Xabad...Warya. This is a discussion amongst Muslims so I suggest you stay out of it. No one asked to hear the opinion of a deluded Atheist. I suggest you just read books which conform to your perverted ideology (Nietzsche, etc.)

Xaaji, if the Shabaab controls all of Somalia, then they'll come right after Somaliland, Djibouti, Yemen and any neighboring territories. They're Internationalists. What part of that don't you understand? I think it would be better for your Tribal Militia to send some forces to South Somalia to help destroy Shabaab, because they're just as much your enemies as they are ours.

Xaaji the only reason why they never attacked your Tribal Enclave is because they've been severely weakened by AMISOM and are too preoccupied with subduing the South. Remember, your cousin Godane is an Internationalist, and he's even threatened to attack countries as far away as the U.K. and Turkey. So what makes you think your 3-City Republic is exempt? What makes you think you're safe? If Al Shabaab controls the entire Somalia....from Kismayo to Bosaso, they will have under their control territories as large as France, with millions of Somalis under their control. You really think a fanatic Shabab-controlled Somalia is going to be good for Somaliland? The Taliban War in Afghanistan has spilled over into Pakistan. The War on Drugs in Mexico has spilled into the U.S.A. Not even the Americans have the power to stop the fanatical Mexican Drug Cartels from operating in California and Texas. Yet you think your Tribal Enclave can stop an Army of thousands of fanatics who will do whatever their Amiir tells them to do, including dying for their cause? What happened to your common sense? Somalilanders should be concerned about the events in Somalia....;because sooner or later our troubles will come knocking on your door. And trust me it won't be pretty And what do I think should be done in the future? Well I think the SFG should first control their territory....build up a professional army....kick out the foreigners....and then institute a moderate form of Shariah Law over Somalia. Al Shababs 2 main recruiting tools is the presence of foreigners in our country and the notion that they are the only ones who want to implement the Hukm of Allah. If we take that from them, it'll be easy to negotiate with their more moderate elements and then crush the extremists

Xaaji...you're comparing apples to oranges here. The Americans never managed to defeat Vietnam but they sure as hell caused a lot of casualties. Vietnamese soldiers died at a rate 30x higher than the number of Americans who were killed. But Vietnam still "won" the war. For Shabaab to be successful, they don't have to win ....they just have to survive. And since Shabaab is known for their hit-and-run tactics, what makes you think the Somaliland Army would be able to defeat them? Shabaab recruits Americans, Canadians, Europeans, Arabs and Africans to their force. Do you REALLY believe that they won't be able to recruit people from your Tribal Enclave to wage war against it? Are you that naive? Shabaab isn't stronger than the AU or any other force but they "survive" just like the Viet-Cong survived during the Vietnam War. If you want to have your head in the sand and think that Shabaab wouldn't be able to conquer (or at least cause havoc) in Somaliland, then its up to you. But I don't think Somalilanders would wanna live the rest of their lives wondering if they'll be killed by a suicide bomber while they're having their morning coffee. Get real

Xaaji you'd better believe that if Al Shabaab subdues the whole of Somalia, they're coming right after your little tribal enclave as well. Don't think for a second that the Security Apparatus in Hargeisa would be able to withstand such an onslaught. So no, it's not a good thing for us, and neither is it good for your 3-City Republic you like to call "Somaliland". You'd better pray that Al Shabaab is defeated in the South And yes, I know not to believe the Turkish hype. This current President is not politically mature enough to know what he's doing. I'm surprised he hasn't been forced to resign in shame yet.

It's silly for Somalia to believe that any country has it's interests at heart, except them. It isn't surprising that AMISOM wants to prolong this conflict so they can fatten their wallets. The Somali Government should be using AMISOM, Turkey, the EU and the United States to fulfil their own objectives, and then discard them when their objectives have been met. But to expect this President to have the political common-sense to do this is wishful thinking

Nin-Yaaban, the officials wouldn't be able to triangulate the phone-calls unless there were at least 2 Cell Towers within reach. Since they were flying over the ocean, there are no cell towers anywhere nearby. It'd be very difficult to find out their exact location. The ocean is enormous The whole thing looks like a tragic accident to me. Perhaps a mechanical failure. A lot of people claim that it's terrorism but don't terrorists usually take credit whenever they commit a terrorist act? The terrorists would at least release a statement taking credit for the bombing. That's what they always do

Xaaji that was an invalid point. When you mention the "Presidents of Somalia", then only the years 1960-1969 are valid. Because of Siad Barre's coup, dictatorship, and then the complete collapse of the government. (This current "government" isn't really a government. Siad Barre was our last real Ruler) And Ibrahim Egal (from Somaliland) served as Prime Minister for a few years in the 1960's. So your grand total of "53 years" is actually merely 9 years. That was very deceptive of you saaxib.

