Democracy on Trial I find the title of this thread morbidly surreal. How can Momma Democracy be ON TRAIL? For what? For feeding, housing, educating, employing, making peace and facilitating development and progress? What political ideology in practice TODAY can seriously compete with Momma Democracy? I'm not talking about what MIGHT in the future but what is extant TODAY. I look around the world today and people are literally throwing themselves at Momma Democracy's feet. In their lands they tend to gravitate towards principles espoused by Momma Democracy. Here we're talking about Democracy on trail. If that is not misplaced priority, I don't know what is. Since most of you live in democracies, you'all are living, eating, breathing proof that democracy IS better than all else that exists. Because you live in peace, are fed, sheltered, educated, employed with unmatched and undream of personal liberties. This is not to say it is perfect or it's flaws shouldn't b. But considering the fact as Somalis we have clanism, ignorance, woeful illiteracy rates, worst WHO, Unicef and UN statistics... all that you guys deem worthy of lengthy serious discussion is the shortcomings of the ONLY political system today that can redeem itself. I'm lost for words!

Originally posted by sheherazade: Ooolala. Did I hit a nerve homeboy? Infuriated, are you? No, you haven't jangled a nerve nor did you infuriate me (and you'll never will) but clearly I'm disappointed. Plainly detectable from my previoius post. For one, regarding disclosing what I sent you with the trust that it'll remain private. Disclosing private messages is unprincipled behaviour and your risible excuse that Mentioning the existence of said PM is unethical for me but some people(you) only get it when it's explained to you in a language you understand quite frankly doesn't wash. It reveals you're the type of person that believes end justifies the means. Where you really shoot yourself in the foot is with your blatant lies and misrepresentation of what transpired. I only sent you 1 PM, not the multiple PMs you allege. Further, my apology was conditional, wasn't it? If memory serves me right, I said IF you were vexed please accept my apology... I went on to say it was all for jest (which it is and always was!) and concluded with remark to the effect that IF you weren't incensed in anyway disregard this PM. Isn't that pretty much ALL that I EVER sent you? Do you want me to send you PMs, is that what this is all about? Initially you said I sent you apologetic PMS, here is what you said: Apologetic PMs and a persistent public belligerence. If that was a typo, slip of the tongue... you're forgiving, its understandable. But you said the same thing and even went further when you said this in another separate post: Unsolicitied apologies and assurances that he'd leave me alone. There were NO apologies or assurances dear Sheh, you're making that up. You yourself admitted here: Let me help you out: You(Socod) sent me(Sheh) ONE PM. Now, ONE PM is not the same thing as PM s, is it? Of course unless the palpably ludicrous -- that you're linguistically challenged -- is true. There is both qualitative and quantitative difference between 'apology' and 'apologies' or between 'PMs' and 'PM'. Obviously it helps you immensely to say I'm bombarding you with apologetic PMs all the while using you as my proverbial puching bag when I'm feeling bellicose. But that isn't what tranpired, is it Sheh? You lied and once you lay you can't ask to be trusted. Everything you say from this day henceforth must be taken with a pinch of salt. If you feel wronged enough, run to Admin. What for? I'm having fun. It's a dog-eat-dog world. Woof. Ah-woooooo, watch out for warewolves of London Ah-woooooo, they typically maul little puppies ah-woooooooo

Originally posted by sheherazade: Socod, aren't you a two-faced lil so-and-so. Apologetic PMs and a persistent public belligerence. Quite a speciman of a man. PMs? Don't flatter yourself darling. I swear to God I never sent you ANY PMs. I did send you a single PM, its content echoing what I've said to you and others in public. Namely, not to take some of my bizzare suggestions and behaviours to heart since mostly I'm playing around. You're chastising me for apologizing any misunderstandings :confused: Now, I challenge you to produce the 'apologIES' and PMs I sent you. I dare you to produce a single PM containing anything I didn't say in the open. CAR!!!! If you're trying to besmirch me, you're failing. I won't leave you alone until you produce the alleged PMs and apologies or they don't exist 'cause you made them up.

Originally posted by Yeniceri: That's just depressing! Meanwhile, in some U.S. states, Arabs are made the villians in a campaign for stricter license laws. I'm curious, does it depress you also how non-arabs are treated in arab lands by arabs?

Originally posted by Castro: In other words, NO TOUCHING . Hence the jail sentence. You dig? True, without permission no touching. But woman like Ahura want to convince us that the reason they wear teasing clothes is not to elicit our attention. I mean come on, we're not that credulous. Lets be honest, no woman (al least no normal woman) would mind being complimented for her looks. But the jail sentence is over the top, certainly not fitting the crime. You're telling me this dude will be thrown in the slammer for about the same time Martha Stewart spent in jail? This one of the symptom of hyper-legislation fever gripping the West of lately.

