Dadka ku dhaqan Muqdisho oo ka walaacsan Iska horimaadyo laga cabsi qabo iney ka dhashaan hub ururinta qasabka ah ee dowladda federaalka ka fulineyso caasimada Dadweynaha ku dhaqan magaalada Muqdisho ayaa waxa saacadihii ugu dambeeyey soo food saaray cabsi iyo walaac fara badan oo ay ka qabaan iska horimaadyo ka dhalan kara hub ururinta dowladda federaalka Soomaaliya ay sheegtay iney maalinta beri ah si qasab ah uga fulineyso gudaha magaalada Muqdisho ka dib markii ay dhamaatay 3-dii maalmood ee ra'isul wasaare Cali Maxamed Geeddi uu u qabtay qeybaha kala duwan ee bulshada Muqdisho in hubkooda ku soo wareejiyaan dowladda federaalka loona cayimay baro hubkaasi la isugu geeyo, iyadoo dadkuna ay arintaasi fikrado kala duwan ka bixiyeen. Arintan ayey dad badan u arkaan mid lagu deg degay oo xiligeedii si aad ah uga soo hormartay, iyagoo iswydiinayaa sababta dowladda federaalku markii ay timid magaaladan Muqdisho ay ugu deg degeyso in hubka ka dhigis laga sameeyo magaalada Muqdisho, xili aysan waxba ka qaban xaalada amaanka caasimada oo faraha ka baxay tan iyo intii dowladda federaalka oo kaashaneysa ciidamo Itoobiyaan ah ay la wareegtay gacan ku heynteeda, iyadoo magaaladana ay ku soo bateen falal isugu jira dilal dhac iyo isbaarooyinkii lacagaha baada ah looga qaadi jiray gaadiidka oo meelo badan dib loogu soo celiyey, kuwaasoo magaalada laga waayey mudadii 6-da bilood aheyd ee golaha maxkamadaha Islaamka Soomaaliyeed ay gacanta ku hayeen caasimada iyo qaar ka tirsan gobolada dalka, waxaana dad badan ay qabaan haddii ay hubkooda wareejiyaan iyadoo nabadgelyadoodana aysan jirin cid damaanad qaad buuxa ka bixineysa in taasi ay la mid tahay in burcada loo beylihiyey xoolahoooda iyo naftooda oo hubkii ay isaga difaaci lahaayeena laga qaaday, waxayna dad badan u arkaan in hubka laga qaado xiligan uu gacanta u geli doono koox gaar ah. Dhinaca kale, hub ururinta ku kooban magaalada Muqdisho oo dalka intiisa kalena aaney la qabin ayaa la rumeysan yahay in jawi kalsooni la'aan ah ay ka dhex abuurayso beelaha qaarkood oo weli kala shakisan, iyadoo taa bedelkeedna ay dad badan tilmaamayaan iney ka haboonaan laheyd in marka hore dowladdu abuurto jawi nabadgelyo iyo mid dib u hehiisiineed oo abuuri karta kalsooni ay dadku hubkooda ku soo wareejiyaan, iyagoo ka digaya haddii beelaha qaar hubka laga qaado, kuwo kalena loo daayo ay taasi noqon doonto mid cadaalad daro ah oo keeni karta in mar kale ay dagaalo ka qarxaan magaaladan Muqdisho. Si kastaba ha ahaatee dhaliisha loo jeedinayo dowladda federaalka Soomaaliya ee ku aadan hub ka dhigidsa qasabka ah ee maalinta beri ah la shaaciyey in laga fulinayo magaaladan Muqdisho ayaa sii xoogeysanaysa, iyadoo waxgarad badan oo ku dhaqan caasimada ay dowladda kula talinayaan in arintan aan lagu deg degin oo marka hore nabadgelyada ay tahay in wax laga qabto, qorshe mar kaliya hubka looga wada dhigayo guud ahaan dalkana la sameeyo, si dadku ay ugu wada qancaan oo iyagoo raali ah ay hubkooda ugu soo wareejiyaan gacanta dowladda, waxaana waxgaradkaasi ay uga digeen dowladda federaalka Soomaaliya haddii ay ku dhaqaaqdo sida ay hadda wax u wado in taasi ay keeni karto in beelo badan ay bilaabaan iney is difaacaan, iyagoo u arkaya in hub ka dhigis iyaga u gaar ah lagu sameynayo, taasoo horseedi karta in iskam horimaadyo cusub oo lagala horyimaado dowladda federaalka, xili aysan weli kasban kalsoonida shacabka marka la eego waxqabadkeeda. Xafiiska Muqdisho Dayniile.com

