Originally posted by ThePoint: And the reference by Modesty to that strength is something I can fully understand. That said - I will not be relocating to Somalia anytime soon. I see that you got your nice little disclaimer at the end. But only after huffing and puffing for a bit. That's cool. We're all on the same page but not the same paragraphs. Blessed got it right. Naden is just angry and I didn't think anyone could be angrier than I am. That's cool too. But sister Modesty is glossing over stuff. It ain't all caano geel iyo shaax. It's death, destruction and devestation with some caano geel and shaax. That point about the passports is not racist. If you continually call the people who took you in kaafirs and lowlives, the very least you can do is not parade their passports all over the world. I won't move to Somalia until my girls have grown up and have become independent inshaAllah. Then I'll go back to spend my last years there. I'll then help wherever I can and get me a minyar or two.

Blessed, this is what the gripe is all about: Originally posted by Modesty: Everyone who lives in the darkness of kafir lands should visit a muslim country,............ you see people who might not even have anything to eat but they never frown or get depressed, people here have strong faith and trust in Allah, their culture and faith is so untainted by kafirism.

Timely article indeed. Don't you think it's a little on the wishful thinking part? Here's what I gathered from it. To get back to the glory of the early Islamic renaissance, Muslims should: 1) Dismantle these fictitious and colonial borders to become one nation. 2) Apply the Sharia law to matters of governance, trade, finance and basically every aspect of life. 3) Deal with external entities (the West, Asia, etc..) with the fairnes our prophet (pbuh) did in his years as a trader. Among other things. This is a collosal undertaking saaxib. I'm not even sure it's remotely feasible. A few (major) wars (internally and externally) will have to occur before any of that comes about. Don't you think?

^ I agree and finally some substantive rebuttal. Let's see what naden has to say. This should be interesting. And please refrain from the cheerleading. Only I am allowed to do that around here.

LOL. Thanks for the dedication Nuurow. If you think I've been hard on you, you're right, but not without a reason saaxib. There's just so much shidh going on in Somalia and in the exiled community (including men walking out on ther wives and kids to satisfy their itch) that polygamy takes more than it's fair share from eNuri. When I read last week of the drownings of Somalis in the Red Sea (again) and another eNuri polygamy post, I blew a gasket. Adding insult to injury, it seemed good Nur was telling the first wives to be patient and try to be happy for the new couple. Saaxib that's just wrong. But unlike some other advocates of this minyar-mania, I've a feeling your heart is pure. It's just in the wrong place at the moment. I know there's nothing you can do about Somalia and it's unfair to ask you to. But, you can speak of the ills. You can remind nomads to raise money for the starving and the thirsty. You can show, using your natural instinct and humor, how what is happening back home is only a reflection of the divisions that also exist in exile. There's just so many other pertinent issues for eNuri to target. In short, I want you to raise the bar again. You say you've done it on this forum before and I don't disagree. Lately, however, you've gotten lazy. I can be lazy, and often am, but you can't. You have an explicit, self-declared, mandate. You just need to work on fulfilling that. Leave this minyar business alone but if you must, speak of the damage absentee fatherhood is causing our community here, there and everywhere. The lack of role models, father figures and other deficiencies. You can target students and da'wa. Or students and student loans. The market is, literally, ripe for eNuri to make a larger and more concrete footprint in the lives of many. I won't harass you anymore. I hope you catch my drift. P.S. And contrary to popular belief on these boards, Sheh and I did not form an anti-eNuri front. If you pay close attention and though I agree with hers as well, our grievances are not quite the same.

Originally posted by Mr. Jibis: They most likely realized that the "West" is not as great and beautiful like they thought it would. "Freedom", they found out, means freedom to do whatever you want, and that includes some of the most disgusting and appalling behaviour thought of by the human mind. Mr. Jibis, thank you for your sympathy because we need it. If I may bring your attention, however, to some of the most digusting and appalling behavior thought of by the human mind. No, I'm not thinking men shagging men, goats or even cats, I'm thinking of cold-blooded murder; rape of innocent girls, women and even the elderly; terrorizing hunderds of thousands even millions of people for decades. That's more appalling to me than, say, my neighbor who likes to shag his pet rabbit. What say you saaxib? I'm not being hostile saaxib but we just need to put things in perspective. If sins carried points (as does the immigration system in Canada, e.g.), I'd say taking an innocent life carries more weight than say shagging a bird, would you agree? We have a great faith but terrible lands and the west has no faith with great lands. I think we Muslims in the west got the best of both worlds, don't you think? P.S. And how could I forget the most appalling (in my opinion) of these crimes in the homeland: throwing men, women and children who can't swim and with no life-jackets off boats on the high seas in the middle of the night. Killing one of those people is like killing all of humanity. Forget shagging rodents, saaxib, what's going on back home is beyond words.

^ LOL. Katrina, I think you need some industrial strength biif baaf yourself. We need more nadens not less.

