Castro, like I said the Supreme court will decide if he is immune or not, they are not looking at the facts of the case. They are just deciding if he can be prosecuted or not! I don't think you guys grasp the fact that it has been 20 years since many of the war crimes took place. Yet, not a single witness has not come forward against any one else. 20 years is an enormous amount of time! Every other regime suspected of war crimes didn't wait to get the highest member and then work it's way down. You got after them ALL!! There are many suspected in London, England yet you see no one raising opposition to them. The case against Samatar has been going on for many years now. Why hasn't other cases started up, why are these guys not being held accountable. To say "just wait", please....it's been 20 years now! I know NW Somalis consider Morgan the biggest criminal, but in 20 years that he has gone to Kenya numerous times, no case has been brought forward. The 5 years years Siad Barre was in Nigeria, did people demand he's extradition? Like Liberia's Charles Taylor from Nigeria? After the Warlords in Mogadishu fled Somalia when the ICU took over, did anyone put forward any cases? Look at Rwanda, Former Yugoslavia, and any other place. The fact that General Samatar is in court yet no one else is being brought forward who have found sanctuary in Europe, makes it seem very strange. The reason why no one else in Siad's regime, Morgan, Riyaale, the warlords or many other suspecte war criminals in Europe are not being brought forward is because they have thousands of people that will rally support and will give them safe haven. Where as Samatar does not!

Qudhac, The SNM were in the mountains and unlike other rebel groups it decided to move from there and enter civilian populated cities and fight - even though they were warned by the government not to do so. But you still haven't answered the question why is Dahir Riyaale who was working intelligence with Siad Barre's ruthless NSS where alleged war crimes took place is still your president? The million dollar questions has always been, Why are your alleged war criminals being given a green light and being name to public office??

Originally posted by Qudhac: sayid you contradicting yourself dee.. first you thanked the driver and said the girls is safe and well now you saying i made the whole thing up so which one is it... I think it's obvious that the source is not credible!

Originally posted by Sayid*Somal: ^^ina'adeerka mala yaabtay? p.s. please spell the tuulo 's name correctly - it's Qard ho When I was there I called it a tuulo as well; and I realized people took it as an offense. Because when you say tuulo you are not only calling the place a tuulo but indirectly insulting the people about how they think. Let's be honest all of Somalia from Hargeysa, Bosasso and Mogadishu are small compared to the rest of the world. However the word tuulo, is definitely an offensive term in Somalia. So if you go there, try avoid using it .

Originally posted by The Zack: Samatar's employee is your president, is he criminal too? LOOOOOL, of course he'll avoid that question.

Qudhac, You can do that, but make sure you mention that it is only one NW Somali site mentioning, one that looks ridiculously primitive.

These NW Somalis and their websites, when will it ever stop? It seems they love posting articles that are always negative about Puntland and the rest of Somalia. But never anything about their enclave, in fact the news is always positive! The site looks like one from the 90s! The best part about it all is that you present the news as if it were all facts. Like I’ve said once many sites start reporting something, and have pics of the alleged criminals, especially if they are foreign, then you might start believing it. I am thinking that this is motivate because the recent news coming out of Qardho that showed they were able to deal with internal problems in a peaceful manner; something that is rarely seen in Somalia. There was fighting near Hargeysa Somalia a while back over land. Qardho It's sad though that our fellow country men cannot afford any peaceful news coming out of any other part of the their country, and they want to make it seem like they are the only civilized ones. So they have to counter all good news, with negative news. But if you feel it's necessary to continue to quote these shady sites everytime there is good news, by all means go ahead. Sayid*Somal, Excellent job exposing the lies so quickly!

Do you truthfully believe in that conspiracy theory that the PIS and Police are behind the murders? Do you know how bad it is making them look? I believe they are a big reason that the state is still functioning, but that is my own opinion. Remember the PIS and Police fall under and answer to the government. They can be switched! The former governments did it, this one can to. Also, President Faroole changed up the ministers from the previous admin but kept Gen. Abdullahi Said Samatar (which should tell you something), he also work under Col. Abdullahi Yusuf and Gen. Cade Muse. The judge that was murdered was a revenge for a killing that took place in Qardho, the minister information minister that was killed in Gaalkayo was revenge to for murders that took place in the city. One of the parliamentarians were killed by Puntlanders as well. We need to stop blaming the wrong people, some of it maybe Al Shabaab, but some of it is definitely us. There is no respect for the government it seems.

Well, I been there numerous times and I was shocked how safe it was. For a place with so much poverty and other social problems. I never felt danger even at night. The problem is with certain groups within Puntland taking out revenge killing on government officials and other groups (probably Al Shabaab attacking the government). Stop trying to make Puntland seem lawless, criminals who commit theft are quickly apprehended.

