After I have been following the comments here I am assuming that some here and many somalis everywhere have given up. Of course, the situation in Somalia is little hope, but negativ thinking will certainly not change anything about it. Then yes if everyone thinks like some of you somalia will never recover. That's why we need people who can think beyond the boundaries and some of them will bring the change we are hoping for.

thefuturenow;991481 wrote: Summary of this thread so far : 1. Passionate Aristotle vents about the reality of the Somali condition and demands that we think about the future. 2. Jaded SOL members tell him there is no hope because they enjoy bickering about the present. Coming up : Aristotle realizes that Somalia is hopeless because [sOL] Somalis are Masochistic & pessimistic individuals who get off on their on delusions and self-pity. There is hope Aristotle. There is hope . But if you want to keep it alive, stay away from SOL. I certainly hope we do it, but it does not look like the political situation in Somalia meets my wishes. I'll definitely keep working on my dream . But when it really comes to somalia breaking down into individual parts, I will support that if it really brings stability, peace and justice in the country.

Tallaabo;991476 wrote: Firstly, there is no proof of any "black gold" anywhere in Somaliland. At the moment it is all a guess work. Secondly, the troublesome eastern regions do not constitute half the country but even if they did, a smaller more united, more manageable, more peaceful and harmonious county is preferable to a larger more disunited and chaotic one. I would rather live in peaceful Ghana than a chaotic violent Congo. Size does not matter that much. If somaliland holding a referendum and depending on how it ends, accepts the result would be the optimal solution for the somaliland problems. For no one should be forced even if I am for a joint solution with somalia.

Tallaabo;991469 wrote: The solution is very simple. Once Somaliland is recognised by the international community those troublesome eastern regions would be given a referendum to choose which country they wish to be part of- Somaliland or Somalia. I have already thought about that, but I don't think that somaliland or puntland wants to voluntary give up these regions. The black gold is too tempting for them. Also in general losing half of your territory isn't desirable to the somaliland government. If they had shared the power with these people in past it would have changed many things. A somaliland which is backed up by all of the inhabitants would be a hole different story.

Tallaabo;991443 wrote: I think Somalis have learned enough during the last 53 years of catastrophic union that the breakup of what was called the Somali Republic into at least two entities if not more is inevitable. OK let's sayif it is really coming to the point where everything is breaking apart then it have to be between clan groups. Whenever we see a region inhabitanted by more than one clan problems will appear like in somaliland. There are people who disagree with the state so what are they gonna do to them. Just forcing them to obey or kick out of Somaliland?. The thing about territories is very important and difficult to handle.

Apophis;991435 wrote: But it's not as bad as you think. Don't form your opinions based on western news. It's in their interest to lie about Africa. Tallaabo;991439 wrote: You mean 50 years of bickering and then another kalayaac? Of course it could end like you say After all, they had endured 50 years together and maybe they learned something in the time that prevents the ********* we are seeing the last 20 years.

Apophis;991435 wrote: But it's not as bad as you think. Don't form your opinions based on western news. It's in their interest to lie about Africa. There won't be any news about somalia in the West they just don't give a shit about us and our problems. Only entertaining things like pirates are fun for them to report on.

Humans won't ever live in an eternal peace war is a common thing that happens, but somalia has seen enough of it the last 20 years. Now a 50 years break would be nice

That can be also a model we could use, but 20 different little states won't get us far in my opinion why do think China, America and Russia are super powerhouses, it's because their are huge unified countries. Think of american states as 50 different countries, each one would be Inconspicuous

Thank you for showing me that I was right . This is just my opinion you don't have to agree but Just being condescending, points that honest discussion is very hard here

After nearly 2 years just observing this forum,I decided to give you my opinion on somalia and this forum. The reason why I didn't post anything was that I felt like I would waste my time here. I think this forum is an illustration of the problems and bad sides of Somalia. People totally biased towards their clans,region or states are arguing about who is better who is bad etc... absolutely counterproductive. What we need are people who can think outside the box to come up with good ideas about solutions, the only hope for the country is the young generation. These old reigning men all over the country will not bring about great change. The real problems begin only when somalia has recovered. For then it comes to the status of the numerous factions. What they want to do? You have no control over areas such as Somaliland and Puntland. And they will not voluntarily give up their special status. In order to regain control, they would have to take up arms again what could degenerate into a renewed civil war. No we need a common solution to all states and factions to finally find peace. But what would be the solution? a good