You're preaching to the deaf, blind, but never mute in here, gentlemen

Gentlemen, In all seriousness, let's call it quits on that topic. Oodka, xaalka iska bixi Wallee, ninka waad ka xanaajisey maanta.... I'm afraid all Qowdhans (as some term us here) might get banned from the site on account of you, Oodka So, baliis, min fadlak, xaalka inaga bixi;)

Actually that was my writing(at the risk of being immodest), but we're both on the same page when it comes to this adventure.

^^^ Oh, Oh.... I see the sword heading for Che's neck in the next move

^^^Hassan Sheikh is sticking to his guns thus far. Meanwhile, in another convo with Oodka in another thread: Actually the interesting times start about now with the Jubbaland project. For, before Hassan Sheikh and his supporters even begin to play a role in the struggle for power in this region, the current Somali partners of the Kenyans must first settle on a formal leadership. This is where it gets interesting. For if you remember, there were two related groups of armed militias and political groupings originally backing this project from the beginning: Ras Kamboni of the Ahmed Madoobe variety and Azania of the Prof. Gandhi variety. Ahmed Madoobe was supported by significant personalities within the Kenyan security/intelligence apparatus as well as by Farah Moallim. Even the charcoal sales are handled by a company specifically set up for that purpose by Farah Moallim's nephew. Prof. Gandhi, on the other hand, was supported by Yusuf Haji, the previous Defense Minister and now currently Senator. Ever since the armed push into Jubbaland commenced, Ahmed Madoobe seemed to have the upper hand, given his group was the more militarily reliable and disciplined. However, recent rumblings show all is not well in that corner. We await what moves behind the scenes Yusuf Haji makes to empower his 'man', at the expense of the other....

Somali government will not recognise Jubbaland conference, Guled says Abdirahman Hussein Guled, Somali Minister of Interior and National Security. Sabahi Sunday, April 21, 2013 The Somali Federal Government will not recognise decisions reached by the ongoing Jubbaland state formation conference in Kismayo, Interior and National Security Minister Abdikarim Hussein Guled said on Friday (April 19th). "The federal government has earlier made clear its position towards the Kismayo conference and I am now replicating it -- the government will not recognise the outcome of the Kismayo conference," he said, according to Somalia's RBC Radio. "Despite [the fact that] the meeting was organised by Somali citizens, the conference still lacks legitimacy and is against the country's constitution." Abdinasir Serar, spokesman for the Ras Kamboni militia, which has led Kismayo's interim administration, called on the Somali government to recognise Jubbaland, Radio Mustaqbal reported. He said the government must rectify any mistake from the Kismayo conference, but stressed that Jubbaland fits within the constitutional framework of federalism. Source: Sabahi

As we continue to hijack this thread Actually the interesting times start about now with the Jubbaland project. For, before Hassan Sheikh and his supporters even begin to play a role in the struggle for power in this region, the current Somali partners of the Kenyans must first settle on a formal leadership. This is where it gets interesting. For if you remember, there were two related groups of armed militias and political groupings originally backing this project from the beginning: Ras Kamboni of the Ahmed Madoobe variety and Azania of the Prof. Gandhi variety. Ahmed Madoobe was supported by significant personalities within the Kenyan security/intelligence apparatus as well as by Farah Moallim. Even the charcoal sales are handled by a company specifically set up for that purpose by Farah Moallim's nephew. Prof. Gandhi, on the other hand, was supported by Yusuf Haji, the previous Defense Minister and now currently Senator. Ever since the armed push into Jubbaland commenced, Ahmed Madoobe seemed to have the upper hand, given his group was the more military reliable and disciplined. However, recent rumblings show all is not well in that corner. We await what moves behind the scenes Yusuf Haji makes to empower his 'man', at the expense of the other....

Oodka, This Qatari funding has annoyed both the Ethiopians and Kenyans. If anything, it was instrumental in the Kenyans bringing the Ethiopians, reluctantly, on board with some of their projects

Oodweyne;940851 wrote: And in that sense this period will come to resembled - in its intrigue and and in it's client-beholden reality - to that era of late 19th century which was the period in which heavy competition for influence between the Turks, the Brits, the French, the Italians and lastly the Egyptians, did happened. Oodka, I take off my hat to you!!! I recently went to a gathering where a well-known strategist from the National Defense University(U.S.) was meeting with certain sheikhs(of the oil variety) to have an exchange of ideas between 'friends'. He, precisely, used the 19th Century model as his prognosis of 21st Century power projections among big powers. And on a different note, I see that you've discovered the Qatari-funding pipeline for Hassan Sheikh from reading your recent postings. As you remember, I was reluctant to share that detail last year during the period shortly after his election - but kept hinting that there was a new source of significant funding(by Somali standards) for the new Mogadishu administration.

Oodweyne Point well taken... But I was referring to Sharif not knowing the bigger plans afoot in the larger region. What's depressing is the lack of any insight from most Somalis(in particular Somali leadership) on the changing geopolitical landscape in the region. The game is much bigger than a few barrels of oil found in East Africa which is where the usual conspiracy theories point to But as you know, that's not a discussion for an open Forum such as this...

Isn't this putting the cart before the horse?? Waar, heshiiya marka hore, then we can take up the issue of looted properties! The clans hate each other's guts yet some expect the 'opposing' clan to give back something without reconciliation. What universe do you live in? All Somalis who had any disposable income invested in Xamar. The former Somalia was a one-city state.... Yet you only have certain corners blathering on and on about looted properties. Stop with the smoke screens to distract from the more immediate problems of the day. The number one problem in the South is lack of reconciliation - not Al Shabaab, in my opinion. Everything else is secondary. If you can't understand that simple issue, then get ready to continue living the next 6 generations in the diaspora.

