^^ STN has been and gone, saaxib. Now it's all about UNIV-TV. Early days..

^^^^ Hmmm! Have you been eavesdropping on my conversations, saaxib? I’ve been (albeit rather casually) researching the subject of Somali TV for a while now. I’m glad to see such TV channels finally springing up. I think STN is gone now though. The only Somali channel I could access in the UK is based in the UK. It’s called Universal TV. They too repeat the same things over and over again. Like you, I wondered why they don’t make use of Somali weddings, videotapes of ‘community’ gatherings and the SMS revolution. I could go on, but I’m a family man and have many mouths to feed (they’re feeble, needy and always hungry). I can’t afford to pass on my ideas for free. :cool:

It is best to usually give up and have a good night’s sleep. Tomorrow is another day, as one Ms O’Hara once said. As for what motivates one! The long answer would involve quotes, never-say-die attitudes and principles. The short answer though, is really, habit and routine.

1991? I wonder what sort of PC he used in 91! Back then, one would imagine, a 286 was state of the art. My introduction to the net came in late 92 early 93 (I think). Since I was not much of a geek, I found the whole thing boring. However, one day, while browsing my local library, I came across a book called the Silicon Bug (or at least that’s what I think it was called). I found the book fascinating, not only for its content but also for its author’s background. He left school at the age of sixteen and went to work in various low paying jobs before deciding to return to university and start a degree in mathematics at the age of 27. He later became a professor of mathematics and technology at one of the UK’s biggest institutes (can’t remember which one now). The book itself was even more remarkable. It was almost Orwellian in it’s prophecies. The book was written in the late 70s or early 80, still this professor was presenting a vision of a future of e-mail, chat rooms, videoconferences, mobile phones, freedom of expression, sabotage, espionage and online capitalism. It read like a science fiction novel, and I most certainly was not a science fiction fan (well, unless you call someone liking Dr Who and The Bionic Woman a science fiction fan – I never liked Steve Austen by the way). Reading that book caught my interest and I wanted to know and learn more about the subject. I enrolled on an Information Technology course (one where the college concerned did not even have net access). My fascination with everything ‘net’ related led me to visit the world’s first ever net café in 1994 (or was it 93?). Cyberia was a great place that was full of geeks sipping coffee and eating muffins. Mosaic was the big thing back then and net browsing was ‘super fast’. Though it was also expensive. It was all very exciting back then but though most of it made any sense to me, I still found it fascinating. With time, my IT courses and constant use of the ‘net’ allowed me to pick up some information and start understanding things. But, despite my thirst for knowledge, it seems I really was not that thirsty. I was young and single and did not want to disappoint the girls by locking myself up in a room with a rickety PC. I did not apply myself as much as I would have liked. Still, those were the great times of the net revolution. The third wave, the information superhighway, the communication revolution and a dozen other names were all assigned to this new phenomenon. We in the UK, though we had many of the pioneers of this ‘movement’, did not have as much access to the net as North Americans had. I vividly remember the fuss about the late releasing of Chicago (of course it was later renamed Windows 95). I remember my great super-duper-all-singing-all-dancing-486DX PC. I remember chatting up American girls on the AOL chat rooms (though, as I was noting to a friend the other day, I now think that Cookie – the Georgia girl I used to chat up – might have really been a man after all). We never had cams and microphones back then. We used to exchange telephone numbers. I can vaguely remember an occasion when my friend exchanged numbers with a girl from Washington DC who went by the imaginative name, Pretty MOON. After they exchanged numbers, he tells her (in writing of course) to log off now and plug the phone in (no broadband you see). He logs off and waits for her to call. She does not call. He waits and waits. She does not call. He decides that she’s a tease and logs back on again. He finds her online. She is angry and accuses him of giving her the wrong number! She tells him that she’s crying and would never use the net again. Back then, there were no cynical people online. To cut a long story short, the problem was that he did not plug the phone back in when he was waiting for her call, so she kept on phoning a busy number. In 1995, one of my housemates disappeared for two weeks as a result of a chat room liaison. He later on moved to Glasgow to be near ‘her’. Another friend used to beg for money in chat rooms (he surprisingly got plenty of cash through the post). Those were the days when everyone was innocent and naïve on the net. To tell the truth, everyone is still innocent and naïve online. We just learned to pretend not to be. That’s all. PS Would love to know more about Mr Barre. PPS I realise this makes me sound older than a comodore 64 but I assure all worried parties that I’m considerably younger than comrade Castro. :cool:

