Brotha-man, Since you insist on following me around with your primitive questions, I’m going to finally acknowledge your eager hopping and flailing and address you directly. I’m doing this because I don’t believe I previously had the pleasure of discoursing with you on this site. I believe this to be the first time (let us hope it’s not the last). Dear brother, I’ve read your words, took them all in and understood them. Sadly, none of them addressed anything that we’re discussing here. You desperately want to join the “debate†but are struggling to come up with anything of substance. Still, join the “debate†you shall! So, what do you do? You try to use humour and mock my words (great tactic, I use it all the time). However, mocking and ridiculing is an art form, my dear brother. In such instances, your “joke†has to hit its intended target and make sense. Jokes about Arab food and frying pans, while (I have to admit) amusing, do not add anything to this topic or force your target (me) to revise their words! Dear brother, it’s obviously clear to anyone reading this thread that you have the ability to construct coherent sentences. Would it not be great if those sentences also contained coherent thoughts? Put what I like or don’t like aside; talk about what YOU think. Present your case (if you have one), share your thoughts, demolish mine and make it a discussion, brother. Don’t worry about making mistakes or sounding foolish, these things are the norm here (in fact, they’re to be encouraged so long as the participants are genuinely after a serious debate). There you go! I finally condescended to address you, will you reply as an equal or will this little barb blind you?

I can see your topic is about young mothers with children, but what do you mean by “unmarried� Can you narrow your questions down a little, or better still, give your views on the topic to allow the readers to understand the scope of this topic? Of course, I can go ahead and reply to you in a typical SOL way if you like (might even imitate one or two of our Nomads).

Originally posted by Aniga: quote: wouldn’t stoop so low as to patronise you [baashi]! ...How about the rest of us? You are more than patronising and calling us acronyms [QED]! Latin, for Allah's sake! We can barely handle english, and you are using terms of dead tongue that we can't make a head and a tail of. As Baashi said, tone it down, walaalo. This is madal for the good, the bad and the ugly. Everyone will throw in their towel, no matter how wet and stinky! P.S. Whatever happened to these are words on screen, only words on screen! ----your signature, i guess. I don’t believe there is anything wrong with your English. I believe there is something wrong with your patience, comprehension and attitude! Why when reading something that shows my opinion on many posts and thoughts in this site, you decide that yours is one of those being criticised? Do you just like being wronged even though you were not mentioned in person? Many others on this thread addressed their words to me, the pointless and irrelevant ones I ignored whilst replying to those I believed were able to carry a discussion. Even my dear Mr Smith! You would think he would be on top of the list of those I criticise! He is; however, there is hope for him, still. Unlike the many nonentities that post “opinions†on this site, I don’t believe him to be a simpleton; he’s just too passionate about nothing in particular. Yes, my signature is that it’s words on a screen! It’s really ironic that you should ask me that question straight after you asked me to “tone it down†and protested about being patronised! Shall I give you another long dead Latin word here? Saaxib, if you have any thoughts, criticism or ideas on anything I wrote I’m happy to listen and revise things where I’m shown that I’m wrong. Just don’t ask me to tone any of my points (valid points might I add) down just because you feel that they might hurt yours or any other person’s feelings! PS I hope you don’t interpret my bluntness above as an attack requiring retaliation instead of “words on a screen, just words on a screen†that shouldn’t get to you. Will you be able to keep a level head while faced with such “rhetoric†I wonder?

If. You. Can’t. Understand. What. Was. Written. Above. I. Recommend. A. Short. Course. Of. Reading. Comprehension. Failing. That! Some. Tranquilisers. Might. Be. In. Order! Hope the above was clear enough for you, saaxib.