Originally posted by Ahura: STOIC , men grope women out of uncontrollable lust? Don't make me laugh. The eejits do it to harrass. Groping, wolf-whistles, suggestive and sexist comments at women are all forms of Street Harassment . Why should women accept it? A woman has every right to walk down the street without fear of being groped or sexually assaulted. Street harassment of women need to stop and the law needs to be brought up to date to protect them. Spare me the melodrama. Women crave to be complimented for their bodies. In fact they demand it and if you don't give 'em they scold you. Why would a woman wear body-hugging clothes if not to attract male eyes? Why wear high heels if not to draw attention? Certainly not for the comfort. Personally I think the best compliment you can pay to a woman is to tell her she has nice pair of juggs, exquisite bottom, appetizing waist and you'd love nothing but to ravish her. That is insuperable compliment.

Originally posted by Castro: SB, I hear ya atheer. Yours is like if I'm gonna be wrong, I might as well have only myself to blame, right? You got that right spot on. But I , Castro, hate to be wrong and to minimize that, I'd expand my sources rather than reduce them. I don't object to seeking clarifications from recognised erudite muslims. Neither did I intend to portray this subject as a case of the blind leading the blind. No question, some learned muslims possess a far greater and factual knowledge of Islam than say your average muslim like myself. But what I'm against is this notion that Wadaads are, prima facie, right in their interpretation of Islam. I think you'd agree it's prevalent conviction among muslims. Wadaads/Imaams are not only revered but considered near saints. To me that is a bit unsettling because we have NO WAY of verifying if what they propagate is what was really intended by Allah. We have established, I'm assuming since you haven't disagreed with me thus far, that any learned muslim's reading of Islam CAN be wrong so why give him benefit of the doubt? Why not be skeptical, inquisitive... look for answers not only from Caalims but also from the fruits of your labour? But these are personal preferences and quarelling over them is futile. I agree it really comes down to personal preference. As in equivalent? How could that be saaxib? No one is worshipping a caalim no matter how good he or she is. Period. By worship I meant worshiping what the caalim said. Not worship him as a person per se (although some muslims go very close to doing just that!). If what you worship is attained from a caalim then it follows that the caalim is indispensable middle-man between Allah and you. I don't know what you'd call such person.

Originally posted by Ahura: Is that suppose to justify it? If there is no offense, there is nothing needing justification now is there? If I ruled the world I'd encourage women to grope, beat, abuse (physically, mentally and verbally) men. I would basically let them get away with everything (pilfering, murder, rape, lesbianism), I'd outlaw cliterectomy, no more female genital mutilation... but there is a catch! They forfeit the right to ref and play football (soccer). Have you seen women play football. Argh!!! I better not say anything I got enough people already chafed at me.

Originally posted by WaTerLily: At the end, he was responsible for his actions, you dont see women groping men... I think his punishment should have been to be groped in return, in public to humiliate him. One year of yor life seems a bit much. Are you serious? Women groping men is not a crime. By that I mean no man would object to being groped by a woman. She must be good looking of course 'cause only Lord knows someone woman are so hard to look at one risks going deaf!

Everyone Jimca-Lee is few screws short. It is not unexpected many of you (ladies) would find her opinions impalatable.

Originally posted by sheherazade: Has the world run out of women that u have to adolescence-snatch? Tell me, what's in it for him? Her? The parents? Society? These are not rhetorical questions, bro. Help me out here. Now, biliis, when and how and for whom is it OK? Stop asking questions. You wouldn't understand the replies you get anyway since you're a woman. When you grow to become a man it will all make sense to you. We live in a merciless dog-eat-dog world with a touch of inequality. If you're a woman, life already suks for you. If YOU'RE A child you simply got no life.

Originally posted by BonefieD_CriTic: But no one can deny the fact that the Muslim problem revolves around them and the U.S. - I would deny that.

Originally posted by Castro: SB, saaxib, are you basically telling me you have a better chance of understanding the actual message from God yourself rather than from someone who studies the Quran, Sunnah and Fiqh as a lifetime vocation because then you'd be learning their biased understanding of Islam? Not entirely accurate re-sketching. I said learning Islam from any learned muslim is tantamount to worshiping a man's understanding of Islam. Obviously everyone's reading of Islam will equally be less than perfect. That would include me as well. But at least I'll be worshiping what I gleaned from original sources than what someone said to me.

You Arsenal fans are something. Let me guess all this love for arsenal was precipitated by their victory over R. Madrid, right? A team in shambles and out of shape (beaten 6-1 by Zaragoza week before). One win in the bizzare gooner fan world equates to team in rich vain of form, on a winning streak, out to crush everyone in the way... this, among other reasons, is why I'm not gooner fan. I'm spared such perverted delusions. I have yet to meet a NORMAL gooner fan. Each one of them is missing something. If it isn't an eye, it's tendency to plaintively whine. Arsenal is mediocre!

