It's good to have more options; local airlines such as Daallo could focus on local routes (eg Hargeysa-Djibouti) as before and compete on price. We need air safety regulations but must remember that air travel is much, much safer than car, particularly with Somalis; traffic accidents are fast becoming a major massacre in places such as Hargeysa thanks to plenty of cheap cars and no proper roads and policies. So how much does a London-Hargeysa or London-Djibouti cost with Turkish Airlines? Return surchage and flexibility on return dates?

Naxar Nugaaleed;798362 wrote: here is what am thinking, Hargeisa airport is ok and functioning at or below capacity. aren't there more pressing infrastructure needs if the admin has some money for like roads that would relay more on local labor rather then foreign expertise True, we should take any scheme/project critically and only welcome those that align with the bottom line of easing the conditions of the marginalised without disturbing the local environment (however nice or expensive it may sounds, it should pass the test of being all about and the most efficient way of improving their lot). And please, for all of us, let's not post developmental updates in the Politics section or use them to score points.

Being an unrecognised state or having low capacity may bring some limitations; nevertheless, the bottom line and foremost priority in terms of economic planning should be on how to provide vital services to our most vulnerable and ease their condition through redistribution and favoring labor intensive processes or businesses. Also, big agricultural businesses for instances are environmentally destructive and even less efficient economically, being less labor intensive too just like giant stores etc. Even investments induced jobs will favor foreigners or the elite, better trained, connected, or healthier as in Djibouti where even that small benefit was lost for the masses. Growth for the sake of growth engenders thus a situation typic of Djibouti for exemple: impressive on paper but worsening, already dire conditions for the masses through inflation, environmental degradation etc, exactely as if attracting foreign investments was an end in itself (and PPP GNP or GDP per capita there around 10 years ago before such influx is broadly similar to that of Somaliland). Of course, investments in basic infrastructure or manufacture may assist the poor or minorities; still, small-scale farming, traders or businesses need to be ring-fenced and promoted as they are the only way out of poverty for the marginalised, with redistribution at the heart of goverrnmental policies, eg food subsidies, just like public healthcare or training on which the most vulnerable rely the most. Hence the concomitant case for serious taxation of lucrative businesses, non-essential items, relatively whealthy or "middle-class" locals.

lol so we'll buy baagiye from Lander on Gabiley streets? I remember back in around Christmas 2001 in a small French town buying an irresistible "crepe with nutella". Street vendors in the West make good profits. Who knows if the economy take off these may be lucrative though not a healthy diet... PS: Saad Shire 4 years plan leave almost nothing to vital health services though!

Having come accross statistics from different sources and questioned many of the figures officially published, it comes out that the real economic activity and overall production is particularly understated in the Somali context. GDP estimates and calculations are one of the more concrete, uncontroversial side of macroeconomics; it is actually more of an accounting tool that tally the overall annual production within a country through different methods (regardless of actual levels of inequalities). In the case of Somaliland, its estimated 4 millions inhabitants are said to have a ppp GDP per capita of between $ 500 (overall PPP GDP at around $1 billion, said to be around half that of Somalia as a whole). Yet, other figures show that overall Somali remittances levels hover between 1 and 2 billions and that remittances represents around a third of households spending in Mogadishu, which may means an overall Somali GDP of anything between 3 and 6 billions, plus the non-consumer spending part of the economy. Also, animal exports in Somaliland alone are due to jump to an estimated 450 millions this year (from around 300 millions, mostly through Berbera's port). At the same time, all those figures reflect only formal transactions, focusing on urban activities; observant authors pointed out that with the figures long published for Somalia (since Syad's days), Somalis would have long starved (actual food shortage are solely caused by exceptional levels of insecurity and very time/regions specific as the recent famine and that witnessed in 92 touching the most fertile areas). Thus, milk production as the other main economic activity is thought to represent roughly an equivalent amount of the more official GDP, doubling it. Of course, this still leaves out other rural activities such as processing of milk surplus or even rural-based services since nomads or farmers are self-reliant societies within the wider one. But since a figure must be put on everything, let's value milk production at the local market price and say that rural activity equal the lower estimate of urban activity (3 billions). Let's add now cattle export to the mix (now concentrated in the North) and we find an overall PPP Somali production of anything between 2and 14 billions, slightly undervalued while leaving out other sectors at the same time. This results as an average PPP GDP per capita of anything beween 160 to 1000, either a totally starving population or almost a lower middle-income nation within the context of international organsims and politics aside (we do not get involved in the Somaliland separation issue here, it's just pure economics calculation from international viewpoints that list Somalia as one nation)!