Reading this just goes to show how much of the argumentation on S.O.L boils down to a load of hypocritical humbug. False Arguments - October 2, 2006 I had mentioned in an earlier entry a work I greatly admire, Schopenhauer's The Art of Controversy. I find it very appropriate because in it he analyzes the various spurious ways people can construct an argument, how they can manipulate words and strategize rhetorically to cover up their lack of knowledge, or their ideas that have little base in reality. It is a reference book for me. I will quote now, from the opening, and mention a few of the stratagems he examines. I will do this in two parts. I highly recommend reading the entire essay. (I have it in a version entitled The Pessimist's Handbook: A Collection of Popular Essays, published by U. of Nebraska Press, 1964). "Controversial Dialectic is the art of disputing and of disputing in such a way as to hold one's own, whether one is in the right or the wrong--per fas et nefas. A man may be objectively in the right, and nevertheless in the eyes of bystanders...he may come off worst.... If the reader asks how this is, I reply that it is simply the natural baseness of human nature. If human nature were not base, but thoroughly honourable, we should in every debate have no other aim than the discovery of truth; we should not in the least care whether the truth proved to be in favour of the opinion which we had begun by expressing or of the opinion of our adversary. That we should regard as a matter of no moment, or, at any rate, of very secondary consequence; but, as things are, it is the main concern. Our innate vanity, which is particularly sensitive in reference to our intellectual powers, will not suffer us to allow that our first position was wrong and our adversary right. The way out of this difficulty would be simply to take the trouble always to form a correct judgment. For this a man would have to think before he spoke. But, with most men, innate vanity is accompanied by loquacity and innate dishonesty. They speak before they think; and even though they may afterwards perceive that they are wrong, and that what they assert is false, they want it to seem the contrary. The interest in truth, which may be presumed to have been their only motive when they stated the proposition alleged to be true, now gives way to the interests of vanity: and so, for the sake of vanity, what is true must seem false, and what is false must seem true." Has anyone put it better? Not in my mind. Anyway, after some more eloquent discussion of why people resort to rhetorical stratagems, he gets to the stratagems themselves. I--The Extension. This means taking your opponents' arguments and carrying them further, beyond what they had intended, to other subjects, to other areas of discussion, giving them as wide a sense as possible and so exaggerating them to the point of caricature, or falseness. At the same time, you keep your own arguments narrow and limited in scope. The more general things become, the easier it is to find weaknesses and points of attack. II--Begging the Question . This is a kind of a rhetorical shell game. You subtly shift the subject in question, or the argument of the opponent, to something related but easily refuted. This is also known as petitio principii. In essence, you begin with a false premise, such as all liberals want us to pull out of Iraq, and from the false premise you derive logical and sound conclusions. I cannot emphasize how common this is--in the media, among political strategists of all sides, and those who make very eloquent arguments against my books by beginning with premises I had never iterated. III--The ad hominem attack . The most common one of them all. It centers around personal attacks, at the man himself, his character. This can be done overtly or subtly. This can take the form of--Schopenhauer was quite misogynistic (true), and therefore everything he says is tainted by this and apparently false. Or Mr. Greene writes of manipulation, therefore he is a man who manipulates in everything he does, and so his writing is manipulative as opposed to truthful. He wants to deceive and create followers, as opposed to revealing something elemental about human nature. You see, attack the character of the man, and from that all kinds of beautiful syllogisms will follow. We shall continue this in Part Two. Art of Argument Confusion, part two - I had hoped that the current election cycle would supply me with endless examples to illustrate the following ideas taken from Schopenhauer. But the Republicans cannot hang themselves quickly enough and so their discourse seems more pointed inward than