Oodka, An interesting summary of Sharif's short time in office. As for Boston, all I can say to the gallery is: I told you so Even down to the school he would be affiliated with (Boston University). http://www.somaliaonline.com/community/showthread.php/68283-Sharif-Ahmed-Temporary-Permanent-Move-to-the-U.S. Anymore than that, I can't currently expand on but there are much bigger games being played.... Games that even Sharif is not aware of, even though he's a willing pawn in the game....

LOL @ Xaaji X and Wadani! You guys are trying to reason/argue with a collective guilty conscience that needs deniability for various reasons Here comes the various anecdotes: "I knew of XYZ of the SNM clan who participated in Siyaad's military, etc."

Classified;940483 wrote: SNM rebels were fighting against Siad's government prior to 1988. The rebels started fighting with Mengistu's support in early 1980-1981. From 1981-1987, Siad Barre's government didn't bombard or kill civilians in Hargeisa or Burco. Only after SNM rebels attacked and captured parts of Hargeisa and Burco (with urban warfare) did the Government take all measure possible to liberate Hargeisa and Burco from SNM rebels whom were backed, equipped and financed by Ethiopia's Mengistu regime. How is that a War crime? Any government in the World would retake it's cities if Rebels that are transparently supported by your enemy attacks your cities and kills your citizens. ^^^^ Exhibit A Waa wakhtigii maryaha la dhigi jirey!

Oba, I see you're updating yourself on the painful history of the past! Maybe, now you can understand why some cry falsely about some 'manufactured' genocide committed by SL against the Khatumo folks - in order to cover up an actual documented genocide that always eventually leads to their backyards. This was the reason for the crocodile tears shed for Gen. Ali Samater - a fear of where this precedent could lead since it proved quite simple to win the case(against Samater) in a fair, balanced, and advanced legal system. You can imagine the pressure that was brought to bear on the poor, bewildered PM Saacid to immediately and officially ask for immunity for Samater.

^^ Waa khuukhda habeenkii lagu seexin jirey!

Oodweyne, Kildhigga maxaa karka ka keeney?

Carafaat;940428 wrote: According to A_Khadar and Khatumo's senior Foreign Affairs Spokesman, Xaglatoosiye fled from SNM. Darn it!!! That crystal ball needs to be cleaned again

Waranle_Warrior;940424 wrote: Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events and small minds discuss people. Waranle_Warrior;940424 wrote: Mintid, a small mind, that always discusses about what other people got or not, haha a weak man's meek. Do you see the contradiction?? Maybe not

Gentlemen, We want Faroole to stay! 5 more years for Faroole. He and his fiefdom have proved an effective buffer zone against dangerous elements from further afield. A man who understands his limitations and along with his sons concentrates on those limitations, while hardly paying attention to diaspora fantasies of 'certain-mythical-glory-days'. The man knows what he's doing and how to be a responsible partner where it counts

The pain the loss of that 'Prime Minister's' seat has caused in certain corners.... That 'seat' represented an international microphone to blast certain 'propaganda' about the significance of certain regions and constituencies in the larger Somali context. Xaaji, you need to take the above affliction into consideration when you ask 'what has Hassan Sheikh done to you?'

Stoic, Take it easy on the fellas.... Lately, a lot of roads 'baa soo xidhmay', so they're allowed a bit of venting and name-calling. We're still waiting on how the final birth of the Jubbaland 'baby' ends up. Meanwhile, the attempt to drag SL into the 'Somalia' quagmire has been sidestepped and Khaatumo,well..... I'll stop it there re:Khaatumo issue to avoid the risk of further alienating some of the Somalilanders from those regions. So if a picture by Amin Amir somewhere in the cold of the West brings comfort to their dreams of how the Somali peninsula should be,................ don't begrudge them that right.......

Ayoub, Our brothers from the East continuously show no interest in their traditional homeland, Puntland, except as a mere bargaining chip to relocate to greener pastures, whether it's Mogadishu last season or the Jubba Valley this season. I refer in particular to the huge diaspora of that community which never had a strong tie with their ancestral Puntland. Most were driven out of Mogadishu and its environs(post 1990) and hold no love for the harsh lifestyle of Bari, Nugaal, or Mudug. Case in point: even after years of relative peace, you hardly hear of an entire Puntland family from the diaspora moving back to Puntland, only the men return to pursue business opportunities. It's more realistic to imagine mass diaspora migration to Mogadishu and surrounding cities in the South in the next decade than the towns of Puntland. Note: an oil find by the recent wildcatters in Puntland could have changed this trajectory, but unfortunately for our Eastern brothers, that 'get-rich-scheme' failed with a silent wimper...

Mintid Farayar;939700 wrote: The May 15 local elections in Puntland were recently postponed indefinitely. This adversely affects the expected January 2014 selection of a new President for Puntland. Faroole's decision to extend his term, the lack of an electoral register(part of the original plan), and mistrust between the different sub-clans is contributing to a growing unease below the surface. This issue does not receive the attention it deserves among Puntland expatriate websites due to the attention paid to the Jubba project (in order to limit the growing power of Mogadishu). As for the internal media within Puntland,.... Faroole has long banned all unfriendly media outlets starting with the radio stations. When it comes to the emerging political organizations within this Puntland democratization experiment, Midnimo, with its Bari-constituency remains the only serious challenge thus far to Faroole's Horseed. http://www.somaliaonline.com/community/showthread.php/70737-Former-Somalia-PM-Ina-Gaas-Joins-Udad-Party?p=939700#post939700

^^Ace, Excellent points! All of them!