Originally posted by Baashi: quote: This is the second time in as many threads that you’ve asked the same question, Baashi! I wouldn’t stoop so low as to patronise you, saaxib. But, for the sake of clarity alone, I’ll have to remind you that this is a Somali site, the poster that initiated this thread is a Somali, ergo the reply was in relation to those facts. Yes posters are Somalis; yes the venue too is Somali, and yes Somalia happens to be in a mess. But these posters are not responsible the events that are happening in Somalia, they don’t speak on behalf of the Somali nation, and all they are doing is merely putting their two cents on the topic at hand. Why can’t you disagree with the “person†posting without dragging the whole nation through the mud? If your line of reasoning is something to go by, Somali posters should just cease to share their opinions on world events with each other until they take care of their “own houseâ€! That’s unreasonable proposition to me. Oh! Samsam that poor lil kid! She has been violated, wronged, and abused not by mobs in the street but by government agents! She was from the wrong area, the wrong place at the wrong time for the wrong reason. I wasn’t there and don’t know the facts of that case but since you brought it up I say this much the injustice lil Samsam had to endure could make grown up weep. Expressing outrage is sincere form of sympathizing with the victim particularly if you don’t have the power to relief the victim from her predicament. For some reason you are bothered by the wailing but not the kid’s predicament for you got time to protest against the wailing and the outrage expressed by some but I have yet to see any sympathy for the kid coming from you. Tone it down sxb! You are an exceptionally gifted man. You are very persuasive and I tend to agree your take on many topics. But sometimes you cross the line Btw, your posts are getting haughtier by the count...with this Q.E.D I say impressive Heh. Where shall I start? Waxba ha kala sarin, saaxib. Somalis are we. They’re my parents, my relatives and my friends. They’re my acquaintances, the people I meet in social gatherings or even when I go to pray. They’re not some strange nation that I don’t belong to and am insulting out of hand. In my first post on this thread, I belittled the author’s rage and prophesised that others will join her soon in condemnation and false pain! What else should I call her and those I speak of other than Somalis? Saaxib, I understand your irritation, I sympathise with it but I don’t set out to “drag our nation through the mudâ€, I merely remind US that our nation is already IN the mud! As for Somalis ceasing to share their opinions on world events, I gag nobody; I stop no one from “sharing†their opinions. However, when these opinions are ones of a moralistic nature, I cringe, wince and wonder at our total lack of self-awareness! Here, I just can’t help but point out what should be obvious to all. These are discussion forums and the posters start these topics and mean them to be ones of serious natures, but their final products do nothing but disappoint. Am I wrong in declaring my disappointment? As for Samsam’s case, when you say you “have yet to see any sympathy coming from youâ€, how do you measure that? Would the few lines expressing my disappointment have been sufficient or should I have written an entire thread detailing all the feelings and emotions going through my head as the “real†story of this poor girl unfolded? Saaxib, there is nothing wrong with outrage in such a situation. A show of emotion is and should be expected from any decent person. The problems arise when this outrage and emotion become synonyms with the case whilst logic, reason and sanity are viewed as cold hearted and indifferent! There has to come a point when the wailing stops and the analysing begins. Could you seriously tell me that the majority of the pieces written about this case on this website have been anything but weeping and wailing, accusations and counter allegations, suppositions and retaliatory assumptions, total and utter pandemonium? The haughtiness you perceive is simply my dissatisfaction with the way we discuss serious events.

^^^ I don’t think there is any confusion to be cleared here, saaxib. The brother’s words were CLEAR. Read them again and don’t get sidetracked by the trolls in our midst. Let me quote him again: Be it so, it is logically inconsistent, if not morally self-defeating, for a theist, to affirm the existence of a Diety whilst negating the continuation of existence in the afterlife. The denial of "Aakhiro" is a cardinal belief of agnostics and atheists. One more thing: It is possible to present rational arguments for or against Akhiro, saaxib. The arguments being rational would not necessarily mean they’re right.

Q.E.D = Quod Erat Demonstrandum It's latin, meaning: that which was to be demonstrated or proven. I don't think I need to explain more (read my post, again).