There you go, Fidel. A reply to your shameless attempt to drag the poor newbies to the dark side. Still, most of the recent additions have really not been that good, have they? Is there any chance that the latest recruits will be any better? If they turn out to be rubbish, which I really hope they don’t of course, then I think it’s time for desperate measures. Admin will have to add a script to the application form that asks the potential Nomads to copy the words they see in the screen into the empty fields. Disclaimer: These are the first thoughts that crossed my mind here and I can not ‘edit’ them anymore. I’m sure that I honestly tried to edit them ten minutes ago but I was already fifteen minutes late. Do not judge me on words I can’t edit or deny.

Originally posted by HornAfrique: P.S I honestly believe, from my real life observances, that the idea of breaking-away is really loosing hold on a good number of "Somalilanders" folks. I truly believe with the right government and with the right situation in the former Italian Somaliland, the unity of the Somali Republic can rise out of this ashes much more stronger. Time will tell... If this is true then the people you speak about have smelt some money and opted to go south for the cash. Talk to them and find out details, saaxib. Ask them what exactly is on offer? I’m a Somali and you’re a Somali and we know that Somalis don’t just change their minds for no reason, saaxib. It has to be money (oodles and oodles of money). Why else would your Somaliland friends decide to forsake the ‘dream’ and go back to Cabdullahi Yusuf’s non-existent government? It just does not add up, saaxib. My sources tell me (i.e. waxa la yedhi) that there is a high level delegation from Xamar visiting the Somaliland capital (secretly of course) this week. Allegedly, they are going to offer his excellency; president of presidents; caaqil of caaqils; first man of Somaliland; the honourable Mr Dhaahir Riyaale control of the whole of the former republic of Somalia, in return for a pledge to leave them alone to control Xamar in whatever way they want. Apparently, the president of Somaliland is already aware of their offer and very angry at their presumed impertinence. However, the rules of hospitality and generosity prohibit him from chopping their heads off and displaying them in the Hargeisa market. Therefore, he agreed to meet these delegates and play the diplomatic game.

^^^^^^ Here, let me tell you a story. When I was much much younger than I am today, I used to be obsessed with the game of football. I’d play it every day. I’d watch any and every game I see. Sometimes, I’d be walking back home from school and would notice a bunch of kids playing football. I’d usually stop and join them or just watch (if I don’t know who they were). Between the ages of eight to eighteen, I hung around the same group of friends and we always played football together. Our main striker was a guy called Cali. He was very skilful and quick. He would score goals from all angles and with every part of his body. In addition, he had an amazing left foot. Cali was not very powerfully built and did not have a big frame. However, that left foot of his was the most powerful I’ve ever seen. If he took a free kick or a penalty, everyone knew he would score. That left foot was amazing. We used to give him the usual titles: Maradonna, Pele, Keegan, Zico, etc.. Cali, (who by the way had grown up to be a very fat man) didn’t much care for the comparisons with all those famous people. He thought he was better than everyone and didn’t like to be compared to ‘old’ people. Still, I digress, the point I was trying to make by the telling of this story was as follows: Cali had a name for that left foot of his. He called it Jaguar! This was in relation to the British motor car and not the South American big cat. Though I’m loath to explain the obvious here, I realise that some Americans and Canadians will be reading this and would not work out the connection. In football, left-footers are a rare breed; good left footers are even rarer. Cali was a left-footer and loved reminding everyone that he was. A Jaguar is a British car, the Brits drive on the left and Cali’s best foot was his left one, like a Jaguar on a British Motorway (highway for the north Americans amongst us). When he was younger, he would usually ‘vroom vroom’ before taking a shot at goal. For years afterwards, we all thought of Cali’s foot when we heard the word Jaguar. Though we also knew that it referred to British cars and Big Cats. Cali on the other hand refused to acknowledge the cats or cars and insisted that the only Jaguar was his self-assigned one referring to his left foot! That Cali believed it to be so, did/does not mean the rest of the world would. Now, back to our discussion and the meaning of the word intellectual.....

There you go DreamGirl Don't worry, he has no conservative brother. :cool: PS Can we try to limit the nonsense to this topic and the Troll one please? I beg you, people. I really do. On my knees if you want.

