Originally posted by Emperor: Lol at a brand name, Somali is a country and not a product that needs to sale... you have been brainwashed by this western big names and brands. Are you saying that if Somali were to change its name of the country and cities things will improve drammatically? Lool, what a silly man. I disagree intensly. if you notice. Countries that are successful are run very much like a a successful international corporation. They do what they must - Fiscal stability, open government very well and then they go on the offensive like on international trade. Look at Singapore. That country is one huge brand. What comes to mind when you think of it? Prehaps it's national airline, which is famous for service. Prehaps it's clean green streets or the wondorous food. This is a image they crafted and worked on. This then attracts migrants, investors, people with talent. They visit there, live there and do business. The economy grows. They set successful conceptions and they develop on that, continiously. Consider Somalia. What kind of advertising and marketing can change that countries image? Who would want to be associated with it? It has a terrible image. Tell you what? No one.

Originally posted by Ms DD: When will this self-hatred stop peacenow? PS Are you still wearing your suit in Italy? It's not a matter of self-hatred. To hate something - something has to be already there. As of today there is no state. So one must think stratigically on how to progress.

What I refer to is the name of the country, it's symbols, the name of the capital, the flag. The words Somalia, Baidoa and Mogadishu are seared into a negative image the world over. If this wretched country was to ever be peaceful. How can it overcome the handicap of being called 'Somalia'? How would it sell it itself to others, how would others invest, how would others treat us. When mention of this name is dog dirt. Yes. I'm calling for the name and it's symbols to be retired. if people can redeem themselves why not states? Something new and modern and will appeal to the world, should take it's place. Something like 'Azania' or 'Banadir'. Well it's suggestion. There are millions of possibilities. A name like a 'brand' - with new symbols of state and national idenity. It can happen quickly and can produce powerful trade offs in a globalized world. One thing is for sure. The name somalia is only fit for the bin.

Nothing to celebrate.

Conspiracy theories are for the weak and uneducated. The dirty Arabs lap this type of theories up. It covers up for all their mistakes. With regards to Somalia. It is as it is. A country destroyed by ogres and brute. No conspiracy there.

What should happen is that the international community should put financial pressure on the sponsors of the World Cup in South Africa. If there is a threat of this and more serious action on South Africa then this is all over.

What should happen is that the international community should put financial pressure on the sponsors of the World Cup in South Africa. If there is a threat of this and more serious action on South Africa then this is all over.

Originally posted by indhayare187: If you are a "staunch secularist" then your best friend is yeey, and the TFG. good question resistance. As many of you here as well know that I campaign and fight against the tfg.

Originally posted by Cige: Simply NO Care to elaborate?

Originally posted by Resistance: quote: I. As many of you know. I'm a staunch secularist. ? Care to explain what it actually means to be a 'stuanch secularist' [/QB]Yes. What it means. Is that I'm opposed to a Islamist form of government with the laws of the land interpreted from the Qu'ran. I want a secular liberal democracy. I can tolerate a mildly moderate Islamic leaning state as it is in Malaysia. But nothing more than that.

Can someone answer. Are we allowed now to refer him this title? Is the vaunted leader who has risen and now will lead us to a peaceful horizon? Is he our Mandela, Ataturk and Mahathir Mohammed rolled into one? If so, then I welcome him. As I... do like him and respect what he stands for. As many of you know. I'm a staunch secularist. There are consequences that face us then. One issue I have been thinking about is the personal safety of the good man. What if they assassinate him? Good leaders as you know are very very rare in that part of the world. What fate that he does not befall that fate. As many of you know, that, many good men who are daily being gunned down in Somalia. Are you concerned as well?

Can you imagine that the only chance for a Black President can be ruined is not by a white americans but by a black man. This crazy Wright is on a one track mission to destroy Obama. Can you imagine someone so egotistical and ******? All he wants is the fame and forune so he can set himself up as the next Al Sharpton. Just another black hustler who uses these people for his own advantage. These sorry crying black americans need to get over this race obsession they have. It's getting to sick.

What weakness. It is a collassal embrassment. Somalis have no shame. French can come and take them away like that like colonial animals.

Very angry at this. How dare these animals do this. They can stick their taliban islam back to their dirty arab masters.

A backward pre-industrial soceity. He the nail on the head. Female mutuilation, religious crazed, people killing american soliders through streets who came to help them. A loser people. The world should just forget them. They don't deserve the time.

You forget he is a Jew. But i guess to the rabid way Somalis worship Islam, it don't matter does it. A Jew doing more for Somalia than the arabs we worship.

Only thing they done so far I agree with. These Islamic preachers should be rounded and shot dead.

