The elections in a recovering area like PL is not your cup of tea. This is a herculean task if you ask me. So it won't be easy but I trust Farole will see it through.

In the diplomatic parlance, what does “we welcome” mean? Anyone?

NORF, what did he say?

Illyria, I didn’t read the communique in its entirety – just did quick skim through. I didn’t see anything that stands out. It seems President Hassan has ‘his stuff together’ as they say here the states . He knows what he wants and where he wants to take this sick family, the support he needs to make it happen and who can help him to get there. The man has a plan in hand – the so-called Six Pillar Policy [for the South -- 11 regions, 72 districts]. It looks like the IC has endorsed his ground game with few exceptions (consultation with regions, etc). I am backing President Hassan on the social side of the Six Pillar Policy. We should all show some appreciation of the challenges he’s trying to address. I mean who could oppose getting funding for refugees (IDPs or the ones in refugee camps) or building capacity in sanitation or education!! We’re for the country and for Somalia’s reconstruction Marshall Plan. On politics, that’s different animal all together. Of course his plan, and the ground game he sports, is full of holes. He needs to sell it to the concerned constituents that reside in these localities (either through the reps in the parliament – in the form of a budget OR take it directly to the clans that populate these area via their traditional elders). The litmus test, the red line if you will for Mr. Hassan is Kismayo and the question of harmonizing SFG with the emerging federal states. That’s where the rubber meets the road. On that score, we have to wait the outcome of Kismayo’s gathering and the verdict of the parliament on that outcome. So far so good! Good speech by the way. I didn’t expect him to air the family squabbles in public and to my relief he didn’t. That’s good.

Bravo y'all. This discussion was pretty civil. I hope we'll have more discussions of this calibre. See ya Monday. Time to beat the Friday commute. To be continued...

Mintid, The road ahead will be pumpy for Somalia but I see the light at the end of tunnel. I am all for the "one door" policy. I suspect IC are not sincere about it though. We'll see. IIIyria, My reading is the conference will be successfull and interest groups will pledge a load of green stash. So in the international arena I inclined to back president Hassan in his search for reconstruction fund. My worries are that he will interpret success in convincing interested parties to lend a helping hand to crippled Somalia as a mandate to dictate policies as he alone and his close advisors see fit. On the home front, I am disappointed in him. That's understatement. His handling of Kismayo issue is a concern. Neglecting institution-building effort and putting reconcilliation between communities in the back burner is also a concern. Let's see how it pans out.

Illyria;945705 wrote: Oodweyne, I would agree President Hasan's 5 pillar plan was supported, but, as I read it, the thorny issue of Kismayo has been taken over by IGAD. Once the confidence building mission ends, IGAD owns the process and will come upon with a list of requirements only consulting the FG as needed, but the ownership is gone. 100% agreed. Local ownership will be gone pretty soon.

Xiin, That's fine. What's the point of going to Kismayo? Why would IGAD duplicate its fact-finding mission and double handle a task it is already privy to?

Illyria, My reading is president Hassan has scored a major goal. Think about it -- Gathering in Kismayo is under the microscope! The validity and legality of the gathering is under review by IGAD whose boys are in the line of fire. IGAD wants to get back on the saddle, charge forward and take on AS. Kismayo has become an issue for everyone to the point where IGAD observation is necessitated. Xiin, Awoowe Mze Madoobe will soon have guests at his mundul IGAD wants to understand why he didn't accommodate his superiors in Benadir. His answers will be inked on a report that will become the basis of corrective action -- a final decision if you will. Is he up to the task?

