^LX - Interesting arguments. I think it is less about grabbing territory per se than the political wieght that is implied therein. I think whether Sanaagians join SL or PL - their own territories will be subject to self-rule as districts within the larger entity. For a Somaliland seeking independance - all territories contingous to the old British Somaliland need to be in the fold for the needed recognition. For them - I think it is a matter of clear imperative to establish control here ASAP paricularly if the TFG experiment in the south starts to work. For PL - having Sanaag and Sool in the fold is about having the necessary political heft in a future federal Somalia. A PL with Sanaag and Sool will be better able to project itself on the national scene particularly as compared to populous areas like Banadir or Bay if a federal state becomes a reality. I would like to ask you and Paragon this: Do most Sanaagians want to be part of a larger Somali state? I understand where you guys stand personally - but what is your best sense of where most Sanaagians stand? Is it a 50/50 split?

Originally posted by Halgan: "Calaacal". ma af soomaliga ku yar? Let me remind you that the objective of this thread was to air our views. I think if you don't allow to call people who support the puppet government dabadhilifs, traitors etc but you allow "Tribal courts" "high on qaad somalilanders" etc we have a problem. It is simple; You either allow every word to be wrote or you don't allow sensitive , deragatory terms etc. You should have a uniform policy! As a visitor to this site, I am constantly confronted with threads that mock, ridicule some tribes, some communities and condoning the death/rape/opression of innocent somalis. On the other hand, it is not uncommon to see edited messages when the opposite is done. I think your concerns were heard and addressed by MMA and others. Here is a summary: 1- Do not refer to SOLers in deregatory terms such as 'traitors', 'fake sheiks' but you may refer to public figures and political movements as such. 2- If there are threads that mock clans/communities, what have you - call it out on SOL and specifically mention it to the mods/admin. I'm sure all well-meaning folks will join you in that. Bottom-line - You cannot complain about unfairness/inaction if you do nothing to expose it and combat it yourself. So if you feel passionately about this(and it seems so) join the good fight and abandon 'lurk-dom'.

^Funny

^Ok adeer - my questions are not meant to be adversarial. I just asked for some clarity on the politics in the region. I don't have a clear picture. I perceived some indecisivness. I'm not the only one. This is me doing my homework - asking for input from those from the region. BTW - what solutions do you recommend? How do you stop the repeated skirmishes if the Sanaag folks are firmly in the PL camp?

^Whatever - Bada - neglect(which is active) is different from least developed. If you want to leave it there alright. But if least developed because of PL - Somaliland could've stepped in and scored easy points with the locals and won them over. It doesn't seem to have done that. Whatever the case - I don't think only one entity is at fault here.

Caamir - the repetition of 'qat' this and 'qat' that fosters a sense that Somalilanders have a special attachement to it. Does anyone know whether their 'bravado' is qat induced? No I think not. Can anyone make the blanket statement that their political elite is 'qat-crazed'? No - I don't think so. If it does - then it applies to all of Somalia's political elite. And I did not understand your last paragraph

^No question of neglect? Since you're making the charges - you would have to give evidence of neglect no? Your first criterion was a university - there is one in Sool. What is your other criteria?

Adeer - relax. I'm just presenting what I have gleaned from the web. It may be wrong. If the ppl of Sanaag are overwhelmingly for PL - why do continuing skirmishes? Is it that SL will not 'give' them up? Simple as that? Also, how do you explain the Sanaag representatives in Hargeisa - are they to be dismissed?

^LOL - I kinda like potatoes - you can do all sorts of good things wit dem - chips, fries, mashed etc

^Everyone is partisan here to some degree. The question of banning should have to do with repeated insults and other af-xumo to other SOLers. I can say that I've clearly seen that with AU, Pi, Jaylanni, Fanisha. The other 3 - not really - especially Deep Blue who is a relatively new member. Good job on this action Admin and MMA. It's necessary and will send out a clear signal to others.