Toyota Marill is part of Marill Group which operates in logistics, alcohol drinks imports etc in Djibouti: Group Marill We have several French/Corsican businesses that seem to monopolise lucrative niches, pay little taxes, import labour etc in Djibouti (Italian-speaking Corsica is almost synonymous with Mafia as it is their main centre in France). They are even accused of subcontracting local "assasinations" or waste dumping in collaboration with local officials. Those who criticise the easily available alcohol are silenced; youngsters now drink and alcohol-related problems have a huge local health/social cost while drinking is seens as socially acceptable in some circles. It is hard to denounce such criminal dealings which indirectly exacerbate the alcohol issue in Somaliland alongside the huge diaspora, through all the famillial and other links; drinking is already widespread in Somaliland too now (much harder to treat victims or deal with alcohol when it is largely underground albeit thriving). PS: GSK Somaliland country manager is also the head of Djibouti's chamber of commerce, a local pharmacist who also own a local franchise of G4S (security services): (his video interview).

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True, particularly if regulation keeps crooks at bay. In fact, my very own mother has started a business with good potential that provide them with steady incomes (much harder to do similar things in Djibouti), though sales are still small volumes and heavily disrupted since the Ethiopian invasion and the ensuing mass displacement & chaos (demand is largely restricted to Hargeysa or Bossaso now). Still, the potential returns and prospects, even in the healthcare field alone, are considerable with minimal stability or regulations & law enforcement. Is it not ironic that a so-called "failed" state provide much better business opportunities and potential than others? PS: the very lucrative unprocessed honey, used as medicine and even for surgical dressing, is another sector sadly hampered by fraudulent practices but it has definitely serious promises for small-scales producers and local communities; it is promoted by charities and traditional hives produce quality honey more sustainably (modern hives and methods are destructive for bees worldwide and their honey do not fetch high premium prices in places such as the Gulf).

Both the frankincense for which we are among the very few producers, and which was exported for ages, as well as the niche honey are ideally suited to Somalia. Fishing and agriculture have quite enormous potentials as well; Sh Sharif was just pleading for Somalis to consider these areas while praising Somalis for their trading skills, when speaking to the local diaspora yesterday night. However, the goals should not be about just production and profits for their sakes but for creating livelihoods for all and to guarantee equality; besides, more money means nothing if dementia, stroke etc increases (which is the case even for low levels of air pollution as a new study just reported by the Lancet has found). Actually, creating "needs" as an economic model and the resulting "wealth" seems like a self-defeating mirage; researchs show for instance that homogenised, processed milk is actually poisonous alongside countless similar or worse consumer products that rely on artificial demand creation, do not respond to a basic need or whose production system is ill-advised (fruits ferried by air or on long distance, households chemicals and cosmetics etc when local products keep more of their vitamins, are less harmfuls or many alternatives to chemicals exist...). Thus, labor intensive systems and industries, those ensuring decent livelihoods and are fundamentally sustainable should be pursued (traditional beekeeping is an excellent example). Again, if great care is not taken, all those resources and, most crucially, the local environment could follow the same path as elsewhere with soil degradation, diminishing fertility, lasting pollution etc now unsolvable problems even in places such as the United States. Indeed, combines, trawlers and other machines may prove to be counterproductive unlike appropriate or intermediate technology, which happens to be more suited to local skills and economy and even more profitable over the long term. These are some of the reasons why an adaptation of the Cuban and similar models is infinitely better in terms of equality and frugality, fair access to quality healthcare and education, limited use of resources and pollution etc than the IMF/World Bank monitored unrestricted capitalism which has lagely failed (consumerism, poor general health status, inequalities, insecurity, pollution and environmental destuction are the norm even in places where it seems decent levels of income have been secured for the multitude)... PS: sorry to come accross as idealistic but economics, health or social well-being etc are deeply intertwined though artificially separated; even merely multiplying factories or export manufacture has all sorts of direct or indirect health implications, hence why an honest leadership and fostering awareness are all-important...

