^^^You wish, I doubt you would see any sight, pretty or not. Adam I doubt even that would get through.

AfricaOwn and Qudhac jiigaar baad waadaan brothers, and blind support is never good. Either tell us why you maintain that he is an innocent man (ya rabi) What do you think he did for NSS :confused: Xidigo if you mean that then inshallah I shall call you up on it. Try not to turn into screams and timo jijid dear sis. :cool:

I'm just tired of people asking me what about somalia, I've heard this over 500 times in the last 3weeks, it is enough to drive anyone mad. I'm take back my jumped conclusions, baal what are you saying haadaab? Thanks in advance.

Qudhac and Co, the possibility that he "might" be a criminal should stop you short of defending him, even Ngonge line of reason sounds slightly better than saying he is innocent. The guy is clearly not innocent. Xidigo you are famous for your hit and runs (i.e. you barge have an outburst and then storm out without waiting for people’s response) so I won't waste my time. When you want to have a normal discussion without all your luggage and pre judgments, you can holla at me. There is no point haad, I’m not a fan of screaming matches.

So basically you are just moaning for the sake of it. The question is What could someone be doing for Somalia while still in the west that stops them from chipping in to any other crisis? What does speaking out against other oppressions take away from Somalia? I did somewhat read the other postings, what is your point? My response was a general response to everyone who uses that line, nothign personal to you or anyone else.

Originally posted by LayZie G.: Ibti, how do you feel about the sudden "unexpected" ceasefire? Well I don’t think it is sudden at all, they’ve been talking for almost 2weeks, Hamas has completely run out of rockets to fire and its access points cut off. Israel in the process lost the last pretence of why they were continuing the bombardment, not to mention public opinion even within Israel was starting to shift from strong unconditional support to reluctance and leaning towards withdrawal, this included some political and military figures who felt that they have reached their goals. As an advocate for peace and part of ineffective social movement(not your fault by any account), that is far from being ideal, don't you think it would have been better for ceasefire to take place prior to the ground invasion? I mean if we could reason and wish for what we wanted, then I would rather there was no military operation, failing that then a ceasefire before the ground invasion would’ve been the second best option. Now were left with the product of an option. The Israeli pull out will be slow and taken few more life’s in its awake, if they take longer than a week, Hamas would’ve had time to get a few more rockets and there is always the risk it can start all over again (that is if we assume the rockets are the reason) I just want to pick your brain because I want to find out what your views are politically as a movement? I don’t speak for a movement to be honest, I’m just an individual trying to do what I think is right. Other than minimize the humanitarian crisis and the civilian deaths, I don’t think there is much on the politics side that can be done by any movement. Most people understand that this is just a ceasefire till the next invasion, because the root problems still exist and have not been address. Till they are there won’t be a final ceasefire, everything is on temporary measures, and people’s live remain in jeopardy. I know where you stand as far as advocating for peace, calling out injustice everywhere etc but I want to know your political views regarding this on/off ceasefire that always comes in the expense of thousands of innocent human lives. My answer is the same as the above one, any ceasefire that is agreed now is short term and unless it is used as the basis for long term agreement will become ineffective, particularly as Israel continues to blockade the Palestine population keeping them in virtual prison, there would be several uprising which would take a few more thousand lives with it each time. Don't you think that you should be picketting fence's on behalf of the palestinian people by condemning the hamas group who are just as much to blame as the yahuuda?? According to the Israel’s any male over the age of 16 in Gaza belongs to Hamas, who do you want me to condemn? Hamas is a reaction, an organization created as a direct result of Israeli oppression, Palestinians will forever be attracted to organizations like Hamas because they express the general sentiment the Gazans feel. If they were so extreme, so evil, no one would join them, nor would they have come to power. They were democratically elected by the people, regardless of whether I, or you or the west or even the whole Arab world condemns Hamas, the people who elected them continue to support them. So it would not be picketing on behalf of Palestinians, it would demonizing them and saying I KNOW better who you should chose, and I am going patronize you by condemning your choice.

Can you two stop hijacking the damn thread, I can't even read what you wrote. Serenity, err it is a follow up of few semi discussions me and ME had, hence I did not feel the need to break it down to basic but yeah thats true

I came across him very late, it was not until I did my thesis on Somalis and development, he was god sent when I was digging for books by somalis on somalis. Google scholar is great.

^^LOL Adam: I'll dig up the link for you 2morrow inshallah. It is like a skill database for people who want to return back home, there are a few, the one run by the UN is called QUEST and last year they managed to send 80 people back in various sectors. The problem they were having were not enough applications. Its been running for two years now.