Believe it or not, whenever I hear that term, I always think of Imam Al Shafci! I have a warped mind that goes through it’s own convoluted process deduction to reach some wild conclusions, saaxib. I think it’s because I’ve read many of his poems where he encourages learning and study. On the other hand, I also think of people such as Orwell, Bernard-Show, Hume and Russell (pardon the Brit influence there heh). Sure, some of these people did not believe in God. However, it’s not their beliefs that led me to regard them as intellectuals but their knowledge and thirst for more. When Galileo said that the Earth is not the centre of the universe and that is revolves around the Sun, he was vilified and put under house arrest. He did not question God; he questioned the teachings of the church. I believe in questioning things. If they’re good, they’ll stand up to scrutiny and if they’re flawed, they’ll crumple like the church’s theory crumpled in the face of Galileo’s proof. To be an intellectual (not that I’m pretentious enough to claim to be one) one has to look at and question everything around him. Even Allah invites us to ponder, think, look, view and consider his creations and message. I believe those that ‘accept’ such an invitation are what one should call intellectuals.

Baashe, I think the argument was not to dismiss evolution outright but to suggest that evolution works on a micro level while the creator worked on the macro one. This whole idea though, when applied to schooling is, I’m afraid, wrong. If people want to advocate intelligent design, they should fight for it to be introduced to religious education classes and not science classes. Darwin’s theory, although it is just a theory, can be somewhat proven using experiments and research. The ‘science’ of intelligent design requires faith and faith is, almost always, a bad substitute for thought. Someone above mentioned that theories can be proven wrong. They used that argument against the evolution theory! However, they did not pay much attention to the ‘proven’ part. Theories can be proven wrong because one can carry out experiments to prove or disprove a theory. One can not do so with god (not scientifically anyway, I think). It’s debatable if one can do it philosophically, but plenty have given it a damn good try. As far as I know, this intelligent design idea did not hit the headline until the mad bible bashers decided to force some district schools to introduce it to their curriculum and write the words ‘evolution is just a theory’ on all science books! Do you think creationism/intelligent design should be taught in science classes? How?

We have celm al yaqeen? Saaxib, the world is not black and white. If it were, people would have followed the first prophet Allah sent to them and never ever strayed from the correct path. That doubt exists is not a secret. However, as I said above, in most cases doubt is a good thing. Even he that doubts his creator, if his doubt is genuine and accompanied by a real desire for finding the truth, he (because Allah’s words are persuasive enough) shall find it. Still, that’s not the kind of doubt I was talking about. The type of doubt I was talking about is the one that questions rituals, customs and habits. The one that questions actions, thoughts and intentions (of oneself not others by the way). Forgive me for being crude and slightly cliche, but have you ever heard of giving someone ‘the benefit of the doubt’? Did you ever do such a thing? And if you did, what sort of ‘doubt’ was that? Because we believe, we have certainty that Allah exists (wouldn’t have it any other way). We also believe that the Quran is Allah’s revelation and therefore we believe in Heaven and Hell. It’s a certainty. However, in our every day life we come across a hundred issues and predicaments. They’re not an issue of belief. They are questions we have to deal with all on our own with only ‘guidance’ from the Quran and Sunna. There is no certainty there. Doubt always creeps in. One has to always ask oneself, have I done the right thing? Is this the way to behave? Should I have accused so and so of having weak Iman? What if I misunderstood them? Is it these people that I try to please or the creator of the people? Would he be pleased with my actions? What if he’s not? I better make sure, man. Get my drift?

This is a juicy discussion. Though it seems that the Nomads have decided to each attach their own ‘definition’ to the word ‘Intellectual’. Can a Muslim not be an intellectual? I would have thought people like Ibn Khalduun, Ibn Sina, Ibn Rushed and the many various Muslim writers/poets/scientists throughout history were all the proud owners of the title. I’m keen to find out what the Nomads would class such men as?

Originally posted by Pacifist: Wow people acting like little girls. Where is the maturity and being the bigger person. Seriously though when people are supposed to be putting the fire down and here ppls we are lighting the fire even more. Grow up people and stop acting like we are in grade school. Even grade schoolers now better than this. My clique and your clique, what a bunch of trash. Please grow up Silence is indeed golden. You do realise that this post is not real, don't you? :confused: Psst, I'm not banned (yet).