Look Khayr, there's no desire on my part to control Somalia. I just want my country to be stabilized and I wanted to ask this forum what would be the best initial steps in order to stabilize the country? What are the best steps to take? If you have any ideas yourself you're more than welcome to state them. Out of my 5 points, you might agree with 2 or 3 of them. You might have your own suggestions. And all of this is showing us what the current government is not doing correctly. And it's showing us that this President is weak, and has no real desire to set right the miserable state of our people

<cite> @galbeedi said:</cite> Fair enough. Judging by some of your threads, Certainly you are a bright young man. I am one of those middle aged men who are both nostalgic and desperate for that great Somali State Again. Not being from the south does not disqualify you to be the President, but I understand That by judging the latest events, it is becoming " qori Isu dhiib" from the south. Somalilanders are one of the biggest pillars and puzzles of Somali nation in terms of culture and history. Without them, we will be deprived the uniqueness of the Somali culture. We are in transition (kala guur) at this stage of our nation.I do not agree On the issue of Hargeisa destabilizing the south. Godane might be The leader of the extremists, but it is the people of the south who are Harboring Shabaab and other anarchist ideologies. I do believe the issue of Somaliland is not the most pressing among the obstacles that are preventing the re-birth of Somalia. Strange thing how so many Somali youth are nostalgic for a Republic they have no memory of. And I'm trying to be as realistic as possible when I say that a man who's not from the South can never be President (at least for the time being) And there are some I know who believe that the Somali capital should be moved somewhere else. Not Mogadishu, and there's a great case to be made that Mogadishu no longer deserves to be the capital for all Somalis. And I actually do believe that there are elements in the North who actually want to destabilize the South. And elements in the South who want to do the same for the North. And the problem with Somaliland is that a large proportion of the population is so stubbornly insistent on separation. If we recognize the "3-city Republic" and let them conduct their own affairs, a country the size of Belgium or Portugal, then so be it. When Somalia is stabilized inshaAllah, then it's not far-fetched to believe that the smaller country will attempt to forge political and economic ties with the larger Somalia. And that would be best for everybody

galbeedi, this isn't meant to be some form of "competition" where people compete for who has the best ideas and plans. I'm not concerned with that. I posted my suggestions on this forum so that I can bounce my ideas off of you guys, and you are more than welcome to criticize me or encourage me. This is a free-exchange of ideas, and that's what I'm attempting right here. Perhaps 1 or 2 of my suggestions are a good idea, perhaps none of them are a good idea. But thousands of Somalis do frequent these forums, so I want to make these ideas known to the wider Somali public. We both want the same thing, which is stability in our homeland. And I know I'm not capable of holding Somali Presidential Office, mainly because I'm far too young, I don't have the necessary skills, and my family is not from South Somalia. And regarding the issue of Somaliland, aka the "3 city Republic". The reason why I proposed such a thing, is because I believe deep-down that hard-core secessionists will do whatever they can to gain independence, including derailing the peace process and stability in South Somalia. There are already reports of sources in Hargeisa who are donating funds to groups who are destabilizing the South. If we recognize them as an independent country (minus Sool, Sanaag, and Awdal provinces...those would still be part of Somalia) then Somaliland will be a tiny shell of a country, alongside it's much larger neighbor Somalia. It would be like France alongside tiny Belgium. And when Somalia develops economically and socially inshaAllah, then perhaps the Somalilanders will see their mistakes and attempt to forge economic, political and military ties with the larger Somalia. And this could be a worthy suggestion, but then again I could be wrong here Again, saaxib. I said the FIRST 5 steps when taking power. Obviously minting a new currency, establishing income tax laws and raising government revenue are important. But none of these would mean anything if the country wasn't even stable to begin with. You can't put the cart before the horse. We need to take baby steps, and what you propose is great, but it can ONLY be implemented once there's some stability. So building a professional Somali Army would be relatively cheap, and soliciting money from International Donors could be done under the pretext of "fighting terrorism and piracy".

