Originally posted by Geel_jire: I do not have an ayat or hadeeth at the moment , but I will look it up. Are you saying you have read an aya where Allah (swt) calls for the killing of apostates? Be careful there. Originally posted by Geel_jire: One example does come to mind though, When the prophet S.A.W died. Many tribes turned away from Islam.The Khalifa Abu Bakar R.A.A , sent the muslim Army against them and he commanded the General (Khalid bin waleed) to kill all the apostate. The apostates were rebelling against the islamic state, they were slaughtering Muslims and even burnt some alive. They were not only apostates, they took up the sword against Islam and sought to dominate Arabia after destroying the Muslims. Originally posted by Geel_jire: you still havent given your opinion other than asking me to prove mine, the objective here is to share knowledge not to prove one another wrong. If you haven't noticed yet, I'm hardly serious around here, and do not like to engage in conversations where I have to be. I'll make an exception this time. Originally posted by Geel_jire: Death is a punishment for Apostasy from what I understand, If you believe or know otherwise pls provide reference,example etc. I believe otherwise. Allah (swt) does not call for the killing of apostates even once in His holy Quran. He does, however, state that there is no compulsion in religion, which is completely opposite to what you say. Surah 2:257: "There is no compulsion in religion. Surely, the right way has become distinct from error; so whosoever refuses to be led by those who transgress, and believes in Allah, has surely grasped a strong handle which knows no breaking. And Allah is All-Hearing. All-Knowing." To me, that is quite clear. It would not make any sense to kill people simply because they have stopped believing. Only God knows how many people in their hearts believe in Him and the blessed Messenger Muhammed (sas). It is rebellion and treason against an islamic state that should come with death penalty. Unfortunately in many people's minds rebellion = apostacy. P.S I too have always been told apostates should be killed; being told doesn't always make it true.

umm zak, look at all the fun we're having. we haven't agreed on or had this much to talk about since whoa. i say we should award this king koya for bringing us lot closer to each other. i'm even sharing my popcorn with cara.

Originally posted by Geel_jire: GG I believe the punishment to be death, if that is what Allah has ordered, personal opinions have no place in this discussion. Evidence. Tell me where in the Quran Allah (swt) specifically orders apostates to be killed. Thank you. Originally posted by Geel_jire: This what i have been taught.If you have some ayaet or hadith stating otherwise I would be happy for the opportunity to learn something. As above.

Aaliyah, I don't know what the monkey king has written. I didn't even bother to read this thread. All I know is that he came up with the probably most attention-seeking title possible. However I don't think that's a reason to be banned. red sea, well i'm glad you like me something! it's a good start. we'll evolve from there.

i quite agree with you red sea. i think it's far more easier to get angry with people rather than to actually try and behave rationally. MAKE AN EFFIGY OF KING KOYA AND BURN IT!1 BURN TEH DEVIL DOWN!1! DOWNNN!1! QUICK, AN EFFIGY!1%& I think I should be careful I don't get banned...

embarking on a mission to save his damned little soul, eh?

Originally posted by umu zakaria: two of my sisters share the same birthay. They were only few hours apart! we call them mataanaha now but they never shared a womb! one of the blessings of polygamy. EL OH EL

Originally posted by Geel_jire: to the poster, to kill someone because after they have believed in islam they turned away is a command from allah Prove it.

"GG, i was just about to remark on your frivolous post above when i realised it's Christmas eve tonight, so i thought i'd leave you be " I'm afraid you would've not been able to sink to my level anyway. Touche. "dont want to ruin the spirit of what must be a jubilant and joyous occassion for you " haha. thank you. indeed it is. then again, to a selfless, warm and uncorrupted soul like this, every day is jubilant, full of joy. it comes with thinking about others and things that really matter. will you be watching dr who xmas special tomorrow?

Originally posted by Scipio Africanus: Thats a flawed comparison GG, as you probably know! E: Perhaps i should expand on that, what firm makes the clothes of some Santa is a lot less important than the 'identity' of the iconic theme tune of the longest serving, most listened to Somali radio station. Some Santa?? How very dare you. The clothes of Santa are not just clothes, they're the very essence of Santa. Without that red and white costume (and admittedly his beard) Santa would not be Santa. And Santa represents happiness and joy for millions of little disadvantaged orphan children who suffer from leukemia and malaria all around the world. What is that compared to some dodgy tune of some radio station listened to by some (for all the wrong reasons) skinny Africans! Stop being so incredibly self-centred for once in your life, will you. And give some thought to all those ill, hungry, disadvantaged children. God, I should become a UN Goodwill Ambassador. If Al Gore can win a Nobel Peace Award, I think i stand a fair chance.

