I have to say Saylaci -- the defender of a group that rapes 13 year old girl and then stones her to death for adultery -- is in a tight fix. Lets see how he wiggles himself out of it. He made an extraordinary and outlandish claim that Sufis never resisted colonialism. But as the wag once said "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proofs." On what evidence is this claim based on?

Putative Ethiopian excursions or raids into Somalia often have little to do with domestic Somali politics. People assume that if Ethiopia is sighted in some dusty somali town along Ethiopia-Somalia border that it means Ethiopia has come to aid one of the belligerents in domestic squabbles. This is not necessarily true. Ethiopia is fighting a bitter counterinsurgency war and this entails crossing Somalia-Ethiopia border where insurgents may seek a safe haven to conduct operations or seek refuge from pursuing Ethiopian troops. Insurgents (mostly Somalis) assume that once they're inside Somali borders, they're safe 'cause Ethiopia wouldn't dare enter Somali territory lest they'll risk patriotic Somali backlash. In Somaliland and Puntland where there are redimentary state security apparatus in place, there's close cooperation with Ethiopia in denying insurgents refuge in Somali territory and we occasionally hear of "innocent" Somalis from Western Somalia region being arbitrarily arrested and handed over to Ethiopia. We still hear of the occasional Ethiopian "visits" of border cities in Somaliland/Puntland like when they visited Buhoodle not too long ago. But it's rare. By the same token, in S. Somalia, and in particular Hiiraan, there's no administration capable of guaranteeing security along Somalia-Ethiopia border. This is why you hear of more Ethiopian excursions into places like Balanbale, kalabeyr, doloow (in Gedo) etc than in Puntland and Somaliland. The solution is obvious and that is to support Sh. Shariif's government since only strong Somali government can protect Somali borders and hence keep out insurgents and Ethiopians. While the Economist analysis has some kernels of truth, it doesn't capture the full picture of the reality on the ground.

Originally posted by Al Zeylaci: So if the Ethiopian soldiers crossed back into border and happen to rape, say your cousin or female relative, would it be sensible? Would it be the lesser of the two evil? If Ethiopian soldiers were raping my female relatives, I'd fight them too. But why pose a hypothetical? There are no Ethiopian troops in Somalia raping Somali women today but they're the menace of Alshabaab raping 13 year old girls and then stoning them to death for adultery. At the moment, Ethiopia is definitely the lesser of two evils. Originally posted by Al Zeylaci: ps. this is only one evidence, and there are other evidences for which I cant be bothered to find the links to Please provide the "other evidence." I highly doubt you got any. What you gave is Ethiopian opposition forum. You need a source more authoritative and credible.

Sherban Shabeel, it seems you fell for the propaganda of the Salafis. There is not a scintilla of evidence showing Ethiopia assistance to Ahlu Sunna waljameeca. Not even anecdotal evidence. Nothing! It's all accusations and here says all in a bid to discredit a concerned Somalis who are merely defending their way of life (herding goats and camels). Their only crime is they're Sunni Muslims. It's not Ahlu Sunna that is invading peaceful farming towns and ransacking everything of value. That's Alshabaab. Besides, Somalia is nearly 100% Muslim. Whats more there is no Sunni-Shia divide, they're all Sunnis. They all speak the same language. And yet it is the supposedly your coreligionist, compatriot Sunni Somali who is raping your women, terrorizing your civilians (like the beheading of local elder in Maxaas today) and not giving you the opportunity to pursue peaceful life. In such circumstance, one has to defend himself and his way of life. I will seek the assistance of even the most malevolent benafactor. Even if Ahlu Sunna waljameca were being financed by foreign entities including Ethiopia, so what? As long as they're defeating Alshabaab and their ilk, they're always in the right and will have my unreserved support.

Corruption is not a major problem if it was you'd be hard pressed to explain the phenomenal rise of China in the last 30 years; a period that coincided with a sharp rise in corruption. There is more corruption in China now, by all objective measures, than there was back in the early 1980s just when China was implementing reforms. But increasing corruption hasn't hindered China's economic growth and development. So corrupt leaders aren't inherently negative. It's just that more often than not they're obstacle.