Hi, How are you doing? I hope all is well. Things are great on my side, thanks. We have not spoken for a while and I thought it would be nice if I sent you a PM to see how you’re doing. Reply soon. N -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi again, It was nice to hear from you the other day. Glad to hear you’re doing fine (always insha Allah). Me? Same old, same old, saaxib. All is well alxamduliallah. Though there is a certain Nomad that’s been getting on my nerves lately. Nothing serious. It’s slightly irritating though. Anyway, never mind all of that; tell me what you’ve been up to. Hope to hear from you soon. N ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hola, Heh. You find him irritating too? I would never have guessed! He is getting worse, isn’t he? Something has to be done about him. I think I’m going to pen a quick message to the Admin asking him to clip a few wings. This should not be allowed to continue. What do you think? N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Greetings, Yes, I wrote that message to the admin. He promised to closely monitor the situation and deal with any instances of disruption. He suggests that we don’t approach the “troublemakerâ€. I agreed. Let us just calm down. It’s a passing cloud. N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hi again, I thought we agreed that ‘we’ should not approach or have any form of discourse with that person! Why did you have to fall into his trap? By the way, have you noticed all these little helpers he seems to have? Why did they pick on you in such a way? I really can’t believe this place is turning into groups and cliques! I might write another PM to the admin about it. N -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hello, I think we need to change our strategy. The gloves will have to come off. We need to deal with these people. I’ve got five people sending me private messages and all saying they’re on our side (your side). How many do you have? Ps I wrote a message to admin complaining about the new clique phenomenon. He wrote back saying that he didn’t notice it and is going to pay close attention. He promises to ban any disruptive cliques or people that ruin other people’s SOL experience. I think he’s saying that we’re on our own here. We need to show him that these cliques exist. Send PMs around and ask all our friends to think of ways to expose this evil clique so that Admin can ban them. N ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi, I’m not enjoying my SOL experience anymore. The quality of the site is dropping and the clique remains. They ruin every topic we start and bully us into little trivial arguments. I can’t stand it anymore and think it’s best if I just quit. N --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi again, You don’t have to quit just because I did. Stay and fight the clique. Plus, I’m not really letting them defeat me. All this is only words on a screen, just words on a screen. It was nice knowing you and I hope you’ll keep in touch by e-mail. My e-mail is: NGONGE@fedup.com N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hi I notice that the site is very quite lately. I logged on a few times in the past week or so and noticed that the clique had a huge hissy-fit and all quit the site (they’re always one step behind me that lot)! Heh. Did you also carry out your threat and quit the site? Who is left here? N -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi again, I had time to think things through and I think I’ve been a little silly here. The ‘fight’ that we had with the clique was irritating and I still believe we were in the right. But, I also think it really does not matter. I’m going to make my peace with the clique and let bygones be bygones. Even if they refuse my olive branch, I really don’t mind. These fights are only virtual and I have decided not to let them get to me. I hope you will see the sense in what I’m writing and decide to come back too. PS I wrote Admin another message. He replied by saying that he’s monitoring the situation very closely and will severely deal with any disrupters or troublemakers. N ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi, I’m glad you have seen sense and decided to stay. Seeing that you’ve been away for a few days, I’ll extend you the benefit of the doubt and blame the obtuseness of your ‘comeback’ topic on rustiness. Saaxib, take my friendly advice and never write silly topics about best gifts one can buy for his girl on Valentine’s Day. PS I’m in a very good mood today so I’m going to share another great tip with you. Saaxib, there is no reason whatsoever for your posts to look shabby and full of spelling mistakes. Do what I do and spell-check them on Ms Word before posting them on here. N ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi again, That reply was really uncalled for. I was being friendly and only advised you so that your contributions will look good. Were my words really that offensive? Even if they were, that’s no justification for calling me an old has been and swearing at me! You are rude saaxib and I expect you to apologise for calling me all those names. PS Use MS Word in your replies here too (not just in public). N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Salaam, This is the second time you’ve sent me an abusive post. I shall not reply to it and will not stoop down to your vulgar level of insults. I will appreciate it if you never correspond with me again. I thought I was your friend but , obviously, I am not. Ps I forwarded one of your PMs to Admin. He promised to monitor the situation and harshly deal with any wrongdoers. N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Salaam, I accept your apology. I now can see how easy it is to misunderstand my words. I sounded condescending, didn’t I? Well, I’m sorry too. I didn’t mean to upset you. You are my friend and stood by my side when we fought the clique. By the way, some members of that clique are talking to me now. They’re very nice people once you get to know them you know. Well, apart from that Nora. Even her friends say she’s a gossip merchant! I was even told that she was spreading rumours about me and telling everyone that I like to chase young and innocent girls (that excludes her I suppose). I’ve written to Admin and told him about her. He promised to investigate the situation and deal harshly with any wrongdoers. N ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- E-mail from NGONGE@fedup.com Hi, Long time no hear. How are you and how is SOL? I can’t log in anymore. I got banned by Admin. I really miss everyone in there, even the clique. Say hi to them all and wish them all the best. PS Can you ask Admin to reinstate me please? I’ve done nothing wrong, man. :mad: -----------------------------------------------