Malika really?? Well either way I wish him the best, he helped me in few of my essays and I really like his writing. Qalibi Adyge I have a few of his books, no links on hand, I'll see if I can find some for you 2morrow or so inshallah. NinBrown, LOOL@ boorsadaada culeyka bey kabadaneysaa, I don't take them with me, I leave it by the door on the politics section, it is hard to engage with people who don't want discussion, they want iin laa iis caayo, because it is easier than explaining their position or justifying it. Its okay though caay iyo haabar toona waax maa taro, it only reflects badly on them.

^^^No way??? May Allah bless his soul. Subxanallah, I'm truly sorry to hear that.

^^^Yeah, more home grown Somali doctors would be good. I wonder if they are part of the Quest programs for returning Somali doctors. It looks really good mashallah.

Haye add Marfashland to the list of names being thrown at me by the former Yey cheerleaders. You can keep throwing names, I'm make a little collection for you guys, so far in the box we have: hate, qabilist, Ms warlord, cyber man, miss kitty, hypocrite, marfashland and a few more I can’t remember. Keep em coming boys, it will make you feel better and one day you just might stop crying. :cool: Qalbi Adegy to answer your question, if you’ve read his work on Somalia and development you will know why I say that. His fiction is also largely based on his experience and things most Somalis who have been a qaxooti can relate to. I asked if it was him because I can’t remember what he looks like and they share a name as well as location and no Somali politics is not my specialty- Burco or anywhere else. But I still have an opinion and valid ones at that. P.s. Try to keep your tears on topic please. :rolleyes:

^^^^Oh so since 2006 you posting lies upon lies and yet more lies. Now why does that not surprise me. Qalbi Adgey, I think it sucks big time, if you were around when he was being elected you would've seen me slinging mud big time, ranting about old war crimes. :cool:

Dedicated to brother Me “ME” you asked me to provide an argument with regards to what I consider as the right Islamic organizations. I remember I told you I would do it in a few weeks, so as to deliver on my promise, below I have jotted down a draft of the elements which exclude so many of today’s “Islamic groups”. The basic tenants I could think of for any organization is the following (I’ve ignored or taken for granted the obvious ones such as Muslim > Sunni> on the path of Qur’an and authentic sunnah.) 1) The first ultimate goal/aim of any “Islamic organization” must be to spread the Qur’an and Sunnah i.e. spread Islam and bring people back to worshiping the true God. This automatically rules out every organization fighting for power, fighting other sub sections, governments, land (Land does not include those defending their house/family, but these are classed as temporary organization rather than ones with global out reach, this also excludes resistant groups) 2) The second aim is build a community from the masses by providing knowledge and fundamental guidance based on the Qur’an and Sunnah. This also includes people who are already Muslims but do not follow the deen probably or of deviant sect, this the Islamisation and purification process of a society. This in the essence means reorientation of society towards the Muslim values and strengthening the community. 3) The third aim is to establish and maintain rule and order in the city/ country based on the Islamic legal system. The Islamic system is loaded with hierarchy and order of priority which would allow the existence and establishment of normal life. However this will only be accepted by people if you went through he process of Islamisation. Here we can rule out all organizations that try to mix and match, or pick and mix as it is better known. This includes those that try to establish Islamic democracy or clan Islamic democracy or any other sort of mix, which tries to bring the Islamic system with a man made one. It also excludes that suddenly bounce on a society and try and establish rules and laws from top down. No Muslim organization has the ability and resources to conquer somewhere, break down an existing society and hold power long enough to build it back up again. 4) A strong base needs to be built, including military mighty to defend that city/country. This rules out guerrilla organizations that try to expand their territory without establishing law and order in the areas captured and bringing the population of those areas fully aboard, and via education bringing them up to speed and giving them the same base as everyone else. This will keep your stronghold more rooted and wider. This is probably the key destabilizing factor that plagued the ICU and Al shahbabah. 5) To expand this system and bring more and bigger territories under this system. Resistance needs to be dealt with according to the Islamic laws. Progressing through these stages takes a long time and cannot be done in six months, a year or two or even five. Of course it has holes, these are just my ideas, and nothing is concrete in life, I also jotted them down quickly so it does not encompass everything or even 90%. If you don’t understand or agree with anything so far then say so. I told you in the previous thread that I do not support any Islamic group/ organization because I cannot think of one that is 100% like they should be, without blending the deen either with culture, race, personal additions, personal gains, or the mix and match approach. I still maintain this position, however the obvious exception which I did not consider before is “DAWCA” based organizations, such as the Khalid Yasin Dawa centre, Ahamed Dedat institution and so on, whose aim is to bring about a change in perception and believe via the masses but admit that any visible change would take a lot longer than any of us will live to see.

^^WHy not??? Layzie G, Inshallah I will do so tomorrow.