Ngonge, I think I understand where you are coming from and you are right some Somalis say bad thing about Arabs and more often than not their judgment is based on unsubstantiated facts. I give you that much. However, that doesn’t mean all Somalis or for that matter most Somalis hold the same view. I beg to differ. I can’t help but notice that you are making the same mistake - that is generalizing a whole people (Somalis in this case). At least that’s how you come across in your posts. I too read the said threads and I deal Somalis all the time but I don’t view them the way you do. Yes, some of them are opinionated, yes some of them don’t meet my high expectation, yes some of them are misinformed on many things but that doesn’t give me a license to make premature judgment of the character of the generic “Somaliâ€. Do that and you are as bad as the ones you are criticizing. I beg to differ, saaxib. First of all, let me address the comparison with the Arab bashers! I am a Somali; I speak about my people, that I live amongst and interact with on daily bases. I don’t speak about Ethiopians or Ugandans that I have the loosest of connections with. When I criticise my people, I do so because I want the best for them. When I point out our shortcomings I point them out so we can banish them and correct are failures. I do so laden with a lifetime experience of knowing, dealing and observing my people. I don’t do it out of observations I made on a three-week holiday! The judgments I make about my people, and here I speak about the average Somalis, are not made out of whim or impulse (though I’ll admit to some frustration). These judgments and opinions are made as a result of studying our situation, looking at our problems and observing the ways we deal with them and comment on them. Need I remind you of where we’ve been for the past fifteen years? (I’m talking about Somalis as a whole and not the broken down versions and divisions). What are the causes of such a situation? Why does the tribal problem persist? Is it a mistrust of only big tribes? Are the clans within each tribe in harmony? Are the sub-clans within each clan on friendly terms? Are the sub-clans of each sub-clan doing better? Shall I go on to the smallest branches and the mistrust there too? When you look at such a mess and think about the millions of people that makeup all these divisions, don’t you wonder what is wrong with your people? Does it not tell you something about the current Somali character? Sure, there are many good individuals out there who resent this whole thing and resist being dictated to by the mob, but, as I’m sure you know, mobs are loud and their rhetoric is enchanting. As a result, they constitute the majority and theirs IS the public opinion. Now, if at home we were disparaging and spiteful against each other, would it be a great leap to conclude that this attitude would also be applied to our opinions of everyone else? Of course, the Arabs (and those of the Gulf States in particular) occupy a special place in the Somali bosom. The average Somali gets to hear about them because of our vital trade with them. The bans they imposed on the purchase of Somali goods and the recent banning of Somali passports, only gave our brethren who are conditioned (see tribe comments above) to readily hate, a reason to despise the Arabs! I believe that the average Somali is quicker to hate than like, quicker to disparage than praise, quicker to accuse than excuse! I don’t believe this to have always been the way. I believe our conditions, paranoia, unsatisfactory social structures and thirst for gossip are to blame (not forgetting the prevailing ignorance). This was a description of average Somalis as I’ve found them, I’m happy to be corrected where people might think I’ve erred (in fact, I’ll be elated to be proven wrong). Now, let me talk about those that I’ll class to be above average. Those that managed to get some education, were fortunate enough to be exposed to other cultures, norms and attitudes (good and bad). These brothers and sisters of ours should be armed and equipped with the ability of looking from the outside in! They should be able to see the pointlessness and futility of many of our practises and paranoia! Do they though? Why when presented with the opportunities to better themselves (mentally) they still choose to follow the rabble? Even when the ignorant majority is correct (as they’re occasionally are), our “intelligent†brothers and sisters regurgitate the views of the mob with no proper analysis of their own! They ride whatever wave is coming next! This is not a case of meeting high expectations; it’s a case of meeting basic ones, saaxib. For when the educated, well off and intellectuals of a nation allow their thoughts to be ruled by the gutter dwellers (harsh I know) the nation itself ceases to exist. It merely becomes a collection of sheep leading the Shepards that, in turn, sensationalise rather than rationalise events!