The same sectors that flourish in say Yemen etc are often relevant here too (as for frankincense, refiners get most of the profit and the trees are under threat): The lucrative honey/ specialty honey sector has many advantages and is suited to small-scale producers; Somalia is just ideal for honey production but again, traditional methods should be protected to avoid the same disasters as elsewhere as well as target the organic niche. Aquaculture (prawns etc) or specialty marine products are higly suitable (preliminary studies done in Djibouti). Processing hides (all the way up to consumer goods). Fresh vegetables thrive in Ethiopia/Kenya (demand for fresh products in Djibouti and the nearby Gulf supermarkets). As well as products always in high demand such as sesame, medicinal herbs or lemons (industrial uses in perfumes etc) etc. In terms of manufacturing, there is some scope for IV solutions and other basic healthcare products that are more easily competitive (because of their bulky or more basic nature). There is a thriving but chaotic local medicines import sector (no regulation, lack of cold storage facilities whether at the wholesale or retail level etc). There is a steady demand for healthcare services though. Another sector very much needed and where expertise is available is the publishing industry to satisfy the booming demand for textbooks that are both relevant and affordable. There is a good demand for decent education too. Textiles, carpentry and basic agriculture processing or tools (eg adapted technology irrigation pumps/tools) could also thrive, particularly if protected (eg, the Kenyan government only orders from local furniture makers). Again, with courageous policy makers and less corruption, the less technology intensive industrial sector could take off (including refineries or cement plants). There are even decisive local advantages such as raw materials or ports and location that cut transport costs (no country built its industries by following the IMF and other open trade advocates recommendations)... PS: The key to all that is again transparent and well-informed policy-making that prioritizes local public interest; honest traders seem often penalised or discouraged when others with less scruples undercut them (dubious medicines, inferior prestations or conflict of interests such as referral to a clinical relation etc)

^That is impressive. Additional langages develop the brain too, facilitating further learning. I remember they sent my elder bro few months to Germany/UK in his private engineering school (in addition to the Auralog software/ films in original version and some user-friendly, concise books). He was having fun while learning key langages I think natural curiosity fostered at at young age plus a culture of reading at home (books instead of TV) is much more crucial than formal teaching when it comes to langages, just like anything else. A child who has read tens of books is already more knowledgeable than his teachers and there is little need for a teacher if the teen is already passionate about history, reading anything about biology he finds etc. I remember how bored we tended to be at school as well as how easy it was to score the highest grade up to high school (even then, only the Maths/physics needed some real homework), to the extent these years were almost entirely superfluous (my biology teacher at year 7 could not believe I did not have proper notes); of course, parents need to stimulate, read to and tell stories to their kids while encouraging reading and curiosity. It should comes naturally for many of us to be real polyglots anyway. PS: We would see wholesale change if a real culture of stimulating curiosity and reading took hold (helped by public libraries). Translating medical Dutch works and other European texts, followed by widespread adoption and enthusiasm for reading laid down the foundations of the Meiji reforms in Japan that litterally turned a backward nation into one of the most moderns overnight (in around 3 decades).