outward, and the Democrats are just standing aside and laughing. Please provide your own examples, if you can. (I have noticed that the lawyers out there find this stuff way too rudimentary, considering that it is all standard practice in their world. I ask you to be indulgent. We are less used to these things.) I continue with Schopenhauer's examples: Metaphors and names: When a good argument is not on your side, or the ideas are stacked against you, you use names for things that are loaded with emotions and built-in biases to divert the argument. Of course the Republicans have gotten much mileage with a word like Liberal. But this can be much more subtle. Your opponent speaks of innovation or reform. You refer to it as revolution and drastic change. You are loading the emotional dice and shifting the thought process to their motives: for personal power perhaps, which is what a revolution could imply? The Ann Coulter non causae ut causae : How could Schopenhauer have been so prescient? I quote from his book: "When your opponent has answered several of your questions without the answers turning out favourable to the conclusion at which you are aiming, advance the desired conclusion--although it does not in the least follow--as though it had been proved, and proclaim it in a tone of triumph. If your opponent is shy or ******, and you yourself possess a great deal of impudence and long blond hair and a good voice, the trick may easily succeed." False inconsistencies : I get this one used on me all the time. It consists of your opponent seeming to find inconsistencies in what you are saying, either by dredging things up from the past (things you wrote long ago), or from people who seemingly belong to your group (let's say Machiavelli in my case), or even in your present argument. It is easy to create the illusion of inconsistency in anyone's argument if you are clever enough. And in defending yourself against this charge you look weak and defensive. Contradiction and contention : In a one-on-one debate, on TV, or even here on the Internet, this tactic consists of vehemently contradicting your opponents. The goal is to rile them, and draw them into exaggerating their original statements, going further than they had wanted to. Now they leave themselves open to some juicy counter-attacks. This can be an active form of deception, a kind of stirring waters to catch fish, or it can actually be a positive ploy. People will often be guarded in a debate, reluctant to show what they really mean. They talk with a subtext. You are getting them to reveal this subtext. Fog and confusion through the false syllogism : Your opponent makes a proposition. You draw from that a false inference, one that subtly or not so subtly distorts the proposition. This new false proposition on his part can be used for even more absurd inferences, on and on. It is a variety of the distraction tactics discussed in part one. The goal is often to create a lot of fog around the issue, particularly if your own ideas are not so solid. I think we can safely refer, as an example, to what the Republicans have done to the Democrat arguments that we need a phased withdrawal from Iraq. This leads to cut and run, and finally to warmly embracing bin Laden himself. The appeal to authority rather than reason ploy: Your argument is teetering, you don't have rationality on your side? Pull in an outside authority to bolster your shaky ideas. This must be carefully chosen. You want one that plays well to your audience, that has the right aura to him or her--Colin Powell, Mahatma Gandhi, Jesus, Vince Lombardi, whatever works. As Seneca says, "Every man prefers belief to the exercise of judgment," so bring in those authorities with a solid belief team behind them. Use a lot of Latin to designate things. (actum agere.) Actually that doesn't work so well anymore. Now it is better to use French, or something from popular culture, or incomprehensible jargon, or Derrida and postmodern claptrap, anything that gives an aura of profundity or hipness. Don't be afraid of twisting the quotes or references to suit your purposes. The egghead-slander ploy: I prefer to end with the words of the master himself. "If you know that you have no reply to the arguments which your opponent advances, you may, by a fine stroke of irony, declare yourself to be an incompetent judge: 'What you now say passes my poor powers of comprehension; it may be all very true, but I can't understand it, and I refrain from any expression of opinion on it.' In this way you insinuate to the bystanders, with whom you are in good repute, that what your opponent says is nonsense." www.powerseductionandwar.com