I would have to suggest that this "strong-man" be from one of the smaller sub-clans of the H-Block. It can't be someone from the Northern regions of Somalia (obviously as the South would have to be subdued first) And it can't be a man from the 2 larger H-Block subclans (the one predominant in Galmudug nor the one that Qoslaaye belongs to) but perhaps the smaller ones. And again, this is for political reasons

Yeah I'm totally sure the secular republics of the 20th and 21st century's were peaceful and didn't violate the rights of their citizens (sarcasm) You're out of touch saaxib. I'm looking at Africa and the Middle East and there are secular governments all over the place, and the countries are still poor, backward, violent and corrupt. Reer somalia needs Islamism, we don't need fanatical secularism

Prime Minister Erdogan of Turkey, over the last 10 years, consolidated his power and purged the country of the Secular Military Establishment, which was responsible for 4 coups and which held the "real power" in Turkey. He is a political genius and he masterfully undermined the Generals and then he took control of Turkey (which was a much harder task than Somalia) Saddam Hussein did something similar in Iraq, when he took power. Gamal Abdel-Nasser took power and consolidated his position when he took over Egypt. Fidel Castro did the same in Cuba. Ibn Saud did the same thing in Saudi Arabia in the 1920's. Ibn Saud masterfully maneuvered his way into power, and then consolidated his positions as soon as he took power. And then when he died, his sons took over. Some of these men were elected, and some of them took over forcefully. But all of them were politically savvy, and all of them consolidated themselves as soon as they took over. And this has happened dozens of times in the 20th century alone. I mean, History is replete with examples of strong men who overcame these obstacles and successfully took over their country. I would argue that subduing some of these countries was a much harder task than Somalia. But when it comes to Somalia, we have this defeatist mentality and most Somalis think like "Oh our country will never get better, Somalia is hopeless and no one can do anything to resurrect it." Why is that? Is it really that far-fetched to believe that the same thing can be done in Somalia, when it occurred in other countries literally DOZENS of times? What we need is a strong man who's politically savvy. And a man who's willing to get his hands dirty. And why would that be hard to find? And why do people who do complain about the situation in Somalia have no will, or drive to actually improve ourselves?

<cite> @Holac said:</cite> Dr. Kenney, As a side comment, there is more to Somalia's problems than meets the eye. I believe a large segment of the population back home suffers from some sort of mental illness. Combine that with poverty, lack of education and the daily cycle of violence and wollaa, you have a monster as a neighbor, brother, friend and a family member. It is not easy to turn things around. I know, I've heard of it myself. A large proportion of Somalis do have illnesses. Which is why I think the "bottoms-up" approach to rebuilding Somalia would be unnecessarily difficult and could take several decades to carry out. A "top-down" approach would be much quicker. And the FIRST Task would be for a Leader to consolidate his power and tighten his grip on the country. That's it. That's all the President should be focusing on. Honestly, the ICU of 2006 proved that you CAN stabilize Somalia if you take the necessary steps. Everything else (poverty, crime, health, education, human rights) can be handled later. It's better to be realistic and focus on actual doable goals. And since the President has literally hundreds of millions of dollars (of international money) at his disposal, then he could definitely carry this out in several years.

Warya Alphy, if you didn't read the points I raised then what gives you the nerve to respond in a manner as if you did read the points? Every single point I made is about consolidating power in Somalia. Not any reconciliation conferences, not addressing human rights abuses, not improving education/infrastructure and not worrying about the economy. This is the very direct task of consolidating power by behaving like a Dictator. Starting a massive propaganda campaign, creating a Revolutionary Guard, and using international funds to recruit a professional Army are all things which are extremely doable and can be done in under a decade.

None of it is idealism alpha Read the 5 points again. All of it is extremely doable and realistic. And this current President has the political capital and the resources to carry this out. He just doesn't want to. He's either unwilling or he's too dumb to do it. But he could do it, which is why I'm asking you "What would YOU do differently" if you were given the presidency? Remember, over 70 men ran for office, and any one of them could have won and could have done something different. It's not like I'm trying to make Mogadishu the next Singapore or Hong Kong. I'm making very realistic points.