Che how does them refusing to take part "good news"?? Would it not be better if they accepted the post and tried to influence from within? Little change is better than no change after all. Maybe people are expecting too much too soon, change never happens overnight, even revolution are the result of slow burning sentiments. By refusing to take part, it means they once again leaving everything at the hands of incompetent people. Only good thing about is it that at the end they can blame someone else 70%. EdIT: IS this Nuradiin the same as the author (I think surname is farah?) of books on development and fiction?? If it is the same guy I think he would be good a SOmalia government, that guy is one smart man, mashallah.

^^^I did not bother reading anything you wrote on this thread for I don't see any "quote" from me. So I'm waiting for your evidence. Till then I aint discussing anything else. Back up your claims or take em back

Qalibi Adgey, Sideline cheerleader for duke haa nooqoanini, caadisoo what is eating you. who's always praising reer burco Yes of course, your point is?? :confused: What crimes have they committed, I cheer them because they struggle along on their own and makes ends meet, building from the bottom, the lowest point on their own following war and more civil war. You should be proud of them as any Somali would. Somaliland Its people yeah, again what is your point here? Were you not the one making excuses for SNM massacre of awdalites? Now you are just lying and adding spices to make your case, if you want to call me names, go ahead by all means, but don't make up lies, while I'm still here. Dig up the thread where I defended or made excuses for any massacre. I asked duke to justify his continues mention of SNM, and I explicitly told YOU that I do not support any crimes committed by SNM or any group regardless of the what banner the fly, then I remember proceeding to tell you that the people of SL address those issues in 1993. If you want me to treat you like an idi*ot I will do so. Indeed shame on me for entertaining your bulshid and wasting my time. Bring the evidence to support your accusations warrya. Go ahead, I’ll wait :cool: P.s. Don't even bother trying to change the subject or jump here and there:

I don't understand people who always say WHAT ABOUT SOMALIA??? What about it? :confused: WHat have you done for Somalia, or what are you DOING for Somalia at the moment that you have to stop doing in order to support GAZA. IF you was actively doing something for SOMALIA, or you was in Somalia working or a run an agency or development program for Somalia, then yes it makes no sense for you to stop it, in order to contribute to Palestine. What makes sense is that you continue with your contribution to Somalia and give or do what else you can do for Gaza. Helping people is mutual conclusive and doing one thing does not suddenly make you blind to other injustices elsewhere. What I don't understand is people WHO do nothing for Somalia (Remittance maybe), yet use it as an excuse. You ask them to sign a petition for ceasefire, or send a text or send a prewritten e-mail, or make dua, none of it costs you money and takes about 5mins of your time, so WHY WOULD you turn around and say WHAT About SOMALIA?? Well you can add another 5mins and do the same for Somalia, in fact if you donate 1hour of your time day to helping others or creating awareness, you can afford to use 50mins on Somalia and 10mins on other world crisis. If you want priorities Somalia, it is not a problem, the problem is when you use “Somalia is a mess and if I am going to do something, it will be for Somalia” and then do NOTHING. No one is asking people on the front line in Somalia to suddenly drop what they are doing and queue up at the Egyptian border to help with the emergency relief there, so please save us the drama, you don’t have to choose, you can do both and so much more if you put your mind to it. It is your Islamic duty and responsibilities in Islam are aligned as; you, your immediate family, your near relatives, your far relatives and then the general Muslims.

Good stuff, but I think everyone in SL is an expert on computers (well e-mail and MSN iyo BBC) (What more do you need) JB, what are the yearly costs toolow? I'm thinking of moving my brothers over for education.

Originally posted by General Duke: Emperor Ms Warlord is a dude, what evil person came up with that? Anyhow again lets focus on the topic, which basically states according to news on the ground that large areas of the capital have been taken over by competing armed militias, of the religious and secular types at the expense of the good Sharif and his handlers. What on earth Ms Warlord of the SNM militia will add to this topic I have no idea. She has no understanding of the Northern areas of the country and what's taking place in Buuhudle let alone comprehending the complex issues regarding the clan militias led by IndaCade, Cise Cadow or even what the hell we mean the Mujahids of Ras-Kamboni. Stick to the Queen of England and Faisal Ali Warrabe, or keep quite and learn.. As for the other dude, one has to say hi Hater.. Only duke would think, that one war lord chasing another for power is a complex issue that needs studying. :eek: Dukey I, like you and everyone else listen to the same news that filters in from various sources and can have my own view on it, regardless of whether you like it or not. Maybe you think having the title "General" gives you significance or gives you the power to command who can comment on what and when. Keep dreaming, for reality is very different. My understanding is perfectly clear and objective, I just don’t sit at home reciting clan names and regions like my life depends on it. You should try it, those tinted sunglasses hinder your sight during the night.