I actually thought it would be something that someone thought up on these forums, not even in originality do people shine.

"There are two types of keyboard waranles or maybe three, but in the end they smell one and all of that same cologne the dirty torment of our lives self righteosness" very liberally taken from euripides Keyboard waranle 1: those of the northern persuasion : Why it has come to my attention, that I have brothers in the north, who beat their chest in amazement at my humiliation, they write me love songs and protect me from the glare of the big bad oafish puntland punts, they care so much for me they urge me to fight and not be such a sissy, they assure me that the peace they have been proclaiming and have been positively rejoicing were machinations and they assure me that khat just aint what is cracked up to be. Fight the ethiopians are among you, fight oh look how they torment you, for ours they say [when you point out the discrepancy] is a relationship based on mutual respect, 13 years of curtsying and being mounted has made ours a very strong derriere. Alas we are told that xamar is the capital [of a state we no longer proclaim] a nd of a people [ we no longer number our selves amongst] but trust us trust us if you get behind us will get behind you and hopefully you are too dumb and war crazed to notice what just happened there. Can you hear them the wailing has already begun, as the soldiers of that great gendarme Riyaale come home to peacefull hargeisa, peacefull peacefull hargeisa, content and cuntish and regaling the marfish with their tales of daring do. Keyboard waranle 2: of the jihadist persuasion Who do I espy this frightfull winters night, praying to god almighty why it is our brother Jihad, fat fananaxleh brother cuqbad, let us listen to hymn he prays: "O Lord our God, help us to tear their soldiers to bloody shreds with our shells; help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of our xamari dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of xamari wounded, writhing in pain; help us to lay waste their destroyed homes with a hurricane of fire; help us to wring the hearts of their unoffending widows with unavailing grief; help us to turn them out roofless and clueless hildren to wander unfriended the wastes of their desolated land in rags and hunger and thirst, sports of the sun flames of summer and the hotwinds of summer, broken in spirit, worn with travail, imploring Thee for the refuge of the grave and denied it--for our sakes who adore Thee, Lord, blast their hopes for peace at any cost, blight their lives, protract their bitter pilgrimage, make heavy their steps, water their way with their tears, stain the white sand with the blood of their wounded feet, We ask it, in the spirit of love, of Him Who is the Source of Love, and Who is the ever-faithful refuge and friend of all that are sore beset and seek His aid with humble and contrite hearts. Amin." What a lovely prayer amiin dear brothers amiin, but please let me add some words from my own in offering as well ahemmm Oh God do not forget the roadside bombs oh god do not forget the medical shortages dear god let us forget about aideed and bless us with a muqtadr -al sadr an abu deera murder squads galore oh God oh gracious and good lord please do not forget the little children for we know they are the future and we hope that the torments visited upon Iraqs children should pale in comparision to what we hope in your great wisdom you have in store for the kids of Bandiir [Hopefully something to make them lose the weight the gained over 6 months of peace, but since you closer to me than my jugular vein you already know what I have in mind] please god we hope for medical shortages ya allah and radioactive corpses and maybe since you are all knowing and all wise could you make it easy or possible for the C.N.N or al jazeera to broadcast all over the world the pictures so that here in seattle or chicago Tribune kentucky I can finally hold my head high among palestinians afghanistanis oh and the ever effing iraqis and proclaim that finally somalia is getting somewhere. Finally lord bless me with wit and sarcasm oh God for one who has tasted the heady realms of proclaiming doorknobs and dhabadilif Do not let one such as me saafka hoore of the qwerty resistance movement be proclaimed anything but the terror of the forums Amiin.

Dowladda Federaalka oo sheegtay in ay maalinta Sabtida ee soo socota Hubka xoog uga dhigeyso Dadka Muqdisho Khamiis, January 04, 2007(HOL): Dowladda Federaalka Soomaaliya ayaa shaaca ka qaaday in ay maalinta sabtida ah bilaabi doonto howlgal ay ku uruurineyso hubka, iyadoo howlgalkaasina ay wada fulinayaan Ciidamada Dowladda Federaalka iyo kuwa Itoobiyaanka. Wasiir ku xigeenka Gaashaandhigga Salaad Cali Jeelle ayaa sheegay in ay dowladda go’aankaas qaadatay kadib markii ay dadka ka dhego adeygeen amar ay siisay oo ahaa in ay hubka iska dhigaan, isla markaana ay kala geeyaan Xarunta Villa Baydhabo iyo Dekeddii hore ee Muqdisho. Wasiir ku xigeenka waxaa uu sheegay in ay dhamaatay mudadii ay dowladda u qabatay oo seddex maalmood ahayd, ilaa iyo haatanna aysan jirin wax hub ah oo xarumahaas la geeyay, sidaas darteedna wuxuu sheegay in ay dowladda ku qasban tahay in ay xoog hubka ku qaado. Wuxuu intaa ku daray Wasiir ku xigeenka in dowladda Federaalka ay leedahay awood ay hubka ku qaaddo, isagoo xusay in ay awooddaas u sii dheer tahay sida uu u yiri awoodda ciidamada dowladda ay saaxibada yihiin. Maalinta berri ah ayuu sheegay Salaad Cali Jeelle in ay ku darayaan mudadii ay u qabteen dadka Muqdisho inay hubka isaga dhigaan, isagoo sababta ay ugu darayaana ku sheegay in ay dadka Soomaaliyeed iska Jimceystaan oo ay Salaadda Jimcaha tukadaan. Salaad Cali Jeelle waxaa uu ka codsaday dadka Muqdisho ku dhaqan in ay la shaqeeyaan, isla markaana ay u soo sheegaan meelaha uu hubka yaallo, si ay ugu sahlanaato ciidamada dowladda in ay qaadaan, wuxuuna carrabka ku dhejiyay in ay maalinta Sabtida ah hubka intiisa badan qaadi doonaan, inta soo hartayna maalmaha kale ee ku xiga. Laakin waxaa la isweydiin karaa mudada ay u qabatay Dowladda Federaalka dadka Muqdisho inay hubka isaga dhigaan ma tahay mid ku filan, waxaa su’aashaasi ka jawaabaya Xildhibaan Maxamed Qanyare Afrax oo sheegaya in ay mudadaasi tahay mid aan ku filneyn, wuxuuna caddeeyay in marka la qaadayo loo baahan waqti iyo qorshe lagu qaado, walow uu isagu dhowr jeer ku cel celiyay in hubkiisa uu ku wareejinayo Dowladda Federaalka Soomaaliya. Salaad Iidow Xasan (Xiis), Hiiraan Online sxiis@hiiraan.com Mogadishu, Somalia