It's all about immersing yourself and confidence as well as finding interesting material/hobby; eg, you can learn Arabic largely by "just" watching and listening in Arabic or taking classes in Tafsir etc (it should comes naturally if you are learning Islam basics etc). However, the positive side of today's world is that user friendly, self-teaching materials in even Somali are more and more available. I bought myself the "Tell me more" software by Auralog we used to have at the university and quickly brushed up and lifted my english within weeks while having fun. That software and few other classes on an educational channel plus a few issues of the "Times" improved my english much better apparently than years of formal teaching as things are much easier when you are interested in the topics/material. Now, they even have that well-known software in Arabic and I just got hold of the next part of a well known arabic learning book for an english speaking audience : Mastering Arabic 2 How great it would be to have such resources widely available for school students and test takers; I remember finding user-friendly, decent material was a challenge even when we had all the time, enthusiasm or will. PS: Am I polyglot if and when my spoken Arabic improve (I already watch and get most of Al Jazeera etc), given that I'm fluent in 3 other langages?

There are some inaccuracies: it's around $ 80 millions for both foreign bases, I don't know how much for the recent japanese one. Still, African and other elites literally plunder their countries. Take Gabon, for instance, which is inherited like a piece of property with locals living in need despite all the wealth, used in part to finance French parties (the French military repress and keep the country for the "owners"). As for corruption, it's not that bad by Somali standards at all (think about Riyale's admin before Moh. Hashi reforms) but it demoralises just like nepotism, hence the heavy brain drain and demotivated public service. It would be great if morality had a place in Western approaches to other nations as this analyst implies but the truth is that foreign powers either encourage it directly or indirectly.

I do not think that lack of funds are the real problem in Djibouti since the public budget alone is nearing the $ 600 millions with minimal taxation (it would be great should the overall Somali budgets reach that target even within 10 years of better stability for example). But funnily enough, if oil is exploited, most Djiboutians are automatically entitled to it as they largely hail from Awdal and other northern constituencies part of the TFG 4.5 groups (pres H. Guled was from Garissa...some djibs and one djib MP are even from Puntland clan); it's not even dual citizenship as the Somali constitution start by defining nationals as all Somalis, not to mention that Djibouti itself is one of the claimed territories (though Somalis only reside traditionally in around 20% of Djibouti for the few really indigenous). More seriously, I think having pooled resources or cooperation is imperative: the Djiboutian date palms project with the Saudis could be ideally extended to the Bossaso hinterland for instance. Ports and Telecommunications are sectors where the Djiboutians are at the forefront in Africa too. Sharing expertise or even pooling resources in the Water and Clinical training areas could make a difference too. It may even makes sense for Somalia health ministry generic drugs procurement and other regulations be subcontracted to the Djiboutians at least initially etc (sharing experience is as valuable as wealth)...

True, all we need are anti-corruption leaders with a vision. We already have enough wealthy entrepeneurs to manufacture all the basic at home: the authorities would have to discourage most imports too apart from some drugs, electronics or production lines from India. Economic planning should be strict and disincentivise consumer spending or firms investment on non-essentials/imports in favor of basic goods/services and the underlying industrial infrastructure. How great it would be to do your laundry with detergents from Burao, have dinner with tuna from Berbera, then go for a ride filling up on fuel refined in Bossaso to buy some ampicillin straight from Garowe before coming home on your bed locally assembled in Hargeysa to read some book printed in Gabiley.

Great and overdue; let's hope it will stops in Djibouti or Hargeysa. It may even be a good deal to go to Muqdisho but take local flights between there and Djib/Hargeysa; I would be excited to transit from there. PS: Turkish Airlines already offers good deals on the London-Addis road; It's one of the very best international airlines.

Well, the brother thought 2 were enough it is said, I think the others were Somalis, he's around somalis here with great akhlaaqs. Now back to the topic Che, is it Ok to smuggle one into Stockholm, keep one with you and another in Somalia if you are not really rich or start a mini clan without having much resources? MMA, do you believe it's a badge of honor to have multiple wifes as an average guy or should one focus (unless there is pressing "need")?

Funnily, this revert bro who was pressurised to accept his 3th Somali wife started matchmaking/ a matrimonial website. It's easy to prioritize akhlaaq, deen and intelligence (little to do with degrees) without forsaking cultural/regional or physical affinities but the new growing dilemma is that of the place/residence: Should you carry on a "distance" marriage with some months of the year shared? Are multiple marriages reasonable with states support? Etc (I really prefer girls back home though as a strong conservatist)...