Sticking to the topic at hand, here is my question: What's it that IGAD is trying to get out of their observation excursion in Kismayo? In my trade, we pay a visit to suppliers/vendors when there is deviation from the spec -- we called it surviellance/inspection. It is a decision point. There is spec. There is a devistion from the spec. And quality control folks go there to say yeah so and so is not not per xyz and hence quality control reccommendation is reject the product and here is justification we ought be using in the procurement process legal jumbo mambo. IGAD gets there and observes the process -- what's the yardstick to validate or invalidate the legality of the process and the local ownership of the proceeding? Shouldn't the yardstick be the constitution which happen to be vague and now there are reports that's been tampered with? Anyone wanna weigh in on this one? What's your take on this?

I thought for a moment there was a little opening there but you chose your diction pretty well How Silanyo tour going awoowe? Any success acheived where it matters the most (for the hardcore secessionist world view, that is)?

Nope! won't do. I am curious about the tampering of the document. I am less inclined to focus on folks who point out the discrepencies.

NGONGE;945536 wrote: ^^ Err..did you read this thread, saaxib? I refer you to my first reply on it. My little caqli was actually with PL at the time. It were the PL supporters who were against Azania and the Kenayans (but that's not even my point). I'm wondering at the timing, that's all. Do you think the Imam puts it in his diary to cause ruck every May? I shall take the bait. The answer is no Contrary to your perception of the man, one thing (out of many things) he has no control is the Somali political calendar Hassan came to Garowe of time of his choosing. He came to inform Farole about the state of the country. Farole demanded as you would expect from rijaal that he is expected consultation from Mogadishu. He told Hassan he's not up for a game where he is informed decisions of consequence after the fact.

You're getting it all wrong bud. Disappointment? Yes. Surprise? No. Not at all. Hassan and his prime minister have failed in persuading, convincing or even forcing the local constituents to follow their lead. Why? That's food for thought for those who have healthy noodles in their cranium. There is no polls in Somalia. But in the court of public opinion, the clans that hail from that corner of Somalia want to own the process of creating a provincial government of their own. They are united from top to bottom, from traditional chieftens to religious leaders, from rural folk to urbinites. It's Hassan and his passive prime minister who are ignoring the public sentiment and want to ramp their version of federalism down the locals throat. As to this business of invoking foreign card, yes it is true. Irrespective of what JL supporters tell you the frontline states have existential interest in Somalia. They want Somalia that is stable but weak. The federal constitution committe have been conveneved, staffed, funded and nursed in Nairobi. The roadmap is hatched in Kampala. And so on... Awoowe oppose Kismayo gathering if you must but don't you pull foreign card on them.

Illyria, Will check it out. We know Hassan is attending. Does anyone have an idea the composition of his delegation? Are there other significant Somali leaders showing up at this venue?

Homunculus;945497 wrote: I don't wish for this guy to fail but he is making it hard for anyone to support his vision. Why become a president for a federal Somalia and then demand that no federal states be formed? It boggles the mind that he purposefully alienates the people who were instrumental in forming this government, he seems more concerned with the Jubaaland issue than eliminating Al Shabaab, very confusing. I wouldn't say "anyone". Three sentences in one paragraph, Homunculus captured the sentiment of some constituents pretty well. Strike "everyone" and replaced it with numerous or many constituents.

^Rageedii . Post more threads please Ngonge, Farole is also innocent. Who knows? Perhaps he wanted to break the news to the man himself Mogadishu is where the action awoowe. I can't go into the poker game moves being made there and other centers of power including secessionist's den We have to put this baby to bed first. The crying for attention is deafening you see. So who you think changed it? Later guys -- off to a meeting.

xiinfaniin;945265 wrote: Shirka ka socda Kismaayo Madaxweynaha ayaa sidoo kale ka hadlay shirka ka socda Kismaayo ee lagu sameynayo maamulka Jubaland, isagoo sheegay in shirkaas uu yahay mid aanay dowladda federaalka aysan taageersanayn, balse aysan dowladdu diidanayn in dalka laga hirgeliyo maamullo federaali ah cid diiddan ama diidi kartana aysan jirin. Waa hagaag. Nuxurka kalaamka muddane Hassan: 1. Dawladda Hassan ma diidana in dalka laga hirgaliyo maamul federaali ah. 2. Dawladda Hassan ma taageersana qaabka loo maamulay currinta federaalka Gannaane. 3. Sababta dawladda Hassan ku saluugtay hawsha Kismaayo laga wado waa hawlwadeenadu waxay ka weecdeen "dastuurka". Xiin awoowe that being the case Hassan made in the parlaiment, what's your rebuttal?