If my understanding of your words is correct then this promises to be a timely and great topic. Without meaning to disrupt the topic too much, I’ll only add that doubt is a good thing. Doubt encourages questions and those in turn lead to answers. He that seeks the truth will come across many answers. If the truth is what you seek you wont be satisfied with any old replies. Doubt will be with you all the way. Doubt of the way things are done and rituals followed is what I’m talking about. Doubt of the existence of a creator is a trickier concept altogether. Other than the doubt found in my last sentence, I believe all other instances of doubt are beneficial. Now certainty on the other hand...

I thought you might like to read what some of those on the other side think. Of course, what the author and many in the West neglect to mention is that while the withdrawals are being made in Gaza, building work is still continuing in the West Bank! So much for it being the beginning of the end. They’re calling Abu Mazen’s bluff here. One wonders how the Palestinians will play the game now. The stakes are getting higher and higher every day. August 24, 2005 A bloodless victory over fanaticismAMOS OZThe Gaza clearance is only the first step in Israel’s struggle between Synagogue and State THE JEWISH settlers of Gaza and in the West Bank have a dream for the future of Israel. I also have a dream for the future of Israel. But their sweet dream is my nightmare, whereas my dreams look to them as poison. The settlers’ dream is to create a “Greater Israel†with Jewish settlements wall-to-wall. In these settlements only Jews can reside, whereas Palestinians can only come for work, doing the simple, low-paid jobs. In such a state, democracy will have to bow to the rabbis. The Knesset, the government, the Supreme Court, will be allowed to continue to exist, provided that the rabbis approve of their decisions. The settlers believe that once Greater Israel becomes a religious entity and a “Holy Nationâ€, the Messiah will come and the redemption of the Jewish people will materialise. In this fantasy there is no place for the Palestinian people except as humble servants and grateful labourers. Moreover, in the settlers’ fantasy there is no place for me, there is no place for secular, modern Israel. My friends and I are “out†unless we repent. At least we are not supposed to stand in the way of building more settlements and increasing the existing ones. If we, secular Israelis, erase our own existence, the settlers will shower us with brotherly love. But if we insist that we have a different vision for Israel, we immediately become traitors, Arab-lovers or even Nazis. But we, too, have a dream for Israel, totally different from the settlers’ religious fantasy. We want to live in peace and in freedom, not under the rule of the rabbis, not even under the rule of the Messiah, but under our own elected government. We have a dream of being free from the lasting occupation of the Palestinian territories. Israel and Palestine, for almost 40 years, are like a jailer and a prisoner, handcuffed to each other. After so many years there is almost no difference — the jailer is not free and the prisoner is not free. Israel will only be a free nation when the occupation and the settlements are terminated and Palestine becomes an independent next-door country. For 30 years the settlers controlled Israel through various governments. They pushed forward their vision and trampled over our dreams. They were the lords of the country. These days Ariel Sharon, the Prime Minister, tries to launch a kind of putsch against the rule of the settlers. This is an attempt to restore the authority of the elected government. If this works, the dream of the settlers may be blocked and the vision of the secular Israelis may be revived. The struggle in Gaza was not essentially a struggle between the army and the settlers, not even between hawks and doves. No. It was a struggle between Church and State (to be more accurate, between Synagogue and State). This is something many nations have experienced: what should be the position and the influence of religion and of clerics in the business of running a country? Some countries have sorted this out centuries ago. Other nations have been struggling with it endlessly. The Muslim world, with the exception of Turkey, has not even begun. During these past days in Gaza we have been witnessing what might prove to be the first battle between Synagogue and State in Israel, the first showdown over the nature of the Jewishness of the only Jewish state. Are we first and foremost a religion, or are we first and foremost a nation? In this first round it looks like secular, rational, pragmatic Israel painfully prevails over fanatic Israel. But let us not forget that this is only the first round. Both the settlers and the rest of us Israelis can be proud that, unlike the very bloody wars between Church and State in many countries throughout history, this first round in Gaza has so far been violent but not bloody. There was a lot of sound and fury, but not a massacre. Will it be like this in the next rounds? Will it be like this when the time comes to give up the West Bank and east Jerusalem in return for peace with the Palestinians? These questions depend not only on the Israelis, religious and secular, hawks and doves, right-wing and left-wing. These questions depend very much on the Palestinians’ response. Would Palestine regard all of this as a bold Israeli step towards an historical compromise with them? Will they reciprocate by taking bold steps against their own fanatics? Or will they regard the clashes between Jews and Jews as a first syndrome of Israel’s disintegration and try to inflame the situation by launching a fresh wave of terrorism? The old Arabic proverb goes: you cannot clap with one hand. A lot depends now on how the Palestinians interpret the struggle between Jews and Jews in Gaza. Amos Oz is author of Help Us to Divorce: Israel & Palestine, Between Right and Right http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,1072-1747807,00.html