^^^ Q.E.D

The others taking part in this “discussionâ€, again, didn’t post anything worth responding to (though I’ve got to single out the clever person that misinterpreted the “words on a screen†signature for completely missing the whole point - Still, even there, others beat him to it in the past). Originally posted by Baashi: Folks, Americans got defensive ever since the UN representive uttered the "stingy" word pointing the finger at the rich nations (West). These comparison (who paid how much) charts is all over the news and I'm not sure why some of us would want to single out Somalis. This is just an observation and there is no need to generalize Somalis. Is it me or somehow it's becaming fashionable nowadays to diss Somalis? Btw, Ngonge why bring Samsam into this discussion sxb? This is the second time in as many threads that you’ve asked the same question, Baashi! I wouldn’t stoop so low as to patronise you, saaxib. But, for the sake of clarity alone, I’ll have to remind you that this is a Somali site, the poster that initiated this thread is a Somali, ergo the reply was in relation to those facts. When a person (or people) decide to take the moral high ground on an issue, their own house needs to be in order. Again, I suspect that you’ll stick with your “don’t generalise†standpoint but I’ll again brush it aside and insist on generalising here. What’s at stake here is not decorum and proper ways of verifying “facts†alone, what’s at stake here is an entire nation’s attitude. I don’t need to comment on the Arabs, Indians or Chinese. Their achievements or failures do not reflect on me and have no bearing on my life. With Somalis on the other hand, it all counts. Some of these peusdo-intellectuals are my fellow citizens, their opinions and attitudes; if allowed to spread (which they already have) will impact on my life and yours. Their so-called intellectualism, education and yet to be seen wisdom, does not (shockingly) differ much from the thoughts, opinions and attitudes of your ordinary “Jaahil†in the streets of Somalia (and elsewhere). Their words, though eloquently and elegantly typed are replicas of what’s to be found in an everyday mafrash! They ARE the Somali people. My comments are not aimed at those who pen well-thought and reasonable pieces, replies or articles (of which you are one, though you seem to be wavering today). My comments are aimed at the moral guardians, the panic stricken weepers, the dogged social commentators (of which we have far too many on this site). You ask me why I brought Samsam into this discussion, I rather thought it was obvious, saaxib! I was goading the impulsive and emotionally suspect members amongst us. Worked a treat I’d say. But, seriously, and moving on from the emotional types and what little bones I threw their way, you’ve got to read the comments in the context they were written in and in relation to the trends of this site. A few weeks ago, Samsam’s story was all the rage. The same usual suspects were regaling us with their great wisdom and appealing to our emotions (as usual). The moral panic never looked like it was ending! Apart from a few serious and thought provoking comments on the issue (from the better to do Nomads of course), the majority (on both sides) were just weeping and wailing. Now, the Arab issue is the “in†thing, the rage continues, the weeping and wailing is building momentum, the fingers are wagging again! On both topics, we’re yet to see any rational comments addressing the causes, consequences and implications of the actual acts. Again, my starting point has always been that intelligent people populate this site (though it’s fair to call a few of them “life formsâ€). It is a great shame that this “intelligence†is not often displayed. If you are happy with the quality of posts and would rather nitpick on issues such as generalising Somalis, be my guest saaxib. I’ve always said that many of our brothers here need to work on curbing their emotions. I’ll continue on saying it for I hate to see seemingly smart people (give or take the odd cretin) wasting their talents and allowing themselves to be led by the mob. I might as well add that, once more, I don’t expect the emotionally afflicted to understand a word of this (I’ve left plenty of bones for them to grapple with).

Smith, You didn’t answer the questions I put to you, saaxib. Shall I add one more? What was the aim of your thread? Now take your time, think clearly and post back a wholesome reply. Juma, The issue here is not one of what camp one cheers for, or at least that’s how I’m approaching it. I don’t care for the Arabs either way. I care for “my†people though. I’ll expand on this as this post goes on. “Calow niicda iga daa carabi waa naagee!!†Someone above posted this comment. Baashi, my good sir, tell me, is this short sentence the invention of our witty brother above? Ever come across it before? All the questions you’ve asked are good (in fact deserving a thread of their own), however, on this occasion at least, I suspect that you already know the answers. Of course, anyone willing to go to Somalia and every place Somalis live to conduct a survey on our people’s opinions on Arabs is free to do so and will be doing us all a huge service. In the meanwhile, I’ll continue basing my judgments on information from websites such as this one, word of mouth and personal encounters (as we all do). If all of this is good enough when it comes to Somali news and people’s reactions to them, it’s good enough for judging Somalis as a whole too. Still, the issue here is not Dubai or what the people of Dubai do; the issue is one of bandwagons. All the accusations made against the Arabs are mostly true, their failures, extravagance and occasional indifference to Muslim suffering is exacerbating at times. However, none of this explains the obsession many Somalis have with the Arabs in general and the Gulf States in particular! Why for instance did we have FOUR concurrent and long threads about the Arabs on this site? What is the reason for this fixation and why the need to put them down? Some people have decided to view the exchanges on these threads as those of two camps, The Arab haters against The Arab lovers! This, I suppose, is an easy mistake to make. Though I personally view it as a half-wit’s way of interpreting matters. When I read a piece on this site, I expect to understand the author’s points, motives and conclusions. I don’t want to guess or assume. I might be too much of a dreamer but I was under the impression that intelligent and rational people populated this site! So, when I read pieces that could have been written by the uninformed attendant in my local coffee shop, I can’t help but look down my nose at the whole thing. Yes, you read it right. It might sound patronising and condescending and so it should be. Foolish opinions based on nothing but feeling and “Waxa la yedhi†deserve nothing less. When these empty opinions are accompanied by a sanctimonies and holier-than-thou attitude, I despair! Ignoring them from time to time might be the best option, however, it’s much better to point them out and shame our “intelligent†and “rational†brothers and sisters into revising or better elucidating their hasty judgments (I‘ve long given up on reason). I really don’t expect many readers to instantly “understand†my gripe (even though I clearly explained it above). Still, maybe if I keep on repeating myself each time I see similar ill-thought threads, the sheer boredom and numbness of it all will present some with moments of clarity where they’ll finally see the errors of their ways. Some good souls might advice me to stop trying to blow burst balloons, but hey, you really never know if under that heap lie a few that are still intact.

