Do I admit SOME Members of the Awdalite clan and the Las Anod clan support the secessionist project? Of course I do, and I even made a thread on SOL about 2 years ago, talking about it. My clan itself is divided, with some supporting PL and some supporting SL and some supporting Khaatumo. Either way, if there's a nationwide referendum in every single district of "Somaliland", then secession can only be granted to those districts who support the secessionist project. All the others stay with Somalia. Just like the referendum which happened in Quebec regarding secession from Canada, about 20 years ago. The Quebecers decided to stay within Canada, even though it was a close and narrow vote. But don't you dare make it seem like all non-Waqooyi Somalis beg to share a country with you, that we would accept an unfair arrangement just to appease you. It doesn't work like that. Believe me, separation is better for people who think like you

First of all, you are a subclan. Only certain subclans in Waqooyi want to separate. My sub-clan, the Awdal sub-clan and a couple other clans, want nothing to do with Somaliland. Remember, I'm from "Somaliland" as well. Yet you want to share a country with me. Second of all, judging by your rants, this was obviously mirqaan-fueled. You can't POSSIBLY be sober. So I'm justified in calling you a Khat addict. I'm not here crying for Unity. If these are the terms the Reer Waqooyi want to impose on us, then good luck finding any Koonfurian willing to share a country with you. P.S. Somaliland must have a separate Army and then have the South pay for it!?! Hahahaha

<cite> @Tillamook said:</cite> ^ SmartLander is the alias of the bi-polar CiidanSuldan(the rabid kitten of SOL). However, we will entertain his harmless shenanigans as long as he accepts his fate, that he ain't going nowhere from Somalia. If him and his sub-clan give up their Separatist dreams, and they bow their head and accept the fact that they're not special and just like any other sub-clan of Somalia, then that would be ideal. But unrealistic. Khat does wonders to the human imagination. I'm telling you bro

Tillamook, there's no need to even reason with the likes of him. Smartlander, we don't want to share a country with you and those who think like you. If you're indeed the "reasonable one" amongst your friends, then secession benefits us just as much as it benefits you. 50%!! Even though Somaliland isn't even half of Somalia's population. Absolutely ridiculous. And then he wants to prevent Koonfurians from entering Somalland unless they have special permission. And he wants Somaliland to have their own separate Army. What kind of a Union is that? P.S. Smartlander's marqaan-fueled rants must be indicative of a Troll or someone who's extremely deluded.

<cite> @Safferz said:</cite> I was in Hargeisa for a week, and I'm sure it's no surprise that I did not want to see you. LOOL Alpha just give it up dude. Go on a long quiet walk through the streets of Hargeisa and then cry yourself to sleep Alpha Hahahaha

<cite> @Tallaabo said:</cite> 50k is a reliable estimate of the number of civilian casualties from the barbaric Sahal regime's genocide in Hargeisa. The total count is even bigger when the rest of Somaliland is included. But as the Xaaji said, the people of Somaliland licked their wounds, rebuilt their shattered lives, and moved on. We don't take revenge and we don't hold grudges that is why Almighty Allah blessed Somaliland; and may He continue to bless and guide us. Ameen, may Allah bless your land and continue to guide the people. But if you're gonna describe the barbaric regime of Siad Barre, just say "Siadists". Much better term ....It's not like Siad is a friend to anyone on this forum. Dr Osman also is very well-aware of the crimes the Siadists committed in Eyl and Bosaso

Exactly. If 500 000 Somalis lived in the Waqooyi region in 1988 (for example, I don't know the real number), then the 50 000 death rate would mean over 10% of the Waqooyi population died that year. Died as a result of Siad Barre's bombings. That's a catastrophically high number. 10% of a population dying is an extremely high number. Iraq lost about 2-3 percent of their population when George W Bush invaded in 2003. And that's a worst case scenario. The war went on for many years, with extreme fighting, bombings, and air campaigns. And they only lost about 2-3 percent of the population. That's a higher percentage than the amount of Germans who died in World War 2. Germany lost about 10 percent of it's people and it was an absolute disaster. The Russians lost about the same number of people and it was a major disaster too. I'm not buying that 50 000 number. It seems contrived. But even 1 Somalilander dying as a result of Siad's crimes is too much. We should definitely move on from this

<cite> @Xaaji Xunjuf said:</cite> ^^ If 300.000 people fled Hargeysa was basically empty in 1988 , the 50.000 was the numbers of Human right watch but it could even be more ,remember the city was being shelled by Somalia's artillery and Mig jet fighters , hargeysa was very populated Not to be insulting, but I find that 50 000 number very hard to believe. It's extremely high, and Waqooyi's population at the time wasn't high enough to make the 50 000 number sound even believable. But there's no denying that General Morgan and Siad Barre committed unspeakable crimes in the North.