But of course, monsieur Though it's mostly Qaraami stuff. When whoever (meaning Mr F) is ready, give me a shout (and a bit of instruction) so that I can post/link/send or beam them up to you.

Femme, It was a joke, m’dear. On this issue, I’m inclined to pass you the reigns and watch you argue this position on our behalf, for we are many but no, we’re not the silent majority. What is your take on torture? Are there any circumstances where you think torture might be acceptable?

The good thing is, people will not be able to download the songs and steal them. They can only listen to them on the site and if they want it in their cars, they have to buy it. Buy? Are you out of your mind? What you need to do is download an MP3 recorder and record your ‘streaming’ songs while listening to them, saaxib. Only when the money is being donated to charity do people buy Music these days. Originally posted by Wordette: Ain't no sunshine when she's gone Al Green is cool but the Bill Withers version is better. Well in my opinion anyway. You should hear the Michael Jackson version of that song. He did it when he was twelve years of age and it is, arguably, one of the best songs he ever did.

Welcome back, saaxib. I trust all is well on your side and you’ve been working very hard to get that promotion. If the youngsters here should learn anything from you, it would be that when men go away they usually return with gifts for everyone. And oh what a gift you came back with! I took the liberty of testing it and can confirm that it indeed received the NGONGE Seal Of Approval. In a matter of minutes I was away shaking my head to Randy Crawford, Ella Fitzgerald and now Grand Master Flash is mumbling about being close to the edge and trying not to lose his head! You’re asking about this place? It’s like a jungle sometimes; it makes me wonder how I keep from going under.. What? What? I too was an MTV child, baby.

^^^ You're a bit late with your info, aren't you? (I'm only here because I was asked to 'fill-in').

Will you really give up your loved ones for the sake of morals and justice? What justice? What morals? Where? The West is the land of infidels and we owe them nothing. We really don’t need to adhere to their laws. That we do is only testament to what nice and law-abiding people we are. But we don’t have to do it, doubly so when it’s one of our relatives being threatened. The Islamic world does not apply Islamic laws and therefore they’re the last people to talk about justice and morals. So you see, your aunt was right all along, FF. You’re under no obligation to blow the whistle here. There is no justice in the world. Now phone and apologise to her.

^^^^ I put time and effort into that long post, dear. I believe it was worth it. You got my point loud and clear, but you’re of course entitled to try and rescue a semblance of face. :cool: As for referring to me as ‘the philosopher of my time’, I strongly resent such a label. I think you’ll find that my philosophy (if such wisdom can be limited thus) transcends all generation (not just yours and mine). No need to apologise. PS Don’t let this playful post distract from the seriousness of my previous posts.

