Originally posted by Jimcaale: I just checked the Essence page and I can’t believe they listed Ayan Hersi in the same column as Oprah, Jada, Senator Obama’s wife and That’s So Raven. It must be very humiliating for these ladies to have their names next to Ayan Hersi. I wonder what criteria they used to make the list. While Ayan uses fame for her own benefit and shame her culture/country/family, other women in the list fund & support organizations and networks that make differences everyday. LOL - at the whole ridiculous mess. Essence doesn't know anything about Hersi. It's always dangerous when Americans(and American publications) venture to comment on world matters. And I doubt most of the other ladies has heard of Hersi either.

^That's an intersting point. There are so many western troops there to safeguard 'western' interests. Why is a permanent British deployment necessary? What is it that we don't know?

Originally posted by Jamilah: quote:Originally posted by AbuJamal: But Al-Jazeera’s growing popularity also brought it greater scrutiny. US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld accused the Qatar-based network of encouraging militants by airing hostage executions. And Fox News Channel’s Bill O’Reilly branded it a “propaganda network...bent on encouraging violence and sympathetic to terrorists.†Fox News passing judgement on another news organisation, how ironic. Anybody who has ever bothered to watch that rubbish would not just how laughable that comment is coming from fox news, talk about hypocrisy Irony is standard fare for these right-wing bstards. But seriously, you get Fox News in Austrailia?

Originally posted by Kashafa: ^^ It's all politics, good neighbor from the north. The illegal aliens wash their cars, clean their houses, and pick their cotton. In return, they get paid dirt wages, no health insurance, no retirement, no workman compensation. A capitalist's dream, in short. These 'aliens' are as American as a Negro in 1865. The Republicans have a mid-term election and 2008 coming up. With Iraq in shambles, Katrina horribly mismanaged, and gas prices headed towards 4 bucks, they think that immigration reform and "Kick the Foreigners Out" will save them. There's also the small matter that's terrifying the hell out of White America: Hispanics are making too much babies, too fast. True brother. But have you ever watched Lou Dobbs? He's unbelievable. I think there is a more visceral public reaction against the Mexicans illegals and other foreigners(as per the whole Dubai ports debacle). Back in the 90s heyday - Americans didn't give a damn. So what has changed in the intervening period? Cause playing politics has been fashionable for a long time.

^And to add to the misery - various warlords will claim that Al-Qaeda is rife in the country as per this action and will seek arms and aid from the US et al who are itching to find Al-Qaeda behind everything that happens in the Islamic world.

Originally posted by naden: ^ Indeed. I don't know about the crowd being turned on, though. Despite their hideous lives, people are the same everywhere and violence takes away from their humanity. A killing for a killing is Islamic but like you said, so is forgiveness. What is not Islamic is sticking a man with 'toorey' repeatedly in full view of so many. Punishment, yes, torture, no, please! What do I know, though? Sunny Xamar and its brutality is a world away from where I am. Totally right - justice - repeated stabbings! :rolleyes:

hmmm - why did they make it a public spectacle - more like showmanship by the 'Islamic' judges than anything else. YAY Somalia!

LOL - it's interesting how this 'illegal alien' thing has exploded in the past 3 or 4 years. In 2000, when they were roughly as many 'illegal aliens' as now - nobody was saying anything. It portends a sign of some decline in the US.

y - very nice

Originally posted by Khalaf: quote: Who cares about atheists? Why does anyone bother with them? Atheism is the very hieght, the apogee, of human ego and anyone who subscribes to that is beyond the pale. --Why? because this is a matter of Nar and Al-Jannah. My question to those who say there is no God: before you came to this conclusion what was your understanding level of Al-Islam, have you studied the Quran, what did you take from the Quran if you did study it and why do u think there is no God? Please explain your beliefs more clearly. Instead of I can’t see it therefore can’t belief in it…doesn’t fit my rational reasoning….or religious evidence is unconvincing. Why Why, Why? Where is other party? Come on its almost summer break Salaamun To the blind, deaf and dumb only God can change them. It seems to me rather useless

^^The solution: Go Amazon and keep the men as breeding stock. Oh wait - isn't that what a sperm bank is all about?

Originally posted by Socod_badne: quote:Originally posted by Mr. Red Sea: Well, I would like to take the time to apologize to those brothers and sisters who were offended by my post. Yeah sure why not apology accepted... don't worry about it Bro, it's all good. Now, what (i.e. thread) you talking about? How dare you SB? Only the righteously outraged can accept the rightly due apologies. Brother Red Sea - you must grovel for your apology to be accepted

Who cares about atheists? Why does anyone bother with them? Atheism is the very hieght, the apogee, of human ego and anyone who subscribes to that is beyond the pale.

^Adventourous! Better to arm youself and make sure you have a sufficient number of bodyguards.

Sadly nowhere my friend - for the working men and women little time for international frolic