<cite> @Xaaji Xunjuf said:</cite> True Somalis can defeat shabaab, not 30.000 African union troops they have done a terrible job since 2006 its almost 8 years since the AU troops were in Somalia. There isn't enough opposition to Al Shabaab amongst certain sub-clans in the South. Many Elders from the Ceelbuur clan are sympathetic to Shabaab. And same with some of Mukhtar Robow's cousins in Baydhabo. And this has only helped Godane and his ilk There definitely needs to be more of a concerted effort in the South to defeat and corner these Shabaab thugs.

Yes, AMISOM can't defeat Al Shabab But Somalia can. Only Somalia itself can end this conflict. If you don't want to help yourself, no one will help you, that's true.

LOOL Tillamook Dude, 50 000 is a lot of people. Do you really expect anyone to believe that a lightly-populated region like Somaliland lost 50 000 citizens in 1988? Are you kidding me?

Dr Osman, that's very true. I'm not buying the story that 50 000 people died in Hargeisa when Siad Barre bombed them in 1988. It's such a far-fetched number, totally inflated and not taken seriously by anyone except CidanSultan and his crew. I don't think they appreciate how large of a number 50 000 actually is.

Yeah I definitely understand. First this Government should focus on actually having full control over its borders, and having real legitimacy, before we even begin talking about new currencies. Things in Somalia are moving too slow for my liking. We're moving at a snails pace and accomplishing the most basic tasks is taking far too long

<cite> @Tillamook said:</cite> Lol:D Silaanyo will run for president of Somalia in 2016 and here you're acting indignant. Hahahaha Let the process of merging begin!! Silaanyo 2016!! Let's spread the word

Anyone who's been to Somalia knows how difficult it is to do business with the almost-worthless Somali Shilling, to the point where all major transactions are done through dollars, not shillings. Now, knowing all this...should the current Government reintroduce a new Somali shilling, with different denominations and a new exchange rate? (eg. 1 US Dollar= 50 Shillings) It would be far easier to do business in the country, civil servants and soldiers can be paid with this new currency, and the benefits would outweigh the costs. There could be a Government decree, telling everyone who owns Somali Shillings to exchange their old currency for the new currency at the nearest Bank. It could be like 1 US Dollar = 50 Somali Shillings. And then as the Somali economy grows and expands, the Shilling would slowly gain value until it's on par with major world currencies. Anyone knows how painful it is to do business in Somalia when you're forced to use US Dollars for all major transactions.

<cite> @CidanSultan said:</cite> Waar xaji miskinsana. The pirates are done forever bankruptcy folaaynimo, talk and their desert wasteland with 2.5 villages. Finished Walahi the defeated has historically been owned by duriyada and even till this day they are owned. Even with Africa's largest army we owned them hahah... Hag wa Iska dad masakin Walahi Lakin to them is their own. God will do as he sees fit. Lack of culture, honousty, integrity etc. Nothing left... Can any of you pry this flag from my hands... No so keep talking hahah... The pirates are nothing but desert losers who are folaays and can't fight and are bankrupt while the HAG are anarchists and everyone else not from your tribe is devoid of honesty and integrity and morals and character? Wallahi something is wrong with you. I dont know what it is. You're actually disturbed. You live in this alternate universe. Look around you. I've been to Hargeisa and trust me you're really not that different from people in Garowe or Beledweyne.

This guy went from visiting Refugee Camps in Dadaab to campaigning for Somalia's Presidency to supporting the SNM Campaign in Hargeisa to now calling Somalia "cursed". All this in a span of TWO years. Wallahi this man has no credibility. He has "Opportunist" written all over him.

Congratulations and much love to the people celebrating over there. To accomplish so much with so little resources is a great feat

Doctor Osman, 50 jobs isn't that good but at least it's better than nothing. No one is saying Puntland should rely on Koonfurians or Somalilander people to create jobs for them. All I'm saying is that the Somalilanders may create SOME jobs, which will ultimately be good for everyone. Business and free trade is a win-win situation saaxib. Somali Businessmen living in Uganda and Zambia and Tanzania have created THOUSANDS of jobs for the local population. Imagine those same Somalis moved to Puntland and created jobs there? Why try and punish businesses through high taxation? Puntland's Government should develop a "hands off" policy to the economy. Believe me, Puntland can transform very fast. There just needs to be a concerted effort to convince the Puntland diaspora to invest in their land, to build factories and start employing thousands of people. You guys can make the desert green if you wanted too.