I remember proposing a bottoms-up approach to fixing the country, but that would be an ambitious project which will certainly take DECADES to accomplish. What we need is stability. First and foremost. Once we have stability, then we can focus on nation building, fostering a national identity, and building the economy to a point where people naturally forget about their petty clan differences and work towards building the nation. Those who refuse to change their mind-set will be left behind. And the poisonous generation of Somalis who were responsible for this mind-set will eventually grow old and die out. And this will leave a new generation of Somali kids, who have never known civil war, and have grown up in a stable, peaceful Somalia. I would imagine they'd be less inclined to be Qabiilist if they grow up in a comfortable setting. I've noticed in America, that although many of the 25 year old Somalis ARE Qabiilists, they're not as bad as their parents. Because they grew up in America, a peaceful country, in comparative wealth and a comfortable standard of living. And I guarantee you that their children will be even less Qabiilist than them. It does gradually die out if the people live in a stable atmosphere Even a temporary delicate balance of power will be enough. As long as the stability is maintained long enough to grow the economy and then create a grassroots group (a 21st century Somali Youth League) which could be Pan-Somali in nature.

I'm totally sure the Somali Government has plenty of experts on Ukrainian and Russian history, politics, culture and customs. So yeah, they'll definitely be able to mediate this conflict.

If in 2012 you were elected to the Somali Presidency, instead of Qoslaye (that incompetent loser), what would be the FIRST 5 steps you would take immediately when taking power? What would you do differently? I know I'm gonna get a lot of criticism for this (but I have a good reasons) but what I would do is this: 1. Create a Revolutionary Guard (similar to the one in Iran) and recruit 10,000 elite men to train them, discipline them, and use them to conduct intelligence, guard government officials, infiltrate terrorist groups, and have tight control over the country. 2. I would officially recognize the self-proclaimed 3 city (Hargeisa, Berbera, Burco) "Republic of Somaliland". Look, we can't force them to re-join our country, and they've made it pretty clear that they plan on staying separated for the next 100 years if it's necessary. People with such a mentality can't be "pleaded with" to rejoin the country, so it's best to go our separate ways. But I would make it very clear that Khaatumo won't be joining the secessionists, and it will be a part of Somalia instead. Perhaps the secessionists will change their minds after a decade and apply to rejoin Somalia. 3. Make it my sole mission to recruit and build a professional Army, Navy, and Air Force in Somalia. And I know our country can't afford it, which is why it would be a good idea to use the Europeans, Americans, and Arabs to help pay for it. Force Puntland to incorporate their Army into the actual Federal Army. Actually pay a high salary to the troops, as well as lobby the United Nations to ease the Arms Embargo so we could purchase advanced weapons. 4. Attempt to persuade and use the Clan Elders to my advantage. Use their influence and be very severe towards the Elders who oppose the government and attempt to undermine it. (This is for obvious reasons) 5. Start a massive propaganda campaign against Al-Shabaab, qabyalaad, people who are nabad-diid, and others. Public opinion will soon be in your favor, and that'll be a good thing for everybody. (6. PS. I was thinking about mandating that my poster be put in public places, but that would be a little too excessive ) And for the 1st time in 23 years a President will have complete control over the country . Then after that we can focus on education, health issues, infrastructure, the economy, and everything else. This current President's SOLE JOB is to stabilize the country. There's no use in worrying about anything else. Everything else can be handled by the next President (as soon as he leaves in 2016)

This has to be some sort of a joke. This can't be real Either that, or Qoslaye is the silliest African Leader to hold office since Idi Amin Dada

<cite> @ugo said:</cite> what a brain dead culture. i think im somali by mistake. Yeah, I think you should change your name, move to a town with no Somalis, and just blend in with the environment there. And burn all the bridges that you previously had with Somalis or Somalia. If you want, maybe we can start a fundraiser on this forum to help make that possible

He most definitely is happy with this news. An Atomic Bomb could be dropped on Mogadishu and this person would celebrate it. May Allah punish hatred

Somaliland is going through a lot of the same crap that the rest of the Somalis are going through, but XX wants to bury his head in the sand and pretend its some sort of wonderful free Republic that is some sort of Utopia. It's unbelievable what lengths people will go to justify their delusions

XX I'm not talking about the borders of Africa. I have no interest or knowledge about the borders of Cameroon or Benin or any other African state. That's not what I was talking about. We're talking about Somalia, we're talking about the non-recognized state of Somaliland. So since Somaliland isn't recognized just YET, wouldn't it make sense to come to some sort of agreement and form permanent borders for Somaliland, one that benefits the people and the surrounding neighbors as well? Why stick to these ridiculous British-drawn borders which clearly don't reflect the realities on the ground? Why do you care about the British in the first place? Why are you allowing these filthy European Imperialists cause conflict between Somalis? Re-draw the borders. At least Puntland legitimately came into existence as a project from the citizenry itself. It wasn't created by some foreign Europeans