Originally posted by Pure blood: When Siyaad Bare (allah haa u naxariisto) came into power, the whole Somali nation flocked to the streets and rejoiced; why would they do that? The reason was that the previous governments were corrupt; there was absolutely no form of equality, as many of you would like to believe. There were no rebellions in Somalia before 1987: were a group (thee SSDF) of men who all hailed from the clan that lives in northeastern Somalia, and who believed that it was their divine right to be the only leaders in Somalia, and could not except the fact that a man who hails from a different clan be in power, attempted a coup right after the Og*den War -which was a war to liberate our fellow Somalis from the Ethiopian empire, and its disrespectful of you to utter the word “useless†in the same sentence, when so many men have lost their live in the hope of uniting all of Somalia- with the help of our foe Ethiopia; the country we had recently fought. Their plan was foiled, and the treasonous were executed. As for the second rebels, the SNM, their rebellion was ignited by the ban of Khat and their envy of the flourishment of Mogadishu, and as of yet I have no idea what else could have motivated them to rebel, care to explain (try not to be so “obvious†this time) Just as the previous rebels they went to Ethiopia for help, and they had to be dismantled because they were bring corruption; while in the process few innocent people died, just as in all wars. Siyaad Bare (allah haa u naxariisto) cared for his people, he was nationalist; just as dhubad pointed out, he had no homes, tell me of a president that has no home that he bought; he always put the interest of the masses before his self-interest, and I believe that your are blind to the goodness of Siyaad Bare (allah haa u naxariisto) because of clan hatred. The clan based sickness affecting Somalia is personified above. The line of thinking goes like: everyone else is wrong, I/my clan is right; anyone who suffered and their suffering doesn't matter. At the end of the day - the best way to sum up Siad Barre's rule is - what was the end result? The collapsed state we see today. I guess you are happy with that. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by naden: That disloyalty of yours to the consensus of learned community of this Ummah is not a good sign. I would advice you work within the parameters of Islamic fiqh……. I owe no loyalty to a ‘consensus of learned community’. If they can advance my knowledge of the Quran and religious practices, I do and will continue to seek them. If they offer nothing save for recycled ideas and applications that do not pass the test of my intellect (despite its deficiencies), they will be respectfully ignored. A very interesting discourse and much of what you said has a lot of validity. I thought this quote above needed some clarification. I don't think you owe a loyalty to consensus views necessarily. I think what is required is that you give them a sufficiently large wieght as compared to your reason/judgement given their level of knowledge, specialization, sheer time spent on the issue and confirmation by others.

Originally posted by besbaaso: WOW...lots of hatred being spewed on behalf of one dead man...Allah haa uu naxariisto...one person mentions that he killed family members, does that mean he did them himself?...or others did it in his name?...is he responsible 4 all the destruction?....or is he just part of a huge problem that was facing our country. Somali people are very good at blaming others for their ish…well…I guess he is the SCAPE GOAT …they have chosen to offer for all the bad things to be blamed on. None of u have the right to judge him?...u r not Allah?...and what have u done 4 ur country?...at least he tried…and succeeded in many ways….he was just a man….like any other he had faults…and made mistakes. Ps...To compare k'naan to the former pres. of Somalia is ridiculous?... :mad: Siad Barre was the dictator of Somalia from 1969 to 1991 - he is responsible for the vast majority of the actions that took place during that time. He is also responsible for the ultimate collapse of Somali civil society and government. He is not responsible for the clan on olan killings that followed in the wake of his fleeing from Somalia. Next - you will tell me Sadaam Hussien is a cuddly do-gooder who has been maligned.

Originally posted by Pure blood: Couldn't answer the question huh? Know your history before you speak again I should've known that someone who considers Barre a hero wouldn't have the wits to figure out the obvious. People rebelled against Barre because he killed, tortured, arrested without trial many in addition to his mismanagament of the economy, the massive corruption and bribery endemic in his government and not to mention the distatrous war with Ethiopia in which he sacrificed so many for ill conceived and selfish reasons.

Originally posted by Pure blood: quote: the country engaged in clan killings never before witnessed in its history. I think that is out of ignorance, and lack of knowledge about Somali history. Tell me, why did those people rebel against Jalle Maxamed Siyaad Bare (allah haa uu naxariisto)? What were there reasons of getting rid of him? I want a precise answer, starting with the first group of treasonous, what was the motive of their rebellion? Obviously they didn't think he was just, genuine, nationalistic and free of clan hatred. Why do people rebel? Why are people rebeling in Nepal? Rather straightforward isn't it.

Originally posted by Pure blood: it’s because of the false stories your mother and father has told you guys, that gives you the impression that Jalle Maxamed Siyaad Bare (allah haa uu naxariisto) was a bad leader; contrary to what has been told to you in your upbringing, he was not a bad leader, but a just, genuine, nationalistic, and free of clan hatred leader. He was such a just, genuine and nationalistic leader free of clan hatred that at the end of his reign he was forced out of power and driven from the country and the country engaged in clan killings never before witnessed in its history. Fantasy is for children buddy - wake up and face reality. :mad: Back to the original question - there are no grand, inspirational leaders but as others have voiced - there are many individuals doing heroic acts within their families, communities etc. They are the ones that are building up Somalia at the grassroots level.

One farah is readily interchangeable with another - but weren't the Vikings stoic? I think it was some form of dyslexia on my part. :eek:

Originally posted by Modesty: Yes, Siyad Barre was a hero in my book. He was the only man with the courage and strength to unite a nation of clannish rivaleries. He gave money to clans that felt were outnumbered, he built the great road that connects Puntland and kunfurta...and many people in that area told me without that road they don't even know how they would manage to live. Today, there is no such man that can do half of what Siyad Barre did for Somalia, when he was in power we were a people with pride, and we somewhat had respect in the international community. Today, even if Abdulahi Yusuf is the president, although I admit he is a strong leader, I don't think he can unite the country as better as Siyad Barre did. Allah ha uu naxaristo. This is appalling - It would be wrong to say he did nothing positive - but his overall record is horrible and resulted in the civil war and ultimate collapse of Somalia. How you can mention hero and Barre in the same sentence is beyond incomprehensible.

Originally posted by Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar: quote:Nr 429 on the list of detainees is KHADR, OMAR AHMED: Somali holding a Canadian Nationality. Cumar Axmed Qadar Soomaali ma'aha. He is a Canadian-born teenager of Masaari descendant. yes - I wonder what the source of this thread is?

^oh lighten up - that was funny. Especially the Somali rendition of cheeseburger