Originally posted by Castro: quote:Originally posted by Socod_badne: How many sects and schools of thoughts are in Islam? Innumerable. Exactly! That proves my point. I don't think it does good SB. It only proves that there are many sects and schools of thought in Islam. Castro, my original arguement was when you go to learn Islam from any erudite muslim regardless of his educational background, status or reputation within the Islamic community, you are getting a fallible man's understanding of Islam. Not unquestionably what Allah wanted of you. Of course, I understand this doesn't 'prove' that particular learned muslim you went to learn from got it wrong. However, the simple undeniable fact that there are other erudite muslims of equal if not higher status, all offering you variagated understandings of Islam all the while citing you as their source the Quran and Hadeeths does dampen, to put it midly, any confidence regarding the accuracy and even sometimes the objectivity of what they present to you as Allah's commands. With that backdrop, what better way can one show the unreliability of what is propagated by certain schools/sects of Islam than to point out the comical fact that they all say different things about the same subject? That is reason I cited all the myriad understandings of Islam by various sects and sub-sects as 'prove' with the caveat it's not 'prove' in the traditional sense of the word. Your analogy with Profs teaching physics and calculus is incongruent. There is no room for interpretation in physics and mathematics. When working with them we HAVE a set of unbiased guidlines/rules to work with. Mathematics has its own rules (logic), science has to comply with invariable natural laws. No serious scientist or mathematician would contemplate any ideas that don't comply with established universal guidelines for each discipline. Same is not interpreting Islam. Objective criteria is absent, whatever exists is subjective and carries prejudices. Saaxib I don't know how much Arabic you know but as a fluent reader and writer of the language, I assure you the Quran is no layman's book. I don't speak arabic (I can read ok but don't understand too well). But linguistic difficulties are altogether different kettle of fish, wouldn't you think? Unintelligible or difficult language/s can be overcome by translation. Unarguably some of the original information will be lost in the process. I can live with that, confident in the knowledge that it is far less biased. I can verify this myself by comparing different translations. Matter of fact is the sharpest differences are between those considered experts in arabic, not your average muslim! It is true that there are many schools of thoughts and opinions but it's never on anything but peripheral and minor issues. Castro, I hope you reflect on what you said above. Your judgement, that the differences are 'minor', is highly subjective to say the least and prejudiced if one was to be harsh. What unbiased guidelines (meaning from Allah!) did you use to render the extant differences as minor and not major? Some sects go to extreme lengths in distinguishing themselves from mainstream Islamic thinking. At times shedding blood to preserve it or even laying down their lifes for it.

What's everyone's predictions? I say Chelsea will win 5-0

Originally posted by sweet_gal: But there's nothing wrong with learning from people who are more knowledgable than u. Now, I didn't object to that did I? Who do you worship? Allah or the Ulema? If Allah, then get your guidlines from him... straight from horse's mouth sort to speak. When you depend on fallible man to tell you what to worship, you're worshiping what that particular Imaam/shiekh THINKS you should. Not necessarily what Allah wants of you. How many sects and schools of thoughts are in Islam? Innumerable. Exactly! That proves my point. All those sects and schools of thoughts claim to believe in Islam while at the same time having different opinions of it. That is only possible because not everone sees things the same leading to different interpretations of a single text. When you accept that, you'll understand where I'm coming from.

Originally posted by Jimca Lee: If anybody should be barred from driving, it should be senior citizens especially those that drive 40 mph on the I-5 express lanes. God lord, waayeelka are so eager to meet the reaper they don't mind taking you along for company. Just plain scary. Oh Mods! Mods!!! How can you let this egregious slander against us oldsters pass without admonishment? Has it come to this... a time when anyone can feel worry-free to take gratuitous jibes at us senior citizens? At least have the human decency to delete it. This is absolutely unacceptable. I feel utterly disgusted! Someone pass me a bucket I'm gonna throw up! Jimca-Lee, Awoowe, maanta aad iyo aad baadh iga xanaajisey! Saa u socotay adhoo inan fiican oo sharaf badhan lahaa baadh na hor timidh oo na ogeysiisay 'aniga waa leygu khasaaray.' Maxaa ku galay? Sheydaan baa?

Originally posted by Amelia: I guess this is a good time as any to tell you all about my 1/4th chinese ancestry and another 1/4th yemeni. I believe you. I also believe my eyes!

Originally posted by Jafarel.: How many times did John Terry handle in the area this season??.. You did not see JT handle the ball. It wasn't even his hand for crying out loud! What you saw was the hand of GOD! You were witness to miracles. Now, prostrate in reverence every time you see the Legend JT.

Originally posted by Ducaqabe: SB, are you saying we don’t need the Culumaa to teach us our religion? No culuma would be teaching you YOUR religion. They'll be teaching you theirs.

Originally posted by sweet_gal: Everyone who's somali should know the word Tibisho. Or I thought everyone would know........... Possibly true but I'm not Somali. My parents are. I think you got the answer from Ducaqabe.

I don't know any. I prefer my news first hand. Second hand news doesn't do it for me. Why don't people learn their religion on their own?

What language does the word belong to? It sounds Japanese. I could be wrong.

Originally posted by The_Notorious_187: Come down off that high gambar of yours and give credit where its due!! I did. Arsenal deserved their victory, kudos to them. I didn't, however, accuse them of cheating for which they're really notorious for and is how they earn most of their wins. I concede Pires didn't dive (OK, he wasn't playing but who cares), Lehman wasn't a drama queen except for a brief few minutes, Wenger didn't whine (so far!) and wink at the refs (why does he do that btw? very strange) and Henry did at least on 1 occasion jump (since he can't jump). What else do you want?