if i see someone who is from the same sub-clan as me, i jump to kiss them on the cheek. i'm shamelessly tribalistic when it comes to seeing relatives, greeting them better than others. i am sure i would bad-mouth any clan if i actually knew something about it. but tbh i'm simply way too apathetic to want to find out about somali history or clans, i find it all so dull. i swear by God i do not know what tribe the president was, someone might've mentioned it before but right now i have no idea. there are very few things in this world i care about, and the tribal history of somalis is not one of those things. i am not one with nationalism. quite the contrary. i believe nationalism is evil and was created by the devil to make gaps between muslims. so i believe in egoism!

it is actually quite beautifully somali. it reminds me of my dear ol' father *sigh* mainly because he's the only one who listens to it every day.

i did and i still don't get why on earth you would want to know where it's from. it's like asking... what company makes santa's clothes... you just don't need to know! Merry xmas!

why on earth would you want to know?

i once got attacked by silly chavs. hope the brother in question gets better soon.

it takes only one question to show the bible is flawed: how many legs does a fly have?

because it's an established fact she did not have her first child at the age of 15. then i sound like a detective and the whole situation will resemble a trial and she'll end up annoyed. and really, at the end of the day, why the **** should i care? it's none of my business so she's 30 and everybody is happy.

i don't know the age of my (older) siblings yet alone their actual date of births. it's like i'd slap my eldest sister in the face if i asked for her age. then she'll lie. and this is one thing i will never, no matter how long i'll live, come to understand.

Originally posted by -: quote: We all know right now what religion is causing much trouble around the world... Jews are persecuted for centuries in the name of Christ. The Spanish conquest of the new world was justified in the name of Christianity.Even slavery was sanctioned under Christianity. Learn your history first kid before you start babbling a religion that obviously you know so little of. More blood was spilled in the name of Christianity than other religion in the world. notice the 'right now'. i couldn't bother reading his long rant, especially since the title is screaming for attention. we know 'all somalis' will never be christians. however i do am worried about the state of somalis in the west nowadays. i'm frightened to think what will become of them in two, three generations' time.

To get everything my heart desires.

Originally posted by Cara: Oh yes it was, for the Starbucks crowd. the book was published before starbucks showed any interest in selling it in its coffee shops. Originally posted by Cara: And do you really think the ex-child soldier wrote it without at least one ghostwriter to make it more yuppie-licious? ah the cynism!!! do not try to poison my pure, young, red heart with the darkness of cynism, you dark evil thing! now on a more serious note, almost all authors will have to compromise before they get published, even the most famous and most popular ones will have to edit their text to suit their publishing company's taste/needs/whatever. but i think its insulting to suggest beah used a ghostwriter just because a fraction of his books have been sold in starbuck's coffeeshops. anyway, enough of this nonesense. i think your (toi et lily) advice for the money-hungry, souless, immoral and shallow monsters like myself is in fact quite good.

Originally posted by Cara: That's the point. Writing without having an audience in mind is called keeping a diary . The first step of writing anything else is choosing your audience. i must be more self-centred than i always think i am. i write for myself, i am my audience, and perhaps those who are a little like me. Originally posted by Cara: If you want a bestseller, than Lily is spot-on: Think of the "ediot in a hurry" as the target audience. Make it Oprah's Book Club-friendly. Write about epic personal struggles, poignant life-lessons, an appreciation for diversity and community. If it's a real hit, your book is going to be adapted in a made-for-tv film, so prepare accordingly. oh c'mon. i do agree with you that most best-sellers are no-brainers but there are a few really good ones. my personal favourite is memoirs of a child soldier by ishamael beah, i very much doubt it was written in the same calculative way you two suggest.

some somalis actually make new year's resolutions?

Originally posted by Fahiye: Writing for monetary reasons is the wrong route to take—you could make money in less intricate endeavours. Writing requires a passion together with tenacity and the ability to differentiate a good story from a brilliant one; skill most people lack not to mention some mediocre writers. what has being a best-seller got to do with having the ability to differentiate a good (or even bad for that matter) story from a brilliant one?? art thou mad??! how to write a best-seller? this is the most important thing: be as mediocre as possible, don't take any risks. be mainstream and calculative. i would love to write a rubbish book. like a love novel. boy meets girl, girl's parent's won't have it, boy loses girl, boy finds girl, boy makes silly promise he'll never let the girl forget their story, they age together and die... wait. that's notebook.

Originally posted by -Lily-: I would advice you to read what is currently a bestseller and to really think about why the ordinary John would read your book on his commute or the avarage Jane read it on the beach. A Somali book would limit you unles your characters' struggles are universal. That'd be writing for audience. Originally posted by -Lily-: Mind you, a lot of trash has been published. True. All you need to do is wander around a library. It is shocking how little people care about the environment. Stop trashing our environment, crappy mediocre writers.