Bro; you should have posted this in a new thread. People will the post I made in march 2008 dealing with the same story. Aaliyah; good kids can easily be victims these days. You could get stabbed over a football match these days.

emp; Amin pictures are open to interpreation and it is upon the reader to conclude what he likes from the cartoon. That is the whole of point of cartoons and political satire; it is not like an article which claims to represent facts, figures or political opinions. His pics shouldn't be taken to literally. In any case, I would have thought more people are clicking on his website now. you giving him free publicity. lol.

Bismillah al-Rahman al-Rahim It is with much sadness that I read Tawfique Chowdhury's speech to the anti-terrorism officers in Wales, which he brazenly posted on an Islamic blog. I was deeply shocked and appalled by his enthusiasm for collaboration with a body that has failed its own war against Islam and the Muslims at home and abroad. It is deplorable for a graduate from the prestigious Islamic University of the Prophet's city – the first Islamic State – where the subject of 'Aqida is emphasised the most, to declare himself an ally of the West against Islam, not even by choice, but naturally. It is ridiculously outrageous for a Muslim speaker to lure the anti-terrorism officers into using him and other religious leaders against the Muslim community. This is not to say that we should not work to prevent unlawful violence. In fact, many have been at the forefront of this work, without signing a deal with the devil, or joining any sort of alliance, be it natural or otherwise, with the brutal, cunning and oppressive anti-terrorism workforce. In light of this, I urge Tawfique Chowdhury to publicly and unequivocally retract his irresponsible and reckless speech, in order to save himself and his institute from disrepute. The failure in doing so will only reaffirm the public sentiment in the UK that he has clearly taken sides with the enemies of Islam the Muslims. I would also like to take this opportunity to remind the scholars, preachers and Imams that their silence is consent. Tawfique Chowdhury is not the first to fall into disrepute and controversy, and he certainly would not be the last, unless and until they fulfil, and not betray their covenant with Allah, like those of whom Allah makes mention in His Book: "(And remember) when Allah took a covenant from those who were given the Scripture to make it known and clear to mankind, and not to hide it, but they threw it away behind their backs, and purchased with it some miserable gain! And indeed worst is that which they bought." Imam Shakeel Begg of Lewisham and Kent Islaamic Centre lol. more ppl are replying this. including imam shakeel above.

Rash declaration. The "government" doesn't have the capability to remove them at this moment in time. They could just turn around and say that their removal would lead to a greater fitna, that is, the return of Ethiopian troops. They could also easily say that this was a compromise that they made for the greater good. Xiin, ALshabab and the other groups position is clear on the Amnisom; it is based upon a deenayan stand. Ironically, this was the same position that the sHeikh had when he was their leader. Thus, you can't really blame for taking a black and white stand on the amnisom.

Originally posted by Resistance: The only thing that can be used against Sh.Tawfique's speech is his naive beleive that the West actually want to fight terrosim as per say and have nothing against Islam. Indeed.

Naxno Al shabab (we are the youth), lana al ghado (tomorrow is ours) Wa majdoho(and its glory) Al mokhalado (the eternal). Naxno Al Shabab. Shicaarona cala al zaman (our slogan throughout time) Caash el wadan Caash al wadan (long live our homeland long live our homeland). Naxno Al Shabab. Calamtana keef el shmam (it taught us good morals) wa keef yorfac al calam( and how the flag is raised). Naxno Al Shabab. Al Safx wa al jadawil (the land and the springs), Wal xaqlo wal sanaabil (and the field and the grass*), wa ma bana alawaa'il (and what the ancestors built), Naxno laho macaaqil (we are their defenders). Al deen fe qoluubina (the faith is in our hearts), wa el nuur fii ciyoonina (and the light in our eyes), wa al xaqqo fe yamiinina (and the xaq is in our right hands), Wal ghaar fe jabiinina (no idea what the ghaar could be here but it's on their foreheads). Naxno Al Shabab. Lana el ciriaq wo al sham (Iraq and Sham are ours) Wa masro wa el beet el xaraam( and Egypt and...do I have to translate this one?) Namshi cala el moot el zo'aam(we march against death), ela al amaam ela al amaam( forward forward). Nabni wa la natakil (we build and don't depend on others), nafni wa la nankhadil (we give our all and are never let down) Lana al yad wo al camal (ours are the hands and the hard work), lana al ghado wa al amal (ours is tomorrow and ours is hope) Naxno Al Shabab. ( courtsey of ngonge)

onlf? Somaliland is bad, PL is bad, Sheikh is a traitor, shabab should be erased, anarchists are bad. Who is good ninyow?

and last week they released a new drink: Cow Cola Urinade: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/fo od_and_drink/article5707554.ece horta, how do did that thingy where wrap the url in your writing?

Meiji, Don't be such a simpleton and literalist. Almost Every political group in the world wants to impose or at least influence their view of governance in the world. A&T. I can't predict the future, but everyone is entitled to their dreams. Anyway, if youths are rooted out, it will probably go back to warlodism and clan era. But I am perplexed as to your sudden change of heart and optimism. What has changed so much.