Well, I'm glad Ailamos raised the environmental concerns behind those deals (and environmental engineers or campaigners are badly needed); these are the real issues we should focus and put our energy into (alongside the equality priority). Now, let's hope those soda drinks are heavily taxed; there was a ban on junk food outlets in poor areas in even L.A, so public health, equality and environment should matters rather than short-term profits for some (and the chinese now realise that more money means nothing if you get toxic air, poisoned water and new diseases). If you want to invest, then build clinics, schools, or light industries in irrigation tools, construction or textiles (regulation is paramount to avoid a paradise for the few but worsening hell for the rest). Do you guys know that in Cuba, even pest control is chemicals free and urban agriculture on small plots is a significant sector? Now, that is a far better model than China in every respect (as a world model in terms of equality, health access or sustainability)...

Home is indeed one of those often cited, abused and misunderstood concepts (such as education, progress etc) but which requires deeper analysis, and my views rejoin those of brother Archdemos. Having both my parents born and bred in Djibouti and lived there up to adulthood, we still tend however to see home as that corner of Somalia where most of our relatives still reside; it is common for many families to own lavish houses and plots in Hargeysa, Borama etc yet still rent or live in modest dwellings in Djibouti. Besides, our best memories tend to come from summer trips accross the border (I still remember the weekly Somali band boy parade on Thursday back in 86 at 2 and half years etc). My mother, whose business has taken off there, is adding to her home in Hargeysa and talks of retiring there. In a sense, one can thus say Djibouti is a more "permanent" sort of work commute area for such families, a kind of second home where one is very much at ease, while still yearning for the ancestral neighbourhood. I would also fell half comfortable in places such as Oman or Sudan, even more at ease in Jigjiga, Bossaso or even Baidoa further away (particularly if more relatives moved there); yet, the only certitude is that I would always feel alienated and on my toes in places such as Canada, let alone Europe. Of course, the routine "small-scale" forms of prejudice or hostility and different core values are the biggest reasons as to why. PS: There are naturalised Somalis, particularly in Oman or Yemen, not to mention many married to locals; it would be hypocritical to offer accross the board passports without full equality in practice as testified by the bitterness of France 's Maghrebins Arabs, packed in the Banlieues tower blocks (who tend now to emigrate to Dubai or Doha for real opportunities).

Indeed, the fighting between the SNF/Syad Barre loyalists and the USC militias was the cause of the insecurity and looting, though historical accounts and Morgan assertion on this tape may incriminate more Syad loyalists for the barns looting as their militias lived off the land, having no direct access to Mogadishu or wider resources unlike the USC. Of course, when aid finally came, the blame shifted more on Aydeed side for hindering deliveries; it was already way too late anyway and the situation was improving after having reached its apex. As for the locals, It is widely accepted that they suffered for having little military inclination or weaponries, establishing the RRA later as a self-defence force in reaction to such events.