Starting on saturday the T.F.G will start disarming mogadishu by force, any posts on this matter should be done here so as to make it easier for people to know what is going on.

why no questions asked?

the T.F.G did not win it is the I.C.U that failed the rest is just details.

Baashi said: Embrace TFG before it is too late. Why? With all its shortcomings, the TFG has the backing of the "world". With money and guns it will be able to line up its fav warlords and enough sub-clans to establish itself before any meaningful challenge can emerge. I don't see anyway out short of full blown civil war. And civil war is not a way out of this mess. I don't want us to end up like Iraq and Afghanistan. A puppet government propped up by outside powers and a sizable segment of the population resisting the sects or the clans alligned with the alien forces. You don't want that kind of mess. No one wins and all Somalis will lose big. Instead embrace them with conditions. Here is my idea. 1. Full amnesty for the Islamists leadership. . Reconcilliation meeting in Mogadishu. 3. Revised constitution. 4. National vote to ratify the drafted constitution 4. Clear succession plan (with defined date). In the meantime Somalis need to focus on security. With security you can preempt the peace keeping argument. Trust me Ethiopians have served their purpose as far as Uncle Sam is concerned. Soon the UN will insist on their withdrawal and Uncle Sam will support that motion. Add that the political tug of war in the upcoming presedential elections. Dems will critisize the military adventures of the GOP. And GOP will not turn the other cheek for Ethiopia's sake. Brother Baashi the rhetorical questions that you have posed at the beggining of the post is the most difficult to be answered by the keyboard waranles on S.O.L what is the alternative at the present time to the T.F.G in mogadishu, the population have the weapons not a definable group, the I.C.U are being hunted down like vermin an impasse and situation they led themselves to, the good old bhoys [warlords] are back in town and like the proverbial cat will land on their feet if the the T.F.G survives or if xamar falls back into mindless chaos. I don't see anyway out short of full blown civil war. And civil war is not a way out of this mess. I don't want us to end up like Iraq and Afghanistan. A puppet government propped up by outside powers and a sizable segment of the population resisting the sects or the clans alligned with the alien forces. You don't want that kind of mess. No one wins and all Somalis will lose big. Except the keyboard waranles who will have more fodder for their virtual battles. Instead embrace them with conditions. Here is my idea. 1. Full amnesty for the Islamists leadership. . Reconcilliation meeting in Mogadishu. 3. Revised constitution. 4. National vote to ratify the drafted constitution 4. Clear succession plan (with defined date). Brother the above I think are just intellectual constructs to make what is the reality on the ground more platable, also looking at the track record of the T.F.G I fail to see the above happening but I shall reserve judgement till you make the proposals a bit clearer taking into consideration which changes you wish to see in the revised constitution the timeframe the ultimate arbiter of the processes U.N A.U. or otherwisse e.t.c as a footnote you might see what the Democrats longterm aim is, and that is to be seen to be tough on terrorism, did you watch nancy pelosi's inaugaration and her "redpolyment of forces in iraq speech" all the T.F.G needs to do is harp upon the clear and present danger of terrorism [which shall be fullfilled soon enough in Kenya probably] and the dems would be willing and indeed eager to fund an african peace keeping mission in somalia one that I beleive wilkl work infinitely better than the moryaans cum police forces the T.F.G will attempt to keep peace with.