Originally posted by dhulQarnayn: ^^^I heard rumors that Morgan used to molest these guys back in the late 80's; I guess these homies still got nightmares about him--go figure, eh! :rolleyes: dhulQarnayn :cool: Republic Of California I see you have limits or decency, Good luck on bringing your “fellow secessionist brothers around” with this mentality. Unless you meant to say he and his soldiers raped, murdered and terrorized innocent civilians in the North. Need I mention his role in Hargisa massacre? :eek: :rolleyes: Juje Did you make this up? Is the guy even in Politics still? I don't know why they think selecting a president from a bunch of warlords will somehow pull everyone together. There must be some new blood without war crimes as his credentials, miis this requirement is essential in Somali politics.

^^^I think there is hope for everyone, he might open his eyes and see different as he grows up. Never give up. What do you mean by the “other side”? I don’t have other sides and there is always a mutual ground for those who are willing to find it. Don’t worry Adiga laaftaad waan kuu soo socda. Oh LOOK Qalibey Adige his here trying to boost his boy. Its okay, bring your little army too, there aint no war booty online. :rolleyes: Duke, I am waiting for your answer, regardless of how long it takes and I shall ask you about it in every thread. Qalibi Adgey; My question to you is; Did you oppose the reception the old man got?? Were you ashamed?, or did you go online and post pictures and take the celebrations global. Lets keep it simple shall we, Silence is approval. Remember the war when Yey brought the Ethiopians, there were puntlanders with petitions all over the place with slogans “NOT IN OUR NAME”, there was a thread even in SOL. I was happy to see people leaving qabil aside and saying the truth then, I saw and still do not see such open disproval with regards to the homecoming ceremony. If you show me I will take my words back, if not keep it moving my friend, I stand by what I said. However it does not make me a qabilist, maybe if I was from the south or Yey messed up the North you would have better luck stuffing that accusation down my throat. As for now “NO Sir”

The ceasefires follow three weeks of intense fighting. The Palestinian militant group Hamas has announced an immediate ceasefire with Israel in Gaza. A statement read by a Hamas spokesman said the group would hold fire for a week to give Israel time to withdraw its forces from the Gaza Strip. The move came hours after a unilateral Israeli ceasefire came into effect. The cessation of hostilities was earlier cast into doubt by fresh rocket fire into Israel and an Israeli air strike on militants in Gaza. Hamas' deputy chief in Syria, Moussa Abou Marzouk, said the ceasefire was in the name of all "Palestinian resistance factions". "We... announce a ceasefire of our factions in the Gaza Strip and we stress that our demand is the withdrawal of the enemy forces from the Gaza Strip within a week, along with the opening of all the crossings for the entry of humanitarian aid, food and other necessities for our people in the Gaza Strip." Israelis and Palestinians give their views on Israel's ceasefire announcement In pictures The group said the ceasefire would be temporary unless Israel met these long-standing demands. The BBC's Bethany Bell, on the Israeli side of the border with Gaza, says Israeli helicopters and drones have been flying overhead and Israeli troops are on high alert. Many people are hoping that a ceasefire will last, but no-one on either side of the border will be surprised if the fighting starts up again, our correspondent adds. Rocket fire Hamas's leader in exile, Khaled Meshaal, will make an "important" announcement in Syria on Sunday afternoon regarding Israel's ceasefire, the Associated Press news agency reported. Israel, whose ceasefire came into effect at 0200 (2400 GMT) has said its troops will stay in Gaza for as long as necessary. Hours later, at least 18 rockets were fired into Israel, Israeli sources said, triggering an Israeli air strike in response. One rocket hit a house in Ashdod, injuring lightly two people, police said. The stopping of rocket fire had been a chief aim of the military campaign. Israeli troops killed a Palestinian near the southern Gazan town of Khan Younis on Sunday morning, reports from Gaza said. If confirmed, the death would be the first fatality since the ceasefire began. At least 1,300 Palestinians, according to Palestinian sources, and 13 Israelis have been killed since Israel launched its offensive on 27 December. Palestinian medics say at least 50 bodies have been pulled from the rubble since Israel halted its offensive. Meanwhile, heads of state from across Europe are in Egypt for a summit with Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, Palestinian Authority leader Mahmoud Abbas and UN chief Ban Ki-moon to try to shore up the ceasefire. They will discuss how to make the ceasefire durable and respected by Hamas, how to get aid to Gaza and beginning the process of rebuilding there. But the BBC's Laura Trevelyan, who is at the summit in Sharm El Sheikh, says with neither Israel or Hamas attending, there are questions about how much can be achieved and whether this will amount to more than a gigantic photo opportunity by those who want to help resolve the conflict .