Originally posted by Al Zeylaci: quote:Originally posted by Raamsade: quote: Originally posted by Al Zeylaci: but the " sufi" forces are supported by Melese Zenawi and his government. So you support a group which is supported by foreigners.he he but the "alshabaab/Xisbul Islam" forces are supported by Isias Afwerki and his government AND by foreign Jihadis. The enemy of my enemy is my friend! Explain that to Meiji who thinks his Ethiopian supported "Sufis" saints are not backed by foreigners. Well I can't tell 'em that 'cause it aint true. Ethiopia is not supporting Ahlu Sunnah Waljameeca YET. There's not a shred of evidence to substantiate such claim. But that may change if the tide turns against Ahlu Sunna. Ethiopia may come to the aid of Ahlu Sunna and all sensible Somalis will welcome it since the new scourge of Somalia (the new jabhad/warlords) is Alshabaab. We can't afford another 20 years of sectarian warlordism. So far the Sufis are doing good job of schooling the Salafis in the fine art of war.

Isn't Godane a wanted fugitive who stole some money from a Xawaala back in the mid-1990s?

Doesn't the Quran (was it Saxiix Hadith?) say you can beat your uppity wife albeit lightly? If so, what's the fuss over this Judge's views?

Originally posted by Al Zeylaci: but the " sufi" forces are supported by Melese Zenawi and his government. So you support a group which is supported by foreigners.he he but the "alshabaab/Xisbul Islam" forces are supported by Isias Afwerki and his government AND by foreign Jihadis. The enemy of my enemy is my friend!

^He's running out of talking points. The insidious agenda of Alshabaab and other dowladdiid groups are becoming apparent to all. Attacking one peaceful town/village after another for no apparent reason other than to spill the blood. Somali women, including children, are being raped and then stoned to death (or beheaded like the 28 year old woman in Bakool) for adultery by Alshabaab. Where as in the old days of lawlessness, the lives of Somali women were at least spared after being raped.

Originally posted by Emperor: ^ , This term of 'Dawlad-doon Vs Dowlad-diid' was created by Xuub sireed's Idamaale, now Mr Raamsade finds courage to use it... Who cares who coined it so long as its usage is apt. This conflict is not about clan but about principles. Duke, his incompetent opponents are doing such good job of keeping him buoyed.

U.N. cites concern on Eritrea aid to Somali militants Friday, May 15, 2009 UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - The U.N. Security Council on Friday voiced concern over reports that Eritrea has been supplying arms to Islamist militants intent on toppling Somalia's new government and condemned the recent violence. The 15-nation council also demanded that Somali opposition groups immediately end the violence and join reconciliation efforts in the lawless Horn of Africa state. "The Security Council ... expresses its concern over reports that Eritrea has supplied arms to those opposing the (government of) Somalia in breach of the U.N. arms embargo," the statement said. It also called for an investigation of the reports. In an accusation backed by some security experts and diplomats, Somalia's government said earlier this month that Asmara continues to support al Shabaab militants with planeloads of AK-47 assault rifles, rocket-propelled grenades and other weapons. Eritrea rejects accusations that it sends weapons to the al Qaeda-linked Islamist militants fighting Somalia's government. Fighting between al Shabaab militants -- who admit to having foreigners in their ranks -- and pro-government fighters has killed at least 139 people and sent some 27,000 fleeing the pock-marked, seaside capital Mogadishu since late last week. Somalia's moderate Islamist leader Sheikh Sharif Ahmed was sworn in as the country's president in January, promising to forge peace with east African neighbors, tackle rampant piracy offshore and rein in hard-line insurgents. Somalia has been a byword for anarchy since a dictatorship was overthrown in 1991. Currently, large parts of south and central Somalia are under the control of al Shabaab insurgents and allied Islamist fighters. Source: Reuters, May 15, 2009

He didn't stop spreading falsehood. This war is between Dowladdoon vs Dowladdiids. It has nothing to do with clan.