Lander you lie abominably

Caano Geel said Liqaye There is something that you are ignoring .. The ICU was defeated militarily via complete incopetence, but their opposition lacks support and the wide spread credibility in the somali community they once enjoyed. The "pacification of mogadishu" cannot be treated as a footnote on wider subject. The UN failed to accomplish it, the USA failed, the TNG failed, the various warlord alliangces failed. .. inshort sofar everybody failed for 16 years, except them. This says one two things: a) they provided something the people needed/wanted and were welcomed to facilitate it, or b) they conquered for it and where the strongest faction and subjugated people to their vision. The reality is that there isnt much truth to the second proposition, since clearly they were maryooley, with gar gaduudan - however, if their conquering meant peace, it seemed a worthwhile sacrifice and people tooks it, hence their rapid spread. Now what all this means is that though their army of ill equiped teenagers may be defeated, they have planted a seed in the somali conciousness. A seed of hope. So i think you are wrong to claim incompetence, they over stretched, believed their own rhetoric and failed, taking down the good that they created. But they left behind (1) a hope that things can change, (2) somalis can be united under more than just the ubiquitous *clan* but an ideology and (3) power can change without blood shed* - this is a tentative point, but a sizable number of their acquisitions were negotiated. These are lessons that have the capacity to change the path of any future somali state. Showing that military might does not always work and that it needs to be tempred with diplomacy was their initial strength, it is also what they forgot. But we haven't forgotten, and that is a much more respectible legacy than any of its predecessors -- one that we should use to hold the current regime accountable The "pacification of mogadishu" cannot be treated as a footnote on wider subject. The UN failed to accomplish it, the USA failed, the TNG failed, the various warlord alliangces failed. .. inshort sofar everybody failed for 16 years, except them. No doubt the pacification of mogadishu was a good thing, that it lasted for 6 months only and led to the I.C.U handing back the weapons not only to the populace but more sytematicaly the representatives of the warlords is a disgrace. a) they provided something the people needed/wanted and were welcomed to facilitate it, or b) they conquered for it and where the strongest faction and subjugated people to their vision. Caano geel what you have presented is not an either or argument but fundamentally have hit upon the progression of the thinking of the I.C.U leadership from accepting that they goverened at the behest of the somali people of banadiir they crossed the rubicon and started to believe that they had as Gods viziers on earth played out a part of history on their terms a history that would take them to the gates of Addis Ababa when the people of Banadiir very far from supporting such grandiose schemes waited ever paintently for either a negotiated settlement or a status quo that would allow them to lead their lives peacefully. So i think you are wrong to claim incompetence, they over stretched, believed their own rhetoric and failed, taking down the good that they created. But they left behind (1) a hope that things can change, (2) somalis can be united under more than just the ubiquitous *clan* but an ideology and (3) power can change without blood shed* - this is a tentative point, but a sizable number of their acquisitions were negotiated. So i think you are wrong to claim incompetence, they over stretched, believed their own rhetoric and failed, taking down the good that they created. Brother what you outlined above is not incompetence, in the words of Nguyen Giap did they not snatch defeat from the jaws of victory? But they left behind (1) a hope that things can change, (2) somalis can be united under more than just the ubiquitous *clan* but an ideology and (3) power can change without blood shed* - this is a tentative point, but a sizable number of their acquisitions were negotiated Firstly they did not leave this hope you acclaim in fact on the ground the old certainties of clan division are very much back in vogue, the populace of banadiir watched with dismay as the undercurrents of qabiil swirled around in the hearts and minds of the upper echelons of the I.C.U wereas today the same dogs of war that had been thought defeated parade across mogadishu, that is the final testament of islamism poorly understood and even more poorly practiced have had on the HOPEFULL banadiir. In mogadishu in the early days most undoubtedly many acquistions were negotiated, but once the homogeneous population of Banadiir was on board Kismayoo, the middle shabelle and cabudwaq were tests that the I.C.U had failed miserably on any yardstick, consequently one must ask ones self if this ideology was to unite somalis as I believe it can why did the I.C.U fail so miserably in implementing it fairly and equitably? But we haven't forgotten, and that is a much more respectible legacy than any of its predecessors -- one that we should use to hold the current regime accountable Now atleast we move to a topic that I can agree is fundamentally more important to the daily livelihoods of the somali, in this we can first agree that we have two choices 1] Be pragmatic about the T.F.G and use the intervening years to build up our body politic and the social economic foundations of the Banadiir [Here I appeal directly to the people of mogadishu, who as it is obvious are expected to fight the ethiopian's to the last Xamar man by all the arm chair mujahids and keyboard waranles on S.O.L, who inevitably hail from parts of somalia that will be on the sidelines in any conflict either seeking recognition from those they expect for us to ruin the lives of our children in battle with, or in the case of puntland grow ever more fat and obese on the back of a pax ethiopia neither helping but condemining] 2] The other option which I wish to make clear to the keyboard waranles on S.O.L as they cringe over their apple laptops downloading pictures of T-55 tanks and wishing they were there, is simple with the arms in the hands of the populace any resistance will be spontaneous and will be over the right to keep wepons rather than any concerted effort to remove the ethiopians, this fight will quickly degenerate to clan warfare, and you will get a whole new breed of warlords that will make the current cabal seem like day care specialists. Do I need to make it clear that the mujahids of the drawing rooms need not respond?