Zulfa, these are unfair questions. You really want me to give you a solution to all Muslim ills? I will not deceive you by making up my own solutions. I will not even bother giving you the usual ‘let us go back to Islam’ solution (simply because you probably heard that one a million times already and mine might be the straw that finally broke the camel’s back). What I do is point out the discrepancies in the way we view the world and deal with it. Do you really not see the pettiness of quoting disparaging words in a commercial dictionary to prove some moot point? If you were doing it, if OG was doing it or even if I was doing it that would have been fine. These would have been our own personal opinions and we (probably) would have had reasons for making such opinions. You note that I did not bounce on OG Girl when she posted her article, however when you mentioned that a national newspaper had actually printed such nonsense (and it’s not even a tabloid newspaper) I despaired. Our media is our ‘unofficial’ spokespeople. They convey (and shape) public opinion. They’ve been doing so for the past 40 years. Had I read such an article twenty years ago, I would have attributed it to the blackout on news that the tyrant Muslim rulers used to have. Now though, with the explosion of satellite media, online newspapers and Internet forums, the governments have lost control on most of the news outlets (and are even loosening their grip on state media). Now, serious newspapers such as Al-Itihad have no excuse or reason to print such drivel. This sort of rubbish should be confined to web blogs and gossip magazines. Zulfa, my dear excitable Nomad, nobody said you can’t criticise America or Israel. What I’m saying (and I’m sure you already understand) is that such criticism has to have a point. Do you consider the quoting of dictionaries and spreading of conspiracy theories an intelligent form of criticism? An intelligent form of discourse? An intelligent form of fight-back? Let us not go in circles and throw tantrums, people. America and Israel are not the friends of Islam. This is very clear and apparent by their DEEDS not the nonsense found in dictionaries. That the ordinary sheep would wail and cry at the mere hint of insult is to be expected, that someone in a position of responsibility would follow the bleating of the sheep and print such nonsensical articles is a shock. I don’t have solutions for you, Zulfa. However, I know (and hope that you will too) that self-indulgence, naval gazing and feeling sorry for ourselves are also not much of a solution. I also don’t think that lashing out and blowing up civilian buildings and people is a solution. I’ve already given extensive reasons why I don’t agree with either method. They don’t stand to scrutiny. This does not mean there are no other solutions. The problem is that instead of looking for them we’re spending our time searching dictionaries and crying about our great history. Ps The Ben Gurion quote was a very mild one. You should have quoted the Sharon one about killing Arab children to stop them from later becoming Jewish ‘murderers’. That would have got your blood boiling I bet. Again. It is a pointless quote, my dear. One does not NEED to hear about it, one only needs to SEE that Palestinian lands are occupied by Israelis to know that Israeli governments are not what one would call our best chums. Can you actually see the pointlessness of quoting empty words of dead Jewish politicians now? Rise above it, my dear, rise above it. PPS اما عن الانسحاب من غزه, الÙار يلعب بعب الكل. شارون كان من اكبر المشجعين لعمليات الاستيطان ÙÙŠ غزه والضÙÙ‡. العقل والمنطق يقولون انه مش معقول يكون غير رايه وقرر يصير مسالم! العقل والمنطق مش الخزعبلات والاشاعات. علا راي الشاعر سيحدثونك يا بني عن السلام اياك ان تصغي الي هذا الكلام كالطÙÙ„ يخدع بالمنا حتي ينام صدقتهم يوما Ùاوتني الخيام وغدا طعامي من نوال المحسنين يلقي الي الي الجياع الاجيئن Ùسلامهم مكر وامنهم سراب نشروا الدمار علي بلادك والخراب No, I didn't find that poem in the back of some dictionary. PPPS طب ليه كدا يا اوجي جرل؟ ما كنا كويسيين ياسستر....اما بخصوص الصهاينه, انتي Ø´Ùتيني كتبت حاجه عنهم غير ÙÙŠ اجابتي الاخيره؟ عباد الله الصالحين وورثة الارض ما يعرÙوش حق وانصا٠ولا ايه يا صالحه؟ ما عليش مقبوله منك يا بنت جلدتي

^^ Good point, well made. However, Ya ku yedhi waxano wa hadal? Instead of leaving the comfort of your chat room to spit out a pointless maahmaah, how about you pay some attention and read some of the wisdom I'm sprinkling your way, adeer? I will not be here for ever, you know. Markan ediin ka tago ayaad ku walanaysaan ‘ninka woxo ahaa nin celmi eyo xikmad meedhan leh’. Taana wa badawnimo, saaxib. Marka, maah maahyadan mala yacniga mad ega daysid oo kaalay ega faayadisow, adeer. PS Do you have a proverb to describe such a situation?