^Caamir - If that is the case - why are SL govt delegations received and welcomed over there? Doesn't that send a mixed signal? Or are those reports all false? To my knowledge - there are people who claim to represent Sanaag in Hargeisa. Doesn't that also add to the confusion?

Charming. The ladies are such stars - the men just fade into the background. And you have to grin when they refer to Chinese as 'abowayal' - about the last ppl that we can refer to as that.

Caamir - in your opinion what do the people of eastern Sanaag want - PL, SL or none?

Adeer Caamir - the man may have valid points but when the first sentence is 'kat-induced bravado' - it leaves a bad taste in one's mouth. The implications of such a sentence leave one to surmise only clannish BS and I'm not from SL. It would be good of you to distance yourself from such statements clearly while highlighting what you believe to be the valid points. I think that would be the most reasonable thing.

^Why the lack of clarity Paragon? The Somali method usually is for the elders to hold a shir and then determine the wisest course for the rest of the community. There will be disagreement and small groups who may be unhappy with the decision reached but everyone insidee and outside the community knows where it stands. Has something like that not been done or attempted? What is the state of politics in the area?

^Are you from the region? - I'm talking specifically to certain folks here. Not to SL and PL partisans. And why would they call SL army anyways?

^I dislike it when people can't simply argue their points without baseless crap like 'qat-crazed'. It's clear that Somalilanders have no monopoly on qat. Having that in the first sentence makes me not want to bother with the rest at all.

^Good riddance. Funny guy but definitely detracted from SOL with his madness And THANK-YOU ADMIN - it was high time for serious action!

^I would like to get a sense of what Solers from the region want. It seems that Sanaag especially risks becoming a much abused football between SL and PL. Why don't the inhabitants decide which 'team' they want to 'join' or decide they want to go their separate way? It seems to me that the indecisiveness or lack of clarity from the inhabitants prolongs the tension and puts them at peril. Am I being overly harsh here or just plain wrong? I don't know.

Ahmed_guree - people on this planet exploit people all the time. As long as there is an acceptable tradeoff for the exploitation ie wage. I bet you, yourself are 'exploited'. I think it's dangerous and unwise when people who are more 'il-bax' than the native population accumulate wealth through hard work and then are attacked for it. If Somalis get to the same position as Asians in Africa as they seem to be on the way to doing - they will also be subject to these same senseless attacks. And I bet you would not be in favour of it as you are when Asians are the ones being attacked.

Originally posted by Che-Guevara: They are hardworking and everything, but after exploiting the resources of the host country, these people send all the wealth back to their native country, and hardly anything stays in the host nation. Their treatment of the workers they hire is horrendous with such long hours, and little pay. You should how they treat domestic workers, worse than Arabs that rape their maids. They treat poor like dogs literally. Bolivian - I don't think Asians in East Africa send all their wealth back - they use their wealth to live prosperously in EA and invest the rest. Those Asians who send their wealth back are those living in the Middle East where they have little long-term stake since they're brought in as 'guest' labourers. As to domestic workers I think ill treatment is wrong. But the laws to ensure proper treatment come from the respective governments and societies. And if the prevailing treatment of domestic workers is poor why pick on Asians? ie. If wealthy Africans treat their African domestic workers poorly - why single out Asians for opprobrium.

^War huss What have you got against them anyway? Usually hardworking, crime-free immigrants. And don't tell me they're racist. Cause so what? Somalis are as bad or worse.

^Actually - for me - it's the estimates of likely reserves. If we're talking about 1 billion barrels of recoverable oil or less - I don't think it will mean much for Somalia as a whole.

^Typical racist African! Sits on his lazy *** amidst the riches of his country - then someone makes something of it - and then you huff and puff.

^Thx Dabshid. Congratulations to her. To distinguish hereself so clearly is impressive but to so in immigrant unfriendly Sweden is even more impressive.