sorry d/p

I do not think that it would be possible to make it real time.

Ciidamada nabadsugida dowladda federaalka ayaa maanta ku qabtay garoonka dayuuradaha 8 nin oo ajnebi ah, una kala dhashay dalalka Suudaan & Bakistaan, waxaana qabashada raggani ay ku soo beegantay kadib markii maalintii ugu horreysay ay ku soo degeen garoonka dayuuradaha duulimaadyadii dayuuraha rayidka ah tan & markii magaalada Muqdisho ay la wareegeen ciidamada dowladda federaalka & kuwo Itoobiya oo ka awood roonaaday ciidamadii golaha maxaakiimta. Raggan la qabtay ayaa 4 ka mid ah waxey dhalashadoodu tahay Suudaan, halka saddexda kale ay ahaayeen Bakistaan, waxaana lala qabtay nin turjubaan u ahaa, waxeyna wararka ka imaanaya garoonka ay sheegayaan in lagu hayo baaritaan lagu sameynayo sababaha ay Muqdisho u joogeen & waxa ku soo beegay xilligan inay dalka ka baxaan. Xubnahan ayey wararka qaar sheegayaan in ay ahaayeen macalimiin wax ka dhigayey Jaamacadaha Muqdisho, waxaana sarkaal ka mid ka mid ah mas'uuliyiinta garoonka dayuuradaha uu sheegay in labaarayo, haddii wax dembi ah lagu waayana la sii deynayo . Cabdixakiin Cilmi Xasan , Muqdisho, Somalia Cabdixakiin44@hotmail.com

kind of defeats the point

African Countries Plead for International Aid in Somalia Ethiopian and Somali leaders are calling for international peacekeepers to help stabilize Somalia. Meanwhile, Kenya bolstered border security to keep fleeing Islamists from entering the country. Experts discuss what comes next for Somalia and the region. RAY SUAREZ: Police patrolled the streets of Somalia's capital today, six days after government forces, backed by Ethiopian troops, took back control of Mogadishu from the Islamists. The two sides battled for the country for two weeks. And Somalis, who have lived with no effective government for more than a decade, are being asked to turn in their weapons during a three-day amnesty period. GEN. MUHAMMED ALI HASSAN LOYAN, Chief, Somali Police: The biggest difficulty which is facing us now are the weapons which is in the hands of the civilian people of the society. RAY SUAREZ: The Somali presidential spokesman said yesterday an international force is needed to keep the peace. ABDIRASHID SED, Interim Presidential Spokesman: It's time the international community and African Union to assist, like what they have done in Congo, Liberia, Sierra Leone. RAY SUAREZ: That same international community is not sure how to keep the peace or how to cobble together an international force to do it. No force has materialized, despite talk of commitments from several African nations, including Uganda, South Africa and Nigeria. And Ethiopia, with an estimated 8,000 troops already in the country, will withdraw its forces within weeks, according to Ethiopian Prime Minister Meles Zenawi. MELES ZENAWI, Prime Minister, Ethiopia (through translator): From our side, since we have accomplished our main mission, our main focus now will be to get our military force back home and have them participate in the battle against poverty in our country. But while I say this, we also have the task of controlling the remaining extremist forces which are scattered here and there around Somalia. After completing these final tasks, it is our unchangeable stand that we should get our forces back home in a few weeks' time. RAY SUAREZ: Ethiopia, Somalia's western neighbor and longtime rival, sent troops into Somalia after the Islamists seized control of the southern part of the country in June. Kenya, to the southwest, has also felt the effects of Somalia's chaos. It's absorbed thousands of refugees and has now pledged to seal its borders from Islamist fighters. Today, in Brussels, EU leaders ruled out a significant European role for the peacekeeping mission. FRANK WALTER STEINMEIER, Foreign Minister, Germany (through translator): There are three tasks which are important. First, bringing about a lasting end to violence. The Ethiopian government has announced that their troops will withdraw. It is important that, after that, there should not be a security vacuum in Somalia. Secondly, it's important that there will be an improvement in the precarious humanitarian situation, in particular for the large number of internal refugees. Thirdly -- and perhaps this is the most important thing -- there has to be a return to the urgently needed political peace and reconciliation process. RAY SUAREZ: Diplomats will convene again on Friday to discuss the crisis in Nairobi, Kenya.

