, or west knows human rights!!!