Suldaanka,a Muslim beeing worried of Islamization is a contradiction in terms. It seems to be about some people's wishful thinking that Somalis had no culture at all, so they can claim "Jalbabaad" is Islamic , thus Somali. 'Garbsaar' is culturally Somali and Islamic ,that is why 'Garbasaar' is the slaient trait. we can't say the same about "jalbabaad", and Atheer Nuradin is 100% right about stating that fact. Only those who dislike their own Somali culture becouse they either find it inappropriate to their version of Islam or they don't know much about their own culture, seem to want to sell us that he can't be Muslim , since he is culturally Somali. That Sulman Rushdie or Stringberg had commented on his work therefore he is not Muslim is like saying Castro is not a Muslim becouse JB has only nice things to say about his posts, what a drivel. There is an Islamic grandeur in thier veiws but wholly for the wrong reasons dare i assert.

Something tells me that you're worse, since you're hiding behind Islam to insult one of our cultural and literatural Icons. your defination of Islam = "jalbabaad" ?

Every Somali who dosen't dress and act like a Taliban and wear " jalbabaad" is absolutely not a Muslim and hardly Somali?

Its been ages back when i discovered this young talented man, i wonder why it took Atheer Admin this long to see what i've seen years ago. nevertheless, now that Cons is rediscovered , students old and new alike will be happier to have Cons around. Good luck Cons , we know you can deliver.

Cambaro,'abayo macanto', i was expecting a little more than this apologetic round-up, given that your point of contention is and remains as i understood it. Originally posted by Cambarro: Johnny .... Its culture that you need to tackle that uses Islam to make it ugly. The fight is not against Islam but against opressive cultures. Ayan Hirsi has decided that Islam is to blame. What a pity, because as intelligent as she is, she has not been able to learn more about Islam and be able to make a distiction between culture and religion. When i asked you if you'd like to highlight the distniction of what is percieved , considered or regarded Cultural respectively Religious, i was preparing the floor for you to take Ayan by the ear and show us that her guns are wrongly aimed at the wrong target , namely Religion. hence,my inducement and question of if you could unlike Ayan do address the issue without giving atleast a concise account of the religious role. As you agreeingly put it "some twisted people in all creeds in that region practise this horrendous acts", its obvious that you attempt to highlight the distniction between those "twisted people" and the 'normal' Muslims, but fall short to reasonably deny Ayan to refer to those very 'twisted people' as Muslims, hence, relate those horrendous acts to those 'twisted people'. Without clinging to the Stats, i think it is fair to say that Honour killings, forced marriages and FGM are problems that modren Muslim-women face, i've no knowledge of where it says in the scriptures where Islam either condons or is apologetic towards these horrible social traits , but i've come across some scriptures where Men are ocationally entitled to beat Women, but that is all a sidekick to the original point of contention. Cambaro , i'm not here defending Ayan's position , i'm not even sure if i understand exactly what her position is ,i'm only trying to understand why she is wrong and you're right, when you say : "Sometimes i do wonder why we run when we cant even walk. I think the discussion should begin with Islam and its validity in the modern soceity. I have an inkling that Islam isnt your cup of tea. " I feel i failed to understand you to boot, needlessly to mentionn having failed to absorb the gist in your previous post that contained the original point of contention. Kimiya. It is an honor to be your favorite brain to drill, i don't know of anybody who'd get my permission to do so . it's a 'Burco ' thing, miyaa?

D/P

Honour killings, forced marriages and FGM are unique problems for the modren Muslim-women of today, while wife beating is universasl. Getting humoured ,i don't see how you'd address these issues unlike Ayan, without considering the theo-socio factors that help stablish these harmful social traits in the first place. Be it Culture or Religion, according to some sociologists, certain traits can only blomster in a society either by having a sound direct usefullness or having a theological shoulder to lean on. Now, i do understand that you're of the idea that 'if it's good it's Islam,if it is bad it is Culture', but can you explain why those socially harmful traits (Honour killings, forced marriages and FGM ) survived Islam, and are almost unique to the Muslim societies.?

^And this is exactly the spirit i lost in ur previous post. The issue is not about if she lied about her age etc etc. I don't know Ayan in person,and i agree with you that she has a point or two regarding Muslim-Women,but the claim "to blame is the culture and not the religion" seems rationalizing the religion at best and allianates the culture. What is culture and not religon has never been so obvious and crystal clear , nor has it bean clear weather Culture is part of a religion or Religion is a part of a culture. Nonetheless, Since Ayan is not here , i've to ask you which is part of which?

And laying is so un-islamic had u concluded , that is . nevertheless, its not about lying, as lying is not a particular trait for particular [ fill me in ], Any other reason why she shoulden't be taken seriously?