Originally posted by Kashafa: What changed in two years ? Nothing but the transformation of dhabqhoodi scum into peacenik qowleysato. Exact same talking points. Exact same Is-Qancis. Exact some istupidity. Saying that there is no difference between AMISOM peacekeepers and Ethiopian troops who unilaterally invaded Somalia is like saying "women have two eyes and men have two eyes, therefore men and women are one and the same." It doesn't follow both logically and factually. Both AMISOM and Ethiopian troops are foreigners but they're not one and the same. Originally posted by Kashafa: All pledged to serve Ethiopia and the Western imperial powers in return for money and guns. And what is wrong with that if it serves the interest of Somalia? Don't externalize our problems. We destroyed our country not "Western Imperial powers". And you're fervently busy destroying what's left of Somalia right now.

Originally posted by Meiji: Do they themselves not have foreign fighters (AMISOM) and are created and work for foreign interests AMISOM is part of the solution and indispensable to solving the Somali conundrum. They didn't come to plant roadside bombs or wage a "Holy War" against Somalis like Paradise seeking foreign fugitives have. AMISOM haven't come to Somalia for "dhul-balaaris" or "occupation" but to provide much needed security to the nascent government. When Somali government can stand on its feet, AMISOM will no longer be needed and will leave. If you're patriotic Somali who wants the restitution of Somali State, AMISOM is evil but a necessary evil (if they're evil at all). BTW, there is nothing wrong with working for foreign interests if those interests coincide with your ( or Somali) interest. Sh. Shariif's government should work with ANY foreign entity if that will further the cause of restoring the Somali Nation to its potential. Hell, he should work wit the devil if need be.

Some of the stuff written here are pure sensationalism. To the best of my knowledge Odey Axmed Diiriye isn't a militia commander. Unless things changed rapidly in the last 24 hours, which is unlikely since I spoke with Xamar last night, so how can A. Diiriye's militia's be defeated? Secondly, Indhacade has only bodyguards so there's nothing t disarm. Regarding the Anti-Dowlad factions, I pity them 'cause they're caught in a catch-22. If they didn't advance against government positions, government forces would have advanced against them when they gathered sufficient capabilities. If they did, as already occurred, they've exposed themselves to even greater enemies. Now Ethiopia, disgruntled groups (including those loyal to the government) and even the US will put these anti-Dowlad factions in their cross-hairs. Especially the US and Ethiopia since the first sees these Islamic factions as off-shoot of Alqaida (and Alshabaab's allegiance to Osama ices the cake for their charge) and the latter sees these Anti-Dowlad groups as proxies of Eritrea. Any gains by the Anti-Dowlad factions will be Pyrrhic victory.

Only the myopic or those who want to bring down this government call for the departure of AMISOM. I have yet to hear a sensible argument against AMISOM's presence other than empty platitudes like "Somalis can solve their own problems." There were no AMISOM or other foreign troops during C. Qaasim's government and there were still groups opposing it. We must accept the reality that there are powerful vested groups that don't want to see the restitution of the Somali State. And they're willing to defend that position to the bitter end and at any cost.

Not all Islamist groups are created equal. If I had to choose I'd choose the ICU over Alshabaab. By the same token Alshabaab have done some good like in Sh. Hoose. So they're not the irredeemable obscurantist brutes they're made out to be. But on the whole and in the long run problems produced by Alshabaab will out weigh any goods by them. The warlords are equally reprehensible but they were preferable to the Islamists for one unassailable reason. Warlords were amenable to earthly persuasion. The Islamists (the genuine ones) believe they're God's chosen messengers and above petty human reasoning or reality. That said, I don't wanna overgeneralize all Islamists as some are reasonable. Abu Mansuur is a case in point. He reneged on Alshabaab's proscription against NGOs by allowing them to operate in his home turf after realizing that he couldn't deliver the goods the people needed.

If true, I say it's about time. The promised AMISOM force should've come 4 years ago. But better late than never.