The ''Refugee'' Mentality

[MAXIMUS POWERS]

As Somalis we generally tend to perceive our settlement in the western world in temporary terms. The older generation and particularly women, generally express emotional orientation towards Somalia and are often absorbed by events at home. From my observations, we often talk about current events in our host countries, but it’s from a social habit rather than a keen interest in the affairs of the host society.

 

Moreover we rarely establish social relations with members of the mainstream community partly due to linguistic and cultural barriers and of course perceived racism. So for most Somalis, contact with the local people is very limited as is their knowledge of British, American, Canadian or even European life and customs. This voluntary segregation has induced Somali people following a daily pattern that greatly constraints interactions with the mainstream community. Our main leisure pursuits are informal social visits to the homes of relatives and friends. Men and women usually spend their time in khat chewing sessions to create a nostalgic romantisation of life back home. Additionally wedding receptions, Eid festivities and the occasional Somali concerts or cultural events one-off social events offer some connection with Somalia.

 

Many Somali families are headed by a single mother, whatever the circumstances, welfare benefits usually become the sole income for the family with the state replacing the husband/father as the Family provider. Even when families do stay together, Somalis suffer from high levels of unemployment and are therefore receiving benefits. This obviously impacts on the individuals’ self-esteem and confidence and deprives them of the status they once had as father, worker and provider

 

What’s more the resurgence of clan consciousness, partly due to the political polarisation in the Somali peninsula creates further factions, thus effectively inhibiting a community spirit or a united front for a fair share of community grants.

It is also crucial to recognise that even within own community; we are highly segregated, often having the strongest bond with clan allegiance as opposed to the Somali national identity. The Somali community is consequently tribally segregated across London for instance. Somalis in different parts of London constitute different clans. For instance Somalis in Tower Hamlets are predominately from Somaliland. While Somalis in Islington are mostly from Puntland and south central Somalia. But it seems as though times are changing, as younger generations, both those escaping violence at home and those born here are renegotiating their Somali identity and their relationship to the UK in a new context.

 

Despite Somalis now in the western for more than 25 years, I think it’s fair to say we are a community in a state of flux: unsettled, neglected and fragmented in both attitude and orientation.

 

I understand this idea has been recycled many times over. This is because it’s true and still evident.

 

Your opinions are welcomed!

[osman_nz]

marx your right but that is not somalis is asia..the somalis in asia are either integrated and studying and hardly any on welfare..

 

As for us here in new zealand ppl intergrate, no gang violence or any of those problems in europe or america..it's quiet lifestyle, go to school, or go to work...come home..relax..and same thing next day..

 

Most of my friends here are white...and most somalis here befriend locals..so it's problematic ur statement if u apply that to all somalis in the west.

 

more appropriate to say somalis in america and europe rather then overseas all in general..

[NGONGE]

Marx on his soapbox again! The way this is written comes across as one of those speeches busybodies make in community meetings.

 

To say that this opinion of yours is true is to stretch the point a little, Marx. Therefore, I have to reluctantly conclude that this is nothing but stuff and nonsense.

 

(Ease up on the assumptions dressed up as facts, saaxib).

[strawberryampcream]

you make some valid points, however the communal assimilation(respect ive of "2nd home") is not so easily done. others who have come before us took many decades to reach the level you aspire us to attain(presently). in my opinion, it would take generational rinse 5 times over for Somalis abroad to substantially drop that innate sense of belonging they hold for the homeland.

 

i live in Canada and when i look around and see the Italians, the Irish, etc, its easily noted how "Canadian" they have become while still retaining some of their original identity. when I say "Canadian" i speak less of the aesthetics of the social norm, but rather their ability to contribute to society in the sense of supporting the system as suppose to being supported by the system which is where we are currently at.

[MAXIMUS POWERS]

Osman_nz,

that's an interesting observation. I'd imagine in some towns in Australia and New Zealand these processes might be different as people have no choice but to interact. I believe the issues such as gang violence and unemployment are a reaction to sociaeconomic dynamics at play in areas settled by somalis.

 

Strawberry,

Overall the Somali community is seen hitting all the buttons, they are Black, Muslims and almost all of them are refugee or asylum seekers, consequently as a community we are more likely to experience prejudice and social exclusion. However the younger Somali generation have gradually started to integrate into main stream society. This is because through advancements in education and changes in attitude from Somali migrants has seen a new wave of Somali people who are achieving as they take full advantage of the opportunities available.

 

NG

What qualifies you to call everything stuff and nonsense horta? The refugee mentality doesn't apply to people like yourself. Its for refugees! Also people like you are everything thats wrong with the somali community, although you dont even qualify to be called Somali. Sitting on the sidelines, hurling insults will achieve nothing!

Also - where have opinions being dressed up as facts?

[N.O.R.F]

For once I fully agree with the Marx man.

[Fabregas]

You totally confuse being under the bottom of the socio economic ladder, and assimilation within society. To give you an example, an African Carribean might have millions of white friends, go to all their parties and weddings, wear an England 9 shirt- yet they could still live in the worst area and have all the same problems Somalis have. I have grown up with working class cadan youths who seem to be perpetually involved in criminal behaviour and the dole seeking lifestyle. Believe me, the Somalis you melodramatically described are in a far better position than them.