<cite> @Mooge said:</cite> Puntland is more free market oriented than Somaliland. Taxation is low in Puntland and this why Burco people ship their livestock at Bosaso rather than Berbera. I don't want Puntland to increase taxes on goods and businesses. Puntlanders are the business friendly people of somalia and we are free market society who die for low taxes. keep it that way. Puntland should take notes from Singapore and Hong Kong. Those 2 free market economies BOOMED within such a short time because of their free-market policies. Puntlanders are very business-savvy people. They could literally transform Puntland into a regional economic powerhouse if they follow the right policies. Low taxes, low regulations, and very little government meddling into the economy. People could be running to Puntland for jobs and opportunity.

But Dr Osman wouldn't heavy tariffs and a doubling of taxes ultimately harm Puntland's Economy? It would just make things more expensive for the locals Even if the Somalilanders and Koonfurians pay little taxes, at least their business expansions would help create jobs for the local people. And more jobs means more prosperity. Taxes in Puntland should be as low as possible, to foster economic growth and prosperity.

Xaaji, if the Kenyans were smart, then back in the 1990's they would have created autonomous Federal States in Southern Somalia (similar to the Administration in Waqooyi) and then create some fragile peace in the country while having a strong influence in the affairs of Somalia. It would've been a win-win situation. Kenya could have taken credit for stabilizing the country, while at the same time they directly have control over Somalia's day-to-day affairs. But no, they were too stupid. You can't expect these docile, low IQ Kenyans to ever make decisions that's in their best interests. They're too busy pandering to Westerners and hosting Safaris. And the Somali Civil War will continue to destabilize Kenya. The Kenyans have no choice but to use all their energies to help eliminate Al Shabaab and also create a professional Somali Army to help pacify the country. A capable and professional Somali Army is the only thing that will help stabilize the Horn of Africa.

So you're admitting that the Kenyans are either vindictive, or they're just plain stupid? If the Kenyans helped fuel Somalia's Civil War and helped to arm warlords, then they're vindictive. If the Kenyans stayed out of the way and ignored Somalia's Civil War, then they're just stupid. It's one or the other saaxib. Either way, the Kenyans don't have anyone to blame except themselves. If you ignore the fire in your neighbor's house, then the fire will spread to your house. Sooner or later. That's what happened between Rwanda and Congo in 1994. Congo paid the price and they lost 5 MILLION CITIZENS as a result. Kenya really needs to hire new policy-makers. These low-IQ analysts they have working for the Government have no idea what they're doing.

The Kenyans definitely involved themselves in the civil war. There are numerous accounts of them giving refuge, arms and money to these separate Somali warlords. And the warlords are partially to blame yes, but every country in the world is a mixed bag of good and evil. You have power-hungry amoral men who are ready to seize power, in every single country on Earth, not just Somalia. Somalia's most degenerate, illiterate power-hungry old men seized the opportunity to become powerful at the expense of the common Somali. And they sought power and fortune and that's what they got. The Ethiopians and Kenyans should've developed a hands-off policy in Somalia when it came to arming the warlords, but they directly involved themselves in the affairs of our country. They got their hands dirty, and now they're paying the consequences. If they were smarter, they would have tried harder to bring Somalis together and attempt to end the civil war as soon as possible. If they were serious, Somalia's Civil War would've ended in the 1990's. But no, it's STILL going on And the Kenyans will continue dealing with this until they correct their previous mistakes.

Of course the Kenyans would understand what's going on in Somalia's Civil War! They're a sovereign nation with the ability to hire analysts and policy-makers who could study the Somali Conflict and then decide what to do! Countries study each other all the time, especially when it comes to their neighboring country. That's why Brazil has policy-makers who are experts on Argentina. Or Japan has policy-makers who are experts on South Korea. Or Germany has policy-makers who are experts on France, etc. This is all very normal. Why wouldn't the Kenyans have an understanding of Somalia's civil war? And why wouldn't the Kenyans have the incentive or will to resolve Somalia's conflict, knowing that this could be detrimental to their country's security? We've all seen how the Rwandan Civil War in 1994 spilled into Congo, causing a major civil war in Congo where millions died. That's what happens when your neighbor's house is on fire. Your house is gonna catch fire too. And the Kenyans were too STUPID to realize this. They deserve what they get. Don't these Kenyans take lessons from history?