^ Good point. Those who're in the west wish they were back home and those back home pray day and night that they make it to the west. It's as if the wrong ones made it out here. Originally posted by Viking: Sharmarkee, Don't you think the values of a liberal party like Lib-Dems might be irreconcillable with Islamic doctrines? Do you? And if yes, what do you propose instead of what Sharmarke suggests? I would like to hear you expand on this, good Viking, and I'm not being facetious.

^ Are you flabbergasted enough to put an end to it? The topic I mean.

^ Do you, or anyone else, have anything of value to say in rebuttal to naden's poignantly truthful points? Anything? Modesty, abaayo may you have a safe and enjoyable trip. Tell our brothers and sisters there that we've failed them and on judgement day we will pay for our apathy and impotence.

Originally posted by LaVie: Ok people, so SB is not so inclined in swallowing without questioning the teachings of the Sunnah, hence pray tell what’s wrong with that!? Outright rejection of the Sunnah is unacceptable in Islam. Is it Kufr? I don't know. I do believe however that as "inquisitive" as SB is, he will come around to the truth and see what the Sunnah is, IA. The problem with threads like these is that they bring out the worst in all of us and while we shout over each other and call each other names, we are all left with a bad taste in our mouths and little or no understanding. Speaking of bad taste, Kashanre babbled: ^Castro, you do not need to take yourself away from the "group" to stay mainstream walaal. Are we without principle, also ? Lama huraan waa caws jiilaal. We're both resigned to our fates I suppose. Yours is to utter nonsense and mine is to repeatedly hit you upside the head. Unlike you, I don't look to be in groups. Belonging to cliques covers the inadequacies and insecurties of the individual, hence their appeal to you. Whatever your definitions of mainstream, faithful and principled, they are ones I'd rather not be associated with. I'll make this my last beating of you (in this topic), for it's unfair that I repeatedly use my guns when all you and Khayr have are butter knives.

^ Volunteer? Donate organs? Join and give back to the community that snatched them out of the jaws of despair and war? Naden, you're kidding me right? Never. :rolleyes: Originally posted by Kashanre: ^True walaal but the poltician in me wants to address one last point. Politican? I could've sworn it was just shidh. Johhny, saaxib, I strongly urge you not to belittle the "dogma" and doctrines of Islam. Some Muslims like Khayr and Khashanre are obviously eligible (and often beg) for ridicule. That's your prerogative. Be careful what you say though about the faith. Even if you find it "absurd" it behooves you to keep that to yourself. Nin kuu digay kuma dilin.

Originally posted by Nur: Yes, eNuri as a business is competing in the free world of thoughts, with unique products that have consumers as we speak, our completion being the masking of Islamic principles with Christian traditions of strict monogamy. At eNuri, we advocate Islam, and we are very proud to say that over and over, being a single unwed woman for too long is also painful, a Farax who knows that what Allah has made Xalaal is made haraam by his wife is also painful, Farax can then think of divorce to get what he wants, only foucing on his side of the problem, ignoring the other side of the equation, kids and wife, feels that he is confined, being married to a husband who is entertaining the idea of polygamy for a woman is like sitting on a dormant volcano, the sooner a woman takes control of the situation the better, her options are sharing her husband or divorce, divorce has two parties, both are unhappy, polygamy has three parties, one is unhappy. At a time when the Ummah (specially Somalia) faces crises on many fronts, Nur has chosen to focus instead on sex, marriage and invisible hand-shakes. Worthy causes in and of themselves but in the greater scheme of things, specially in these times we live in, utterly trivial. I understand eNuri is an enterprise but its goals are unclear and its focus unadjusted at the moment. And knowing full well how difficult the conditions Allah placed on having multiple wives, the enterprise still chooses polygyny as it's flagship product. No matter. Nur ought to know that "competing in the free world of thoughts" also allows consumers to let their wallets (in this case coming to shop or learn from eNuri) do the voting. Superficial and sensationalistic looks at a narrow field of issues spells disaster for eNuri and may ultimately relegate it to obscure and irrelevant areas of the discourse. Certainly not a place where eNuri nor its ever decreasing fan base would like to be. Nin kuu digay kuma dilin.

Any Muslim (should) know what God's purpose for us in this life is. That it is "to worship and bow down" is also a given. The manifestation of that worship comes in many forms. Those who understand the message are humbled by it. They share with and care about their fellow Muslims and humans. They carry on their business of this life and the next without any flashing neon signs screaming "look at me, I'm a pious Muslim". Then there are those who, for some reason or the other, find it necessary to scream that line whenever they're within whispering distance of anyone and in the same breath call anyone within shouting distance a kaafir. That is subterfuge. It's not your business who believes in what. Muhammad (scw) said lakum diinakum waliya deen. Who are you, as 21st century cyber-mullahs no less, to call anyone a kaafir? Your words (probably your actions offline too) are nothing but contempt for others since without denigrating them you can't see yourselves in a positive light. These are telltale signs of an impotent mind and a heart darkened with sickness. You can beat your chests and scream as loud as you want. Do know, however, that no one here cares about your personal beliefs as none of you will be sharing a grave with anyone else. That we have to share this life on earth (and this forum) with you is a most unfortunate event. My purpose in life is to help alleviate the suffering of my fellow man.