Originally posted by Sacad *Ducaale: ^^^ they do in a city like bosaso ama Galckayo since robbery and theifs is more common and knowing the police can't provide full protection everybody has a gun in their houses and shops. What do you know about those places? Actually robbery and thefts are not that common. The problem with Puntland is the assassinations and revenge killings taking place. The government in my opinion seems to be sweeping all this news under the carpet. This has nothing to with police and their ability to protect against theft or robbery.

I believe that eventually disarmament will occur. But it won't be for a very long time! Puntlands biggest line of defense is the population of each of its cities. I know that at Bosasso port, the pick up trucks that are commonly used as technicals are not allowed to be brought in by anyone but the government. Nor are large amounts of weapons. You won't see technicals driving around unless it is controlled by the government. With that being said, of course there are people who are not part of the government, with these heavy weapons, but they keep them hidden. I believe that eventually the government will be able to even get rid of the heavy weapons, but they'll never get rid of the small arms. All hotels, restaurants and other buildings have access to them. I don't think there are many places in Africa that aren't like that. Puntland isn't seeing large amounts of tribal fighting and we have way bigger concerns that need to be addressed. Like the water shortage that will be effecting the world soon and particularly us. We are way too dependant on imports as well. We need to find an alternative to remittance that our Diaspora sends back to Puntland, which is sustaining us. I am not sure if the generations born outside of Somalia will have enough of a connection to their families to be willing to send back money, or at least to the extent that is being sent now. Back to the topic though, the possession of certain weapons can be scaled down, but certain small arms won't ever be eliminated.

Like I said, I look forward to the day when all alleged criminals are investigated.

Originally posted by Jacaylbaro: Originally posted by ThankfulSP: [qb] As i said, it is just the beginning ,,,, tell your Morgan to die before it is his turn ,, Ok there JB, we know Morgan because he was part of Siad's Regime. But no investigation of the SNM who left the mountains and hid among civilians, or Riyaale who was part of the NSS. There's a reason why Riyaale never calls for an investigation, he wants that all forgotten. I suggest that you start an investigation up JB.

That's pretty cool, I've never seen someone quote their own post like that!

First, There's no need to patronize!!!! Second, justice and fairness is practiced all over the world, where NUMEROUS former regime officals from various countries are tracked down (all over the world) and prosecuted. With us, we just went after one in the last 20 years. Just because our older generations doesn't believe in fairness and justice and turns a blind eye to the alleged "monsters" on their side, doesn't mean the new generation will be blind too.

Fair enough Castro, But I can tell you, I want to see every single member of the regime investigated. Those who are cleared will obviously be free, but those found guilty should be punished. And Yes EVERY member, regardless of where he comes from. Whether it is Gen Morgan, or NSS Spy Chief Riyaale.

Castro, the Supreme Court is going to decide: "The Supreme Court will decide whether Samatar – a former government official who was sued in his personal capacity– is immune from civil suit in this case." The case surfaces around whether or not he is immune from prosecution. Lawyers always do that, they attack the case before he can even go to trial by stating that the courts dont even have the jurisdiction to hear his case. So that is all the Supreme court is deciding upon. It's important because it will set a precedent for the numerous other ex-government officals from other countries. Also, "This is the first human rights case ever filed addressing human rights abuses committed in Somalia during the brutal Siyad Barre regime." Of all the people living in all the places around the world and after the 20 years of countless human rights abuses, this man is the one and only person that witnesses have been brought forward. The people aren't looking for justice, they are looking for revenge, personally against this man. I don't see any other witnesses coming forward against the countless other war criminals. That's what annoy's me, it's this disgusting double standard, where people want to see "others" punished but not their own! That's why when I read JB, who said "we're doing our job and this is just the beginning." He isn't talking about the guys living under his nose, he's not calling for an investigation of Riyaale or other SNM. All I want to see is some fairness. You obviously don't.

Originally posted by Castro: quote:Originally posted by Nassir: I am very certain that Samatar, in his official capacity, had never permitted the use of torture against civilians lol Well thats what the video says also, there isn't a shred of evidenc, that he specifically order any of this. Or that he had power over the problems that were plaguing the nation The question is, did he order any of this to take place? and why are no other people being implicated? There are many alleged in England, I don't see people coming forward as witnesses or complaining. It's sickening that some members of the regime become leaders of their region, while others are the focus of this investigation.