These *******s are ruining the name of us even more. They have become nothing more than the lowest of the lowest. It's like a trap, I cannot escape from this awful nationality I belong too. It's there in my passport. They can see my city of birth. They ask, where are you from? Erm..... Well Where were you born? In a whisper -somalia- erm..... Only way is I change my name and leave this forsaken people once and for all.

Not too fond of women's with moustaches. Those Italians are quite hairy.

Originally posted by G G: quote:Originally posted by peacenow: The think is really about the phsyce of the people. There are no other people who more 'hard-headed' then Somalis. It's difficult to get through and manage that. A German will stand beside a traffic light and not cross the road until the sign comes on, even if the traffic was light. I have seen it with my own eyes. Imagine that in Somalia. even the typical Africa can be managed and are soft headed. The differences are stark. It's why the country is as it is. They need extreme shock threaphy to tell them. The world is a commmunity now and there things you just can't do. That, that same world community will reward you handsomely, if you follow the rules and live by it. Did a Somali do something to you? You just seem far too bitter, my non-Somali mate. How is secular France today?

The think is really about the phsyce of the people. There are no other people who more 'hard-headed' then Somalis. It's difficult to get through and manage that. A German will stand beside a traffic light and not cross the road until the sign comes on, even if the traffic was light. I have seen it with my own eyes. Imagine that in Somalia. even the typical Africa can be managed and are soft headed. The differences are stark. It's why the country is as it is. They need extreme shock threaphy to tell them. The world is a commmunity now and there things you just can't do. Now having said that- that same world community will reward you handsomely, if you follow the rules and live by it.

So it really comes down to the UAE and Malaysia. One which is not Islamist, With only a million people sharing 100 bn of oil. Very nice thank you. I would have no problems if Somalia suddenly turned out like UAE tommorow. The other with millions of Chinese immigrants who have built it. Somalia has no oil. Nothing at all. You will have to toil in the sun like the europeans do to earn your keep. And when you reject all the economic fundamentals that have repeatdly worked in all succesful countries, and then to overturn all that and return to the 7th century caliphate. Is really a joke.

Originally posted by G G: quote:Originally posted by Sue: Religion is the source of evil? Justify that please...I am tired of people making statements without facts. Religions begot law and order, an example being the 10 commandants which is shared by Christians, Muslims and Jews alike. These values and morals are the very thing governments worldwide have adopted, developed and adapted to the laws we know today. So in retrospect since law is decidedly a good thing then how can you then call religion evil? A secularist would say "law" existed long before the Abrahamic religions. There were many great (in the sense of functioning) early civilizations that could've not existed without sense of law and order. Very few governments seem to possess a sense of morals /have any values today. P.S. I do not think religion is evil, subhanAllah. It is the lack of religion and faith that is the root of all evil. Very interesting when you are in France and that is what the most secular nation on earth. Who's buttering your bread my friend.

Originally posted by Thierry: I am glad that you agree with me Peacenow, because this means that you agree to the historical precedence that the USA followed i.e. the Caliphate Rashidun, Umayyad and Abbasid empires, because these super nations were in essence market based economies. The principle economic model of their system was to have the money in the market similar to the modern financial markets as opposed to keeping the money in banks. Reasons being that money in circulation enhances market growth, the current credit crunch the west faces is due to lack of funds readily available, it isn’t because the money isn’t there but it is stuck in banks earning interest rather than out there working. The first thing Muslims Caliphs did when they conquered cities was to establish markets, Baghdad in 7th century is a good example of a city that was built around the market. So Peacenow this Islam that you criticize so vehemently is the very originator of some of the policies that you strongly advocate for. I agree with you that over the last couple of 100 years Muslim lands have fallen way behind than their western counterparts, but believe you me this has more to do with the fact that they have abandoned the principles that made them great. Syria, Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, Egypt, etc all had secular systems and they don’t seem to succeed. Ps Maybe it is the name Islam you hate ( I assure you it means Peace) A devious turn as your previous reply was nothing to do with religion. Quite interesting really as how Islamists will twist and turn every slant into a religious issue. Islam has nothing to do with modern America and the principles in how it was founded, i studied American history, I can tell you that convincingly. Seems by your American measure, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Some would say that the reason that Syria, Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, Egypt have all failed is because they are essentaily islamic states. Or in the case of Somalia, islamic and completely arabized. You fighting the arab mans wars my friend, but he doesn't give a toss about you.

I would give credence to what you saying on the viability of Islamism as a political entity, if you could prove to me one that works and works for the BENEFIT of it's people. Truth is there isn't any, because if would be tyranny by the few against the self determination of the people. Quite interesting isn't it when you are in, the UK, Norway, France etc.