Awoowe annigu guulwade Hassan u mashxarada ma ahi. Hassan waa nin wanaagsan and I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Laakiin waan caaradsanahay siyaasada dawladu ee ku aadan qaabka loo fulinaya federaalka. Sideedana ogoow in daadka maangalka ah ay ra'yiga ku kala duwanaan karaan. Howsha Kismaayo ka socdaa waa arrin hawlwadeenada gacanta ku haya ay ku amaanan yihiin. Waa hawl dastuuri ah. Ma qabo in decree madaxweyne ka soo baxay lagu magacaabo maamul goboleedyada sidii dawladii duntay. Dadku waa xor. Xaaajooyiinkooda iyo danahooda ayagaa si dastuuri ah uga arrinsanaya boowe. Intaa fahan.

So what's your take on this conference? Timely?

Illyria, awoowe no worries Libaax is the gatekeeper in this joint. He and the good moderators are the babysitters of the forum. Once awhile we got teenagers with toddler attitude, drama queens and all sorts of characters slip through the bug screen. If that happens seniors of the site count on Libaax and our moderators to drop down the hammer

Ah! Clever and well-read Ngonge uses Shakespearean verse and prose to weigh in and gauge the goings of Garowe Who would've thought that high art is possible eh Aight even if we let that one slip and use Shakespearean literary device then it begs the question why Puntland! You would think Benadir is more apt metaphor in this case, no? Instead of zeroing in Garowe the very folks who brought up "something is not right" in what transpired in Mogadishu you Ngonge are sending SOLs in goose chase a la "when did they know it" and "why they didn't say something" Awoowe let's turn our attention to Mogadishu direction and question the motive of those who made an authorized changes to the Constitution So who changed the document, when did they changed, and why they changed it? Does Hassan know about it? When did he found out about this? What about Jawari? Is there a conspiracy going on here? We got plenty of time for the high poker game awoowe

I am just trying to imagine how President Hassan is going to use his executive power in rendering Kismayo process illegal and irrelevant: Manipulate government institutions (Parliament and the Courts) and use them to declare the outcome of the Kismayo process illegal. Withhold aid money to the region, refuse paying salary to security forces (clan militia there) that's keeping the peace in the area, create instability, bid subclans against each other and then turn around and blame the process as the root cause of the conflict! Invoke the "One Door" policy and demand all foriegn entities and other NGO to first get permission from his office before carrying out any dvelopmental or humanitarian work in that area. Create, train and equip clan militias loyal to his policies and plans in the area and send them off to combat AS in the area while dismissing the other local forces loyal to the JL as being illegal ragtag militia that are under unrecognized command. The JL admin (if and when it comes to reality) might -- under desperation -- look for outside foreign help and dug their heels. They might up the ante and breach chapter and verse how Hassan and his subclan coalition are against them and use the ship of state to undermine their legitimate rights. In this tit-for-tat wax kala riixasho, Somalia might slip back to mayhem!! Oh yeah he has a token power and full legitimacy in executing the agenda of the government. From that angle he can do a real damage to the reconcillaition and harmonizations effort between various stakeholders in Somalia. He might succeed and win this subclannish war but lose the battle of getting Somalia reconstituted as respectable nation that is peace within itself and strong in the region. War ninkan yaa la taliya oo yiraahda boowe cagaha dhulka dhig meel dhexaad lalmaneysaaye

^Really? -- Ahem! I am still stuck with the title of the post "There is something rotten in the state of Puntland!"

Rageedii?