Castro, Minority clan may not be insignificant to you, but it is a major factor in this case. Because during Siad's brutal 80's there were many directly involved, like Riyaale that was head of buildings that saw torture and murder. Yet isn't it quite convenient no one else is being accused? What about the NUMEROUS violent rebel groups that hid amoung civilians and used them as human shields? That's a war crime as well. Remember the UN has sited the regime and rebel groups as committing war crimes. The 90's were arguably even more brutal for Somalia, did you see when Qeybdiid went to Sweden and was arrested? The supporters that turned up in protest and the parade he received when he returned. Like I said, by all means lets investigate the man. But it can't only be him, because Siad Barre named him into a position. This Samatar case has been going on for years? Why has no other new compliants been brought forward? Are you trying to say that he is the only person who is alleged to have committed crimes? Irin Here's something, SOMALIA: Interview: Abdirahman Awale and Muhammad Hashi of the SNM Q: Is there also reluctance over investigating these mass graves because there are some people Somaliland also responsible? A: [Hashi] It could be said so, yes, because there are some elements of the Siyad Barre regime in the government who should not have been, really. [Awale] ... That point is valid, but I don't think it is the reason. Some were either ministers or civil servants in Siyad Barre's government, but they were not effective. That is not the point as to why the [somaliland] government is slow to deal with these mass graves. The main reason is that Egal is concerned with not telling the international community the truth of what has happened here. Q: How will you deal with Somalilanders who are known to be part of that former system, or responsible for mass killings? A: [Awale] It's quite clear; just investigations, not revenge, should be followed up. They will be taken to court. Not necessarily Siyad Barre's colleagues only [but] anyone who has taken part. They will be taken to court, and there should be justice. [Hashi] Whether he is a Somalilander himself or whether he is somebody else. --- So, there is a Reason why Egal never wanted an investigation, there is a reason why Riyaale doesn't either. Gen. Samatar doesn't have the power that these men do/did have.

JB, I'll forget trying to have a coherent convo with you.

Originally posted by Jacaylbaro: Are you worried about Morgan niyow ?? You think everything is a joke right? I say let's investigate all former members, bring forward the evidence and witnesses, then a decision can be made. But no, we never went after former NW Somalia's Egal right when he was alive? Who was once number two! We never go after the current leader Riyaale that was head of the same security building that has been implicated in numerous tortures and deaths. After 20 years no invesigations on a single other person! It's this double standard that sickens me. Turn a blind eye to some who are from "our side" and go after others that can't defend themselves. Please dont tell me other complaints are coming either! Especially after two decades.

Rayyan*, I agree under Siad he was made 2nd man, but let's talking about right now and the conditions that his supporters live in, they have no organization to defend him! Can you imagine if people went after Riyaale and Morgan, the people that would come out defend them? Not a single person has been investigated like him, like I said, after so much death and destruction. He is the only man people are going after! Other members of Siad's regime became leaders in other area's of Somalia and are not investigated. Castro, Alleged War Criminals should be tracked down no matter where they are found! You don't pick and choose the ones you want to complain about depending on where they are living. When Siad went to Kenya, there were protest and he had to go to Nigeria. But no such complaints against someone like alleged criminals Morgan or Riyaale! This double standard needs to stop. They are going after this man because he is seen as someone that doesn't have organized supporters.

Originally posted by Jacaylbaro: The Right Title ,,,, Monster Next Door Thanksful, save your anger niyow ,,, we're doing our job and this is just the beginning. Maadeey ,,, you have issues to deal in your tuulooyin ,,,,,, you will probably have the right to talk about that in 20 years or so ,,, Yes that is the right title, but it has a QUESTION MARK (?) after it, meaning that it is not certain and they are wondering, your title does not have one!!! After 20 years since the state collapsed, you are not getting started with nothing, not a single thing. You say Morgan is bad, he travels to Kenya all the time, he's there now, you dont voice opposition. Riyaale was part of the NSS, yet he became your leader. Your former President Egaal worked under Siad Barre In Iraq the new government there banned ALL former Baath Party Leaders. Because logically if you claimed a dictatorship tortured and murdered your people, you wouldn't accept some of it's members into a new government you're forming. Yet, in Hargeysa NW Somalia, they accept so many ex-Siad Barre employees! RIDICULOUS. The ONLY reason you are going after this man and making up the stories about him because he doesn't have supports like other former politicians does that will rally behind him! He comes from an oppressed group that has NO politicians in any part of Somali politics, whether it is NW Somalia, Puntland or the south! The fact that after 20 years no one else has been charged, after all the blood that has been spilled, is proof of this nonsense. Like the video shows, there is NO evidence, just some guy who wants to be famous story! JB you are NOT getting started with nothing!! 20 years and this is the only person!

The real title: Former Somali General, Accused of Rights Abuses, Lives in Comfort in D.C. Suburbs The key word is ACCUSED, which means it's not been proven! So you're little title is missing a question mark, because maybe in NW Somalia trials can end in a week, without all the evidence coming forward, but not in the U.S. Until he is convicted, he is not an animal! The only reason they are going after this man is because he comes from a group that is look down on in many aspects of our society. Of all the warlords, former security services members and other war criminals; does it not seem odd that he is the only person going before a court? Quite sad, I'm sure justice will prevail and this man won't be held accountable for the crimes that were committed by so many others.