The other two people that replied to my comments didn’t add anything new and therefore their comments are irrelevant, requiring no replies. NGOON. What are you on about? As for inferiority complex brother I am a proud Somali descendent of warrior poets and I hold a British passport, you know how that goes down in Dubai. I hint at an inferiority complex and you wave your passport at me? Well, let us go to the beginning of this new onslaught on Dubai and everything “Oil†related. There have been a few threads on this site talking about the same subject. There have been many spiteful remarks made about the Arabs. This, as you and I know, is not a passing trend. This is a favourite Somali pastime. One needs only mention Arabs and you’ll all come out from under your rocks to belittle them and furnish us with your important opinions. Like I already said in my earlier post, everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion. There really is nothing to stop ANYONE from revealing whatever thought passes through their mind. However, some ill thought opinions carry the risk of being cut down and ridiculed! Fortunately, in the case of this thread, I managed to suppress my natural tendencies. I was more interested in your thought process, saaxib. You’ve been to Dubai in the summer; you’ve had at least four months to mull over the trip and reflect on all that you’ve seen! Howe then could you come up with such shabby and feeble opinions? Again, I asked the questions to see how you’ve reached these conclusions of yours (though there isn’t much to speak of there). I mention the inferiority complex (and you’re free to dispute it here) because your point seems to be that these Arabs should be doing more (recognise these words from other threads?). Why should they be doing more, to whose benefit? Don’t get worked up when I ask such questions, my total loss at deciphering the reasons for your protestations lead me to think that you hold these Arabs in highest esteem. In fact, your reference to Iraq (and here “your†is aimed at the collective and not you alone), the Asian victims and many other Islamic disasters and conflicts, imply that these Arabs ARE the leaders of the Muslim world and you’re all disappointed at their indifference and extravagance! In addition, all these threads revolve around the issue of wealth, Arab wealth and how it’s being squandered! Is this out of bitterness and envy or have we, the Somalis, been appointed the moral guardians of the Gulf States? As I said, I’m at a total loss here, if the concern is an Islamic one, why aren’t there loud cries about Egypt’s relationship with Israel? Why not Turkey? Why not Pakistan? (All these countries have similar malls and department stores to the ones found in Dubai, or LA by the way). Why are the Gulf States always singled out for the snidest attacks? Could it be an inferiority complex? If not, what then?

^^ The sheer idiocy of some threads will bring out even the most reluctant lurker, saaxib. Hope all is well with you.

And the beat goes on...

What was the aim of this thread, saaxib? What did you hope to achieve by writing such a bitter thread? Is there a point that you forgot to include here or one that we’ve missed as we read your piece? Are you talking out of anger? Why? Is your aim to belittle? To what end? Were you bored? Did you really expect others to refute YOUR opinions? I’ll leave your rant aside for a minute, for it’s YOUR opinion and as most Somalis are always keen to remind us, EVERYONE is entitled to his/her opinion! However, this Somali trend of putting everyone else down is amusing. Talk about Ethiopians and you’ll find many Somalis jumping up and down with bitter accusations and snide remarks (it’s usually not even about disputed territory and historical conflicts, it just IS). Talk about Indians and our proud Somalis will brush them aside with another spiteful remark! Are there any people in this world deserving our good words (other than long dead ones)? Why do we do this? Is it some sort of inferiority complex? Does it help to compensate for our shortcomings? Or, maybe it’s just our way of paying a compliment (in the usual Somali round about way). Fix up, look sharp. Blud!