^^Alshabab weren't fighting to merely free Somalia from Ethiopian occupation. They existed before the Ethiopian occupation entered, remember? WHy do you think their leaders were in the Tora Bora way before Xabashis came?Their goal was to always to rule Somalia by what they see as pure Islamic Shariah. Their motto was to get hit by by a bullet in the chest or be victorious and rule Somalia by Islamic law. Ceyro's words. Whether one disagrees with them or resents their "talibinization" of Somalia is another debate altogether. What is absurd and illogical is that you and others expect them to go back to their mosques and become peaceful monks, just because what saw as your goals have been reached. The boys were only needed to fight evil Xabashis now their nuisance isn't needed, so you say. Are they condoms whom dicarded( pardon the pun)? Why on earth would they give up all their territory and influence they have created to their enemies? Have you heard of a leader doing this in history? I don't think even Bhudda would have done that. And whoever does that is a complete *****. I can't see any logic( just think from their perspective for a second) in them surrendering their arms to the tfg and their cohorts. Forget about the nonsense about new leaders( btw, the new pm was the old mans advisor, so much new blood) and young turks running Somalia for a second. You say it should be done for peace. They will simply turn around and say that they are the ones that have brought peace to most of Southern SOmalia, whilst the tfg is setting up roadblocks in MOG. There are three major reasons why they should go back to the mosques and become monks: 1. Becaus AT doesn't like the Taliban and he thinks their job has been done 2. Because there are young turks and fresh blood. To use Ngonges words, these are largely stuff and nonsense reasons. This is probably the most powerful argument: 3. For the sake of peace. But this is still unproven too and the hotel sleepers will have to prove that they have a better alternative of peace than shababs. They have to actually return to Somalia and put their fancy words into action. Until then, youths will be the defacto rulers of Southern Somalia, unless the people revolt or some powerful force crushes them to oblivion. Finders keepers, loosers weepers. ps. mansur said to ALjazeera if the SOmali people choose a righteous leader who rules iSLAMically, then they will become his soldiers. So there is some hope. Let's wait for the Mahdi.

Nune, JB and Ngonge= Ciyalasuq trio? But it's cool, if we didn't have you guys here, the forum would turn into a Somaliaonline Shariff appreciation Society. Xiin, if Nur cade or some other warlord won the election would he also get Theological legitimacy? The opposition don't oppose the man himself, but the process and constitution from which he is elected. As well as his actions, such as not clarifying his position on foreign troops and sleeping in their bases. Nevertheless, this big score for the Sheikh.

Alshabab didn't lose all those men and sacrificed so much so that they could be reduced to ceremonial little men in suits, who cut ribbons at official gatherings. I think your losing your sense of logic these days. Who or What has infected you?

You guys should read what their writing on the times comments page. we should all go home. ps. raga tagey Somalia, they are unlikely to ever come to the West.

Jonathan Rugman is diplomatic correspondent of Channel 4 News. His film on Somalia is on at 7pm tonight. should watch this tonight inshallah.

lol@ give him five minutes and why he should have five more minutes. ps. what he said is no different to what PL and SL say.

^^ He says he doesn't know the clan stuff, but he even figured out them code to say them backwards: Don't even know Abdi Qaybdiid's subclan after Dacas(read backwards)

Nin waynoo tolkiisa ankiray waa duli, saaxib

http://www.halgan.net/view_article.php?articleid=1 1017 this is pretty significant, nurow.

Kashafa you are mistaken to believe that the Sheikh is on the same level as the previous tfg leaders. The man is getting religous fatawas from the highest ranking conservative SOmali scholars such as Umar Farooq and Shariff Abdi Nur, who are all held in high esteem amongst the SOmali Salafis. He is also getting the support of Saudi Scholars and places such as Azhar. So as Xiin said, he is cleverly delegitimising their continuation for war. He is making them look like khawarij by opposing a leader that says he will adhere to Shariah law, is supported by the highest Somali Ulema and is constantly calling for a peaceful dialogue. The opposition fires mortas at the amnisom and his villa, but he instructs them not to fire. Kashafa, how would the average person in Muqdisho view this? The average person will support the person who will bring them peace. Walahi, the man is building a powerful argument and consensus, rooted in an Islamic argument, much different to the warlords of the past. I think you underestimate him, sxb.

wa xarif. as they say.

Originally posted by AAliyah416: quote: ^^ so you gave up on lascanodi brothers? shakes head. All somali men are the same to me regardless of where they hail from. Khalid, lol you people took me seriously.I was merely kidding. lol, i think you took us a bit seriously. I was joking, sis.

Brother Meiji, If Duke said something that doesn't mean it can not have any value. Some tribalists viewed Abu Mansur as a warrior yesterday, but today him and the other fellows who are not from Muqdisho are tribalists from other regions. Furthermore, they wake up at night wishing death upon MOG clans. The story continues that mansur wants peace in his hometown, but he wishes Muqdisho clans to suffer in mayhem and hell. I believe this is complete and utter nonsense. pure tribalism bro. I disagree with Mansur saying he will never meet the sheikh, because the Prophet(saw) even met the jews and christians. I also disagree with his conduct during the airport saga, although he later relented from his position. However, I will never buy that Mansur is a tribalist who wakes up every day wishing for peace in home town, whilst wishing for death against MOG clans. If he does believe that, then I have never seen any evidence showing that. The brother wants to continue MOG struggle because he is against African troops because of religous reasons. If the Aminsom were in Baidao, do you think he will leave them? NO. he was attacking Ethiopians in Badiabo, as well as fighting his own tribeman, the footsoldiers of the Ethiopians, for the past two years. So there is no discrimination amongst his group for any clan. Yes, he is calling those warlords to lay down their weapons and be part of the shacab, but this doesn't in any show tribalism. He is just giving them a chance; otherwise, if they persist, he will crush their skulls. By all means critique his approach, which is largely shaped by his religous beliefs. But do not be like the clan naysayers. You are too clever for that, bro.

Marx, your still preaching your usual " I am more intergrated than thou Somali refugees" nonsense. But we are still waiting for an explanation as to how being more integrated can help people from getting stopped and search?

^^I posted his article( he's not scholar btw) and a refutation by imam anwar in the other thread. you should find that interesting, if you haven't seen it already. good night folks.

Interesting discourse. I await to see if brother tawfique replies to imam anwar's comments. ps. this thread isn't meant to discuss the personalities of the people in action, only the ideas articulated.