Originally posted by Kashanre: ^One behalf of the SOL family members who have noticed the baiting game of certain athiest folk, thank you. What's amazing is the that, even though "we" never go after "them", they are always looking for a way to antogonize us. We do not go after them because we know what will be their end, so could they baiting us mean they are not completely sure of how and why their deviation of the right path occurred? What grim future has befallen that sperm and egg. Originally posted by Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar: Waala ogaa inaad diinlaawe ahayd, oo wax badan ayaa is qarisay, oo shib lagaa ahaa. Golaha kale [other Soomaali forums] ee Soomaalida ayaa ka qaraabataa adigoo Rabigeena iyo Nabigeena caay, aflagaado iyo wixii lamid ah ku haayo. [Hadaadan ismoodin in lagula socon, think again.] Intaas dhan waala soconay. Oo intaa banaanka isa soo dhigeysay ayaa la sugaaye. MMA, saaxib in the spirit of fairness and despite SB's perceived "failures", I strongly urge you to either provide us with your proof or rescind this grave accusation. That you brought this out in public forces you to do one of the things I asked above. To be sure, you either: 1) Retract your accusation or 2) Provide unambiguous proof of your claim.

What have you done for Somalia? I've done no harm.

Originally posted by Ducoqabe: Conversation between two potential "lovers"! .......... snip ............... Brother: I don't know you and I guess you're not the most beautiful nor the most intelligent however considering that I am also not the most attractive nor intelligent person however we would make a good match is up to us to find out. Some ugly and stubidh kids to look forward to, ain't it? Horny mongrel. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Ducoqabe: Thanks Ducoqabe. Bloody imposter. :rolleyes:

^ There's a hole in my heart today. Originally posted by Mumia Abu-Jamal: Now we are waiting to hear Socod badne and Ibtisam. State clearly what is your position on this very important issue. Who cares what anyone thinks on this "important" issue, or any other issue for that matter.

What the bloody Arab league should do is to put action where its mouth is. Affirmations, condemnations, declarations and confirmations are all a bloody dime a dozen. If it it wants to see a healthy Somalia it should get on the ground and help, if not, it should shut the fcuk up.

This ain't it. Somalis pushed into sea and drown A boat sailing from Somalia forced all of its 137 passengers into deep waters off the Yemeni coast, the UN refugee agency (UNHCR) says. More than 30 of the migrants have drowned. Survivors that reached shore on Monday night says dozens more, including children, are missing. Thousands of Somalis and Ethiopians attempt to cross the Gulf of Aden each year, many hoping to reach Europe. Fearing Yemeni coast guards, smugglers often force their passengers overboard. The smuggling networks target migrants and asylum seekers and an estimated 100 people a day arrive in Yemen between September to March - when sailing conditions are at their best. However, the UNHCR says the risks of the voyage are extremely high, with passengers often paying the ultimate price. "Smugglers torture, rape and shoot their passengers if they complain. It's very dangerous," UNHCR's Peter Kessler told the BBC's Focus on Africa programme. Those aboard in this incident were Somalis and Ethiopians, including men, women and children. Bodies have been washed up along the southern coast of Yemen east of Bir Ali. "It is a sign of the fragility of the situation in Somalia and more and more Ethiopians are also opting to escape on this route," Mr Kessler says. "It's clear that the political insecurity, especially after the election in Ethiopia, are driving more people from that country to seek asylum." UN staff in Aden say they are taking care of the survivors, giving them medical help and food. Source

Brother Nur, it may also be beneficial if the necessary steps a husband-in-exile could take to make sure temptation from within (his groin) and from without ("his own abti") can be overcome. All these good policies you listed will bring a Xaliimo closer to her Maker but not necessarily closer to her baby daddy, if you know what I mean.

^ And this would be a triple post or is counting another problem for you. Originally posted by Kashanre: ..and thus all shalt be satisfied. We have high expectations; strong morals and a strong foundation among others. I see you're back to your old ways. It is true that old habits die hard. You would have a bit more credibility if only you practiced (or embodied) what you preach.

^ Indeed it was. And I learned a few more words today. Dromedary is one of them. I need to spend more time on these Somali poetry sites. I can't pass on a language that I know not. G'nite.

Try this one too: Layligu kasha biyihiisa ku jiruu ka didaa. Incidently, ten years ago this week, I challenged some nomads to collect 1000 proverbs on soc.culture.somalia. See our efforts here. I wonder what became of my proverb-possy.