Yep Lily , its an ongoing effort ! An effort that SOLers can't dare miss me thought. Maybe , its about Time SOL starts giving away GREEN badges to the most enviromental SOLER. What do you think?

If you've came to read what happens when the lights are off, am afraid i've to disappoint you and tell you to stop right about now and hit the 'BACK' button of your browser. Yesterday was the day i deliberately shut off the lights in my house and parked my car for 5 minutes to just contribute to the enviromental health and thus hopefully help reduce the effect we human beeings have on the climate ( global warming). Today in Paris , for the first time the human effect on the climate has been scientifically accepted. Would my fellow SOL users join me in this effort ?

Originally posted by Azmaya: there is a reason why Mr. Rudy thinks they are the best yeah. bye bye Ditto !! The Infalliable Rudy has spoken , and only i and Azmaya can get it ?! Viva Mududg & Waqoye men .

my Ebok

Cambaro , one doesen't have to say 'no' in every other sentence to sound 'segsi', and as for that 'abayo macaney' thing , its all on how you put it. A Northerner,just like Castro put it, may put a little too much of an effort and a feeling to what s/he has to say ( maybe, that is why he looks costipated ), Nonetheless, its an effort that is totally lost in the sassy Xamarawis. Sheh, would you perfer this , "wara yarey,waku jeclahay no". ?

Vista is just what it says VISTA. i had tested it on a dual core AMD TURION 64 X2, 2048 DDR RAM michine, Microsoft has according to me for the first time covered almost all aspects of the their OS(Winsows), for those of us who were students under DOS v.6.0 , this is a touchable progress. the UI is more fine , but you get to have atleast 512 graphic memory to experience the real Areo. The shell is groundly improved , many new concepts are thrown on yuour way , get ready for the SHADOW FOLDERS and thumbnails are for all file extentions. Many new/old apps like iexplorer, media player etc etc are there , but few new ones are presented too , like the windows Clander ( typical Microsoft ) . No matter what you think of the versions ( Basic, Classic, Standard) of Vista, it is worth trying if and only if u think you need another Windows.

That is probably only YOU . No girl (xamarawi or Galcaio) can resist my lethal Awdali accented shokansi, now beat that , you Xamarawi, sassy things.

CG, Let's ask the TFG cheerleaders who orders the Tanks that are swarming over Mogadishu , Yey or Senawi? and until they answer and explain that to us, we're entitled to consider their ranting to have been prompted by the institutionalized bigotry that has been foisted upon the TFG cheerleaders, who (weird enough) happen to be predominantly from Buntland. What has Golfballs and Drroknobs in common atheer?

^more like the " Hehe " of Butthead. Here is what a real londoner thinks about the Demo.

LIQAYE, though one of the most admirable TFG new chearleaders is selling nothing more than a moral parasite doctorine, wanting us to live the life of a borrowed ethics. His line of reasoning is flawy, as it is based on a murky conclusion , namely ," there is no alternative, ", says who (yaa) Liqaye? Since when have we run out of alternatives to inflict us with this stinking accupation and presuade ourselves to accept it? Since when have you dried the wells of hope for our proud nation?, Atheer " what is the alternative?" and "Can we surrender?" have never ben the same. the latter is never an option , it is always there for the weak . The problem with the TFG supporters is they lack the ability to get out of the clan lineage and see who is running our(including theirs) affairs, an impossible task for an emotionally sour chearleader.

Xiin-ow , feeling a malicious pleasure is natural, the tfg supporters are not naive in the sense that they [WANT] to feel happy about the fall of their alleged enemy, but naive in misplacing their malicious pleasure. There is no pleasure nor an argument for a position that wants to assumes the Ethiopian Tank patrolling Mogadishu take order from Mogadishu. it is a plain hubris.

This is unacceptable, missed the target ? on whose intelligence tip they were acting on? Not Yey's that is for sure , our commander in cheif heard it on the news.

I must admit, my rift with this TFG is the FLAG on the Tanks rolling in. the only symbol that is left of the Somalia of my Father. I met Atheer Hussein Aideed once, i hope he can deferentiate knowing that the Ethiopians has a security intrest in Somalia and letting them Secure Somalia. This TFG put bot the people of Somalia and itself in a delicate position, one needs to nail that down in their nitwit heads.

I knew Kashafa would make a good soilder for the sake of ' Allah' !!

A Graad is a person , so sweet they give you a teethache, I'm an Ugas , Ngonge is a Sultan, LST is a Boqor and Bashi is a Graad, and if you don't like that explanation, i get another one .

There is something holy about the clitoris , as both men and women are fond of talking about it.