 

 

On the other hand, many Somalis( probably many on this forum), tend to associate and confine themselves( that is, outside work and uni) within the SOmali/Muslim community. But they still have university degrees, work in nice jobs and take care of the fam. They also still have an interest in the politics of Somalia and one could hold a oxford degree but the bigggest tribalist on earth.

 

All immigrant communities have areas, habits, food, etc, which are exclusive to them. Somalis,and this probally due their tribal and Islamic culture, tend to socialise amongst themselves. Thus, segregation/isolaton ism( even most cadans themselves don't interact with non whites) isn't really a problem. What is a problem is the socio economic conditions many Somalis and other immigrant communities find themselves in. The point is that they could still keep some aspects of their culture, keep themselves to themselves and still do well economically and socially, like many other immigrant communities have done. Lack of opportunities is the problem, not integration or assimilation.

[NGONGE]

As Somalis we generally tend to perceive our settlement in the western world in temporary terms.

Who says? YOU? How can you prove this 'fact' of yours?

 

The older generation and particularly women, generally express emotional orientation towards Somalia and are often absorbed by events at home.

Two or three women crying about the place of their youth does not a fact make, saaxib. Do you have any proof for this statement?

 

Moreover we rarely establish social relations with members of the mainstream community partly due to linguistic and cultural barriers and of course perceived racism. So for most Somalis,

contact with the local people is very limited as is their knowledge of British, American, Canadian or even European life and customs

. This voluntary segregation has induced Somali people following a daily pattern that greatly constraints interactions with the mainstream community.

Hmmm! (check the bits in bold).

 

Our main leisure pursuits are informal social visits to the homes of relatives and friends.

Is that what YOU do or are you including all Somalis here?

 

Men and women usually spend their time in khat chewing sessions to create a nostalgic romantisation of life back home. Additionally wedding receptions, Eid festivities and the occasional Somali concerts or cultural events one-off social events offer some connection with Somalia.

What is the precentage of Somalis that chew khat when compared to the total number of Somalis in the West (and London in this case)? Numbers, son, numbers.

 

 

Despite Somalis now in the western for more than 25 years, I think it’s fair to say we are a community in a state of flux: unsettled, neglected and fragmented in both attitude and orientation.

Yes. It is fair to say (the only time when you present something as an opinion).

 

 

I understand this idea has been recycled many times over. This is because it’s true and still evident.

True? Stuff and nonsense, saaxib, stuff and nonsense.

 

Happy?

[SayidSomal]

Originally posted by Fabregas:

You totally confuse being under the bottom of the socio economic ladder, and assimilation within society. To give you an example, an African Carribean might have millions of white friends, go to all their parties and weddings, wear an England 9 shirt- yet they could still live in the worst area and have all the same problems Somalis have. I have grown up with working class cadan youths who seem to be perpetually involved in criminal behaviour and the dole seeking lifestyle. Believe me, the Somalis you melodramatically described are in a far better position than them.

 

 

On the other hand, many Somalis( probably many on this forum), tend to associate and confine themselves( that is, outside work and uni) within the SOmali/Muslim community. But they still have university degrees, work in nice jobs and take care of the fam. They also still have an interest in the politics of Somalia and one could hold a oxford degree but the bigggest tribalist on earth.

 

All immigrant communities have areas, habits, food, etc, which are exclusive to them. Somalis,and this probally due their tribal and Islamic culture, tend to socialise amongst themselves. Thus, segregation/isolaton ism( even most cadans themselves don't interact with non whites) isn't really a problem. What is a problem is the socio economic conditions many Somalis and other immigrant communities find themselves in. The point is that they could still keep some aspects of their culture, keep themselves to themselves and still do well economically and socially, like many other immigrant communities have done. Lack of opportunities is the problem, not integration or assimilation.

Frabregas - The Hammer

Marx - The nail

Ngonge - The wood

 

 

Frabregas - couldn't agree with you more.

[Che -Guevara]

What's point in repeating everything that's being said before?

[Nematoda]

marx you have a chieved nothing from your grand speech, just repeated vocabulary and observations that do nothing more then state the obvious, of your whole speech.

 

I will give you this much it was a good read, I cant wait for the next one.

[Nehanda]

Sometimes it's better to repeat the obvious than say or do naught in the hope that something good would come out of it.

[Nephissa]

I don't see any problem with refugees/immigrants maintaining their life-style in the western world as long as such a life-style does not break the law. Laakini there are certain things that people should go out of their way to integrate on [language, for one] while also keeping their culture and heritage alive. Habar-gaal oo candho wayn la sheekeeysigeeda ama la saaxiibkeeda wax ay igu soo siyaadinaysaa oo macno leh ma jirto. Inta yar ee aan la shaqaynaayo baanba qatyaan ka ahay. Best to stick to your own and love it, addeer. Adigu if you want to bend over to kiss their (|) and kill your heritage cidi kuguma dhegena, go right aheedh.

[Faarax-Brawn]

Habar-gaal oo candho wayn la sheekeeysigeeda ama la saaxiibkeeda wax ay igu soo siyaadinaysaa oo macno leh ma jirto.

,L0L!~

[Chimera]

blublubleeeeeh ummm doo doo gaga poo poo, singimiha Pee!! Pee!!