Rage with me, dear, rage with me. It's the best Somali pastime this. We cry and complain at everything. I suppose people have had enough weeping about poor old Samsam and now it’s the Tusanami thing, eh? The victims, devastation, efforts and contributions don’t really matter; all that matters is YOUR rage! Well, rage on, my sister. I’m sure they’ll be a few others joining you shortly. In the meantime, maybe you should revise your numbers. Saudis Dubai First on the scene - Dubai again Private firms do their bits too! 40 Tons of supplies in 48 hours? NO! Oh look! A Jewish paper agrees with you! ( Read the article) How much did the Saudis pay again? Criticism from within! If you google, you will find

As with most other discussions on nearly all forums and message boards on the net, when a topic is raised, the majority of the participants deal with it in relation to themselves! Abused children, how does that relate to me? Killed innocents, where do I fit in? Single mothers, do I have a relative who is a single mother? Am I a single mother? Polygamy, would I agree with it? Do I think it’s right? Now, I’m not saying that a certain level of personal attachment to a subject is wrong or even undesirable, however, at times, making the subject too personal clouds the mind and blinkers the judgment! First of all, let me give my “personal†view on the topic. I personally wouldn’t want to have a second wife anytime soon (in twenty years time, maybe) but for the time being, I do not think that I can cope with two wives (this is not a reflection on my current spouse or even my non-existent second wife). This is more to do with a feeling that I’m not up to the task at all (too much responsibility as it is). There is also an element of selfishness here, things not being broke and not needing fixing! Having said that, I never know what tomorrow brings and what new opportunities and challenges I’ll be faced with, so I’ll never say never. Now, to detach myself from the topic and quarantine any personal feelings and misgivings that I might have about it, and to view it in the way its author intended it, I believe it to be a great project. The reasons for such a “project†to crop up are all true, the ingredients are all there and the benefits (or even hazards) are much better than the alternatives! Of course, these “solutions†will not apply to all and seeing that there are hardly any married female regulars in this site, they’re not likely to have been an attempt at twisting their arms (so to speak). For those that such words might apply, this is an opportunity to ponder the situation with a few facts and words of wisdom from our resident sage. The final decisions still remain yours! As for the single boys and girls declaring their total opposition (or otherwise), well, what can I say but ask you to all gather round and pay attention, for it’s story time: The Milkmaid and Her Pail Patty the Milkmaid was going to market carrying her milk in a Pail on her head. As she went along she began calculating what she would do with the money she would get for the milk. "I'll buy some fowls from Farmer Brown," said she, "and they will lay eggs each morning, which I will sell to the parson's wife. With the money that I get from the sale of these eggs I'll buy myself a new dimity frock and a chip hat; and when I go to market, won't all the young men come up and speak to me! Polly Shaw will be that jealous; but I don't care. I shall just look at her and toss my head like this. As she spoke she tossed her head back, the Pail fell off it, and all the milk was spilt. So she had to go home and tell her mother what had occurred. "Ah, my child," said the mother, "Do not count your chickens before they are hatched." Source

Caaqil, “pointing the finger†comment was tongue in cheek, saaxib. It wasn’t done as an attack, sorry if my words came across in such away. Where we differ here is in the idea of dependency. I believe this has always been the case. You’re right though, in the past, and maybe because the “begging†was done in audio cassettes, people had more time to ask about the health of their “patron†and give some gossip about the local town and the people around. These days, with technology as it is, many people use the phone instead and are charged for every minute. Harshness and blunt requests are the order of the day. Until there is a functioning state with proper order and institutions (at least in the African sense) most people will carry on relying on their relatives abroad and this dependency will carry on. However, once the state is in place these numbers are sure to dwindle. Many will have, see or get presented with opportunities to support themselves. Many others, as in the past with the Seamen, the Aden workers and Abu Dhabi dwellers, will still seek help from their migrant well-off relatives. Sadly, in their eyes, we always have been and will remain bottomless pits. In the great scheme of things, I personally do not regard this as a major problem, a temporary problem maybe, but not a key one with huge consequences.