Qeybo ka mid ah isbaarooyinkii Muqdisho oo dib loo soo celiyay xilli madaxdii xukuumadu ay Muqdisho ku sugan yihiin Qeybo ka mid ah isbaarooyinkii Muqdisho ayaa dib loo soo celiyay kadib markii ay magaalada isaga huleeleen golihii maxkamadaha islaamka Soomaaliyeed, iyadoo isbaarooyinkaasina ay intooda badan dib ugu soo laabteen waqooyiga magaalada Muqdisho oo iyadu markii horena aheyd goobihii ugu jidgooyooyinka badnaa. Kooxo maleeshiyooyin ah oo ay jidgooyo u tiilay inta u dhaxeysa dekeda Ceel-macaan iyo degaanka Galgalato ayaa Rasaasta Zaban-ka ku dhuftay gaari TM ah oo ay saarnaayeen dad Rakaab ah kuna sii jeeday tuulada Biyo-cadde, iyadoo ay-na ku dhaawacmeen illaa 3 ruux oo dul saaraa gaariga. Arrintan ayaa timid kadib markii uu muran soo kala dhex galay illaalo hubeysneyd oo saarneyd gaariga TM-ka ah iyo kuwii ay u tiilay jidgooyadu oo dalbaday lacago baad ah oo xad dhaaf ah, waxayna keentay in la is rasaaseeyo, deetana ay maleeshiyooyinku ku dhuftaan Xabada Zabanka gaarigaasi, waxaana sidoo kale gaarigan ku gubtay Raashin iyo alaabo kale oo ku rarnaa. Tan iyo markii ay maxkamadaha islaamku isaga baxeen magaalada Muqdisho ayaa waxaa ku soo badanayay qeybo ka mid ah magaalada Muqdisho jidgooyooyinka, iyadoo arrintana ay ku soo beegmeyso xilli madaxda ugu sareysa xukuumada dowladda federaalka ay ku sugan yihiin magaalada Muqdisho, sida ra’iisal wasaare Cali Max’ed Geeddi, wasiirka Arrimaha gudaha Xuseen Ceydiid, taliyaha ciidamada Booliska Soomaaliyeed, Jen. Cali Madoobe iyo ciidamo tira badan oo Itoobiyaan ah, waxayna dadku ka dhursugayaan sida ay dib ugu soo celiyaan nabadii 6-da bilood ee Xamar.

^^^ Hahaha very funny

sorry double post And I support sophist as the chair of this debate finnaly something constructive out of cambridge

Very good constructive idea

oh we wait with anticipation

How did this become a somaliland issue?!?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Courts_Union http://allafrica.com/stories/200611210792.html http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110009440&mod=RSS_Opinion_Journal&ojrss=frontpage " Egypt: The government has allegedly provided training in support of ICU. On July 26, 2006, a meeting took place in Mogadishu between officials from ICU and visiting Libyan, Egyptian and Eritrean senior military officers at the residence of ICU finance chief Abdulkadir Abukar Omar Adani. According to the report, the meeting resolved that military training be provided to about 3,800 fighters at the Hilweyne military barracks, near Bal'ad town, north of Mogadishu."

laakiin meel baan seexanayaa ama fariisanayaa ee kaalay hebeloow dalkayga ii dhis cidna dal kuma dhisto kuuna dhisi mayso How sweet markasna?

laakiin meel baan seexanayaa ama fariisanayaa ee kaalay hebeloow dalkayga ii dhis cidna dal kuma dhisto kuuna dhisi mayso How sweet markasna?