Baashi;773301 wrote: Ac of Spades, I withhold judgment and assume by barns you meant fertile farming fields in that area which encompasses Bay and Bakool. Let’s suppose, for the sake of argument, that marauding armed militia or members of former military units determined to restore Inna Barre’s presidency looted the large warehouse in Baidoba! In your judgment, would that act alone be sufficient to cause the great famine the world had witnessed in 1992? You may not be familiar with the number of warehouses a city of Baidoba’s size may have or how big the footprint of typical warehouse of the farming cities like Jammaame, Jilib, Qoryooleey, Biadoba may be. Typically it is only one and the footprint is 80 x 40 meters. Say there was two warehouses and each twice the size of the typical warehouse (an order of magnitude increase); still that wouldn’t prevent the calamity that visited Biadobo. I am -- unknowingly perhaps – sweeping it under the rug. That’s not my intention. I just don’t see looting a shed causing an epic tragedy of the scale we witnessed in 1992. It is safe to say, and evidence attest to this, that the great famine of Baidobo was a culmination of many factors biggest factor being the sustained clan fighting in the area and the cascading effect it had to the farming communities. Well, I am more amused than shocked by the tape, not least by Gabyow oratory skills and humor; Morgan, though, epitomises the power hungry psychopath manipulating clan alliances as he sees it fit to his ambitions (of course, regular nomads seem not so keen to be used as mere tools, dragging feets and putting away weapons, and rightly so one may add) . However, and much more crucially, the "side issue" of Baidoa region famine is actually the worst tragedy overall in the Somali saga and those folks are by far those who suffered the most, almost on a genocidal scale. Of course, this does not necessarily means the hundreds of thousands of victims was deliberately planned but I find very appealing that those who suffered on a much higher, such massive scale are seldom the loudest, while those events are overlooked by other clan "intellectuals". My comments are not specifically directed to Baashi, but those of us familiar with how famines erupt are aware that it is almost never related to "natural" causes or so-called droughts (that are a permanent recurrence) but rather due to human factors, chiefly insecurity or deliberate policies (as Ethiopians starved en masse in the 80s even with food available on the markets). In Somalia, Historians such as as Ioan M. Lewis mention that the great famine in the nineties was caused principally by the fighting between Aydeed USC and Barre militias as farmers were harassed and their grain stores looted (insecurity and looting means no harvest no matter how fertile the area is). Entitlement approach to Famines Causation

Well, I must confess that even "Sheikhs" can be pretty insensitive at times (they have their own issues after all); abusing others (in the genre "the child is ugly") is totally different from minor poor manners and call into question the person basic ethics. Let's say that at this stage asking about private details, even about one's frequency of intercourses with his wife as happened to this acquaintance, is rather a minor inconvenience as there are much bigger issues; I'm myself impulsive at times but I am still unable to conceive how someone could be totally insensitive in shocking ways, being deficient in basic empathy, sincerity or ethics. So, the rest seems rather secondary, apart from lying, double speech and spreading rumors, verbal abuses or greed that place relations or interests beyond fairness. PS: Norf some "religious" figures are cons artists or frauders, I'm always amazed at how others trust and revere "wadaads" or "healers" we know very well; I guess TVs and the larger public should learn to deal with them according to their credentials or honest reputation (hence the importance of knowing basics about the deen, which shouldn't be hard really)...

My main concern is that mosques and other model institutions should be frequented and run by people with manners; I have even further restricted my social circle (I'm seen as a loner) but still resist the temptation to limit myself to few people with shared backgrounds etc as not to stagnate. It's now too evident that those with the most frustrations or insecurities tend to be also the meanest (illiterates, former addicts etc). Likewise, one tends to be better treated too sometimes by others from the same clan/ region and I no longer get shocked or annoyed by the initial asking about your clan. However, one can learn a lot from getting out of his comfort zone and even obnoxious/rude Somalis can have good sides; it is thus always far more profitable to be forgiving and learn from others's positive sides/achievements (you get also lots of happiness from helping others). PS: diabetes, diet, lack of exercise or meditation, frustrations and linked brain or mind perturbances etc are a big factor, particularly among groups such as Somalis where it's vital to promote healthy lifestyles and habits such as running, non-processed foods and spirituality (that would save families and communities as much as if not more than promoting reading or a learning focus)...

Norf, I was long criticised for being too nice, indirect and hence "responsible" for being taken for a ride; surprisingly, this acquaintance who is seen as bad tempered, making a scene in public (as a lesson for others) is now largely treated well and avoided (hence why I often get asked to get "hot" too and throw tantrums, make scenes). Of course, insults, violence, envy or spreading rumors is totally against our background and I now find myself changed, taking less precautions before criticising or reporting something about someone, even though I largely hang with "wadados" or "sheikhs" (the irony of learning the worst things from people supposed to show model behavior). I agree there is a lack of regulations and we have even witnessed beginners teaching others despite basic mistakes on the blackboard. Of course, the lack of exercise, terrible diet, diabete or past addictions of those involved act also as a poison to the brain and those links between diet, lifestyle and mental health or behavior is increasingly explored...