Somali people who live in cities ALWAYS asked for money. Can’t say the same about the Nomads. I’m not sure whence these recent delusions of grandeur and navel gazing came from! Somalia has always been a poor country and in poor countries, POOR people reside. The whole tribal system that many of us seem to strongly believe in, though usually sugar coated with pride and superiority is in actual fact all about financial dependency. Remove the dependence and the whole system will collapse. Having read previous threads covering this issue, I can’t help but be amazed at the whole logic. It really does not add up! There is talk of a brain drain; talk of the Somali economy collapsing once this stream of money dries up; mostly talk of total and utter Armageddon (for lack of a better word). I sometimes wonder if people who make these “new†discoveries were those who were well off when Somalia was a republic (of sorts) and are now finding out how the man in the street has always lived his life! I also wonder if they’re just dreamy young people trying to paint a better picture that their minds (and conscious’) can cope with! The answer to the question would of course be different if the money being sent was sent to warlords or fighting men (such as in the case of the SNM and others). However, are there any alternatives to sending money back home when the destination is poor relatives? Should we practise “tough love†and let them fend for themselves? Should we “inform†them about life in the West not being a bed of roses (though it is!)? It’s true that much of the money being sent back home goes to bad “causesâ€. However, plenty more does go to very good sources. There are countless children going to private schools and being funded by relatives abroad, many shops, houses and businesses were built and maintained by funds from migrant Somalis. Much of what has been built and is being built is done through your and my money, but whom does the actual ground work, surely not the “passive†locals? Your article wags the finger of blame but is unsure where to point it, it wants to go for the “soft†targets or even be thoughtful with its self-sacrifice and point the finger at the author himself and those sharing his characteristics (Somalis in the Diaspora). However, it misses the point that when those “suffering†are passive and those causing the suffering are indifferent the whole question becomes superfluous. Somalis, I believe, are simple people; like simple people they boast, like simple people they brag and like simple people they beg! Show them a fountain that has plenty of water in it and they’ll build a city round it. When the well dries up, they’ll wait for someone else to point out a new water supply to them. You can lead them here and there (intellectuals and all) and they’ll follow you. Now, if you’re really sincere in your worries and would really want to change things, you need to get into that cesspit that they call Somali politics and introduce your changes there (mind they don’t corrupt you though). However, if you’re unwilling to go there or “can’t be botheredâ€, then you’re better off sending your money with no complaints while sipping your milkshake and reminiscing about the great old days.

More Goals

Heh. Come on saaxib, give over! Operatives disguised as old women are not the same as a 21 year old mother, are they? Or are you saying that this girl is not really a girl, she’s a professional spy disguised as a 21-year-old mother? Heh. Heh. Love it.

^^^ Insurgent does not refer to outsiders, saaxib (though the American propaganda keeps mentioning those phantom outsiders). Rather what the term tries to imply is that the number of “rebels†is too minuscule to be referred to as a resistance movement! They can’t call them “freedom fighters†either because that, as we’re all aware, will defeat the purpose. As for the original poster, well, he asked a genuine question. His words might have tilted more towards the innocents being killed instead of talking about the “conflict†as a whole, but then again, I suppose that was his aim all along. It all comes down to who and what you believe really. Do you believe that the perpetrators of these acts are Iraqi Muslims or do you believe that there is a conspiracy theory afoot? If you believe them to be Iraqi Muslims, do you think that the innocents being killed are the cost the Iraqis have to pay to gain their freedom or do you think that such actions are extreme? How should the Muslims or Iraq proceed? If you believe that it is a conspiracy theory, an implausible scenario of course, who do you think is behind it and to what end? Where does all of this leave the ordinary people of Iraq? What happens to all those working with the “enemy†in the mistaken delusion that they’re doing the best for their country and people? Would that mean that they’re traitors? Is it ok to kill a traitor? What are the criteria used to identify a traitor? Still, innocent people are dying in Iraq and the likelihood is that they’re dying at the hands of both Americans and Muslims. What’s a man to think or do when faced with such a dilemma?

^^^ A married mother who is an assassin? A bit farfetched wouldn’t you say?

^^ Nothing new yet. I only posted the old stuff in there. MY WORLD

^^^ Glad that you’ve finally seen sense. Expect a PM soon.