^ She has kids? She's only 18 or so and the kid in the picture is her sister.

Lily, it is not the appropriateness of child marriages that I was correcting. Every culture has its customs and customs change with social and economic changes. It is the assumption that young girls reached puberty faster back then (1500 years ago) than they do now. For one thing, no one can say for sure without data. If the trends from the past 100 years or so are any indication, diet and environmental changes point to the opposite direction.

Originally posted by AAliyah416: lets not forget back then 9 yrs old was fairly mature. The trend is the opposite, actually. Age at puberty has been getting lower with the type of food and its abundance. Puberty or getting your period is the marker for marriage readiness, isn't it? Because other maturity generally comes with experience, something you simply don't have at 9 (or 13, 14).

^ Ain't it, though? I make a little exception when some don't see it fit to wear undies and the wind is blowing. Then it's more like drop to the ground and puke into the city sewer.

It did. Probably didn't survive the much venerated Four Imams .

^ Exactly! Check out this one too: women have bells and whistles at the top and men have bells and whistles at the bottom. And finally, the strongest idea in my thesis: boys have cooties and girls don't.

Women signal left and turn right, men signal right and turn left. There!

LOL @ the shell-shocked look on the young boy's face. Party leader, my foot. He should be popping zits and skipping college lectures. Pakistanis are a very curious people. All that mad-hopping and hair-pulling they do on the streets.

^ It's nacala tula caleyk She was what they all are, corrupt to the core, immoral to the sinews, power-hungry to the grave. But whatever, she's dead now.

Memories of her?? Power-hungry and corrupt.

LX, send me the questionnaire, please.

It's great. I like that you can brainstorm and simply export to Word. It's superior to PowerPoint for presentations and makes your work seem professional and organized. Some of the maps subscribe heavily to Business school jargon like SWOT and so on but overall, it is worth getting. You may be able to download a trial version from their site.

Nur, thank you for the ghali term. But what about male orphans, walaal? Even more urgent, what about orhpans (both male and female) who are under the legal age of taking care of their affairs or marriage? I would think that this is the case where most orphans' inheritance is stolen. The verse immediately preceding this verse also speaks about orphans yet it is widely understood to mean both male and female. If you pay close attention to the verse, you will see it refers to nisa'a or adult women. You will also find in verse 6 that the orphan or 'yateem' is to have his or her affairs managed till reaching marriage age, his or her wisdom assured and then entrusting them with their affairs. How is a female who has lost her father yet is old enough to marry to be feared for as a 'yateem'? According to the verse, being of marriage suitability (an indicator of maturity), she is to have her money given to her to manage as she pleases. Admonishment not to absorb a wife's wealth into one's own for this woman is no different than a woman who comes to inheritance at 40, for instance. In any case, even if this narrow subset of orphans (a grown, fit to be married, woman) is to be protected by the verse, how does this apply freely to your 60-something year old businessman? Or to the double marriage earlier in the thread whereby a man is marrying two women at the same time with little indication if he was thrown to the multiple marriage out of fear of taking a third woman (an orphan with an inheritance)?

Nur, they are all ideas, brother. How does marrying other women solve the problem of a man wishing to exploit the wealth of an orphan girl through marriage to her?

Nur, brother, who needs assistance in this case? The man who sees it fit to marry a child younger than his or the wife who is not given the courtesy of a notice. His shivers and fears are nothing more than a desire to keep both lives, in my opinion. And if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly with the orphan­girls Where did you get 'orphangirls'? It must be an interpreter's take because the verse refers to orphans without specifically pointing to girls. Wants to take advantage by marrying an orphan to use her wealth to marry another How did you get this from the verse? While the verse is vague about the nature of women to marry, it could also refer to women with orphaned children.

Nur, there are many consequences of the testosterone drop in men after a certain age. A young woman is seldom a remedy for any of them but the lady in the rocking chair may have a trick or two up her sleeves . So if he thinks of his marriage as a prison, then all that talk about a loving marriage, a life partner, and a devoted wife where guilty mutterings of a foolish old man about to make himself look even more foolish. It does make you wonder if he was lying to you or lying to himself (as gaudy a symptom of being past your prime as a red sports car).

Thank you, Nur. Any financial system moves money in the direction of the wealthy as they have the greatest power, I don't know how the Islamic system moves wealth from Allah to the people in these theories of finance. Let's take the most common so-called Islamic practice (vs. so-called mainstream practices) and test it against how we understand the verses on Riba. I think if you go ahead and present your take, everyone else can pitch in and it won't necessarily all fall on you to prepare a time-consuming piece. Movement of wealth to the poor, in any form, is only partly attributed to financial systems.

Nur, but the most vindicating testament is the Islamic theory of Banking and Finance Can you explain those theories as you see them (a few, at least)? Many people, including myself, are not convinced that these so-called practices are any different than mainstream ones. I think at least this gallery can have a debate/discussion. Perhaps the discussion will shed light on the Quran's take itself which is where it should start, really. Unlike some comments above, widespread anything does not make it legitimate, ethical, moral, or even of a good business sense. It just means that people follow by nature and are too lazy to explore.

Nur, The 60-something businessman needs to grow up. A younger woman will not bring back what the years have taken. Funny how he describes his life as I have served my time , like a prison sentence. If there is wisdom to go with graying hair and clogging arteries, it would mean that he and his life partner have accumulated enough mutual interests to finally pursue them now that the children are grown and finances are not an issue. But to run after flesh when the love, history and companionship are already there? Blah, I say. Tell him to go home, eat his salt-reduced dinner, have a good laugh with the woman who was there through thick and thin, and then thank God for the life he has led and is now leading.

Any reason why your moping is in 2 different subforums?

I wonder why 65 year old women don't march for the right to bare their breasts. Granted, older men are nothing to look at but how come post-menopausal women are not jealous of the spindly-legged, sagging skin, gag-inducing sight of their male counter-parts. Hmm.

Che, my high school teachers were drawn from a pool of short, balding Indian octogenarians. Elysian, the Nords I've run into seemed well-adjusted and showed little if any feminist claw marks. Zafir, hmmm, scary much?

Uh-oh, Modesty, you forgot those magnificent creatures of Scandinavia!

Nephthys, go ahead and clean your plate shiny. Women are too conscious of what they're doing. Ever seen a young guy eat? If your arm is anywhere in sight, you will quickly become an amputee. Sometimes I wonder if they have taste buds, inhaling food like that. I suppose I would draw the line at people who lick each finger slowly while making mmmhhhmmmm sounds followed by lipsmacking. I just wish you were allowed to stab some people through the heart.

Any man who ships a woman from anywhere (Russia?) is bringing a barracuda-in-training-wheels home. I would suggest that they stick with Westerners, too tired from jobs and public transportation and numbed by cable TV. Those FOB chicks will lay low for a little while but the emasculation kits will come out faster than Dexter's bag. Go ahead and call your abti or edo for a referral, but don't come cryin' to us on SOL when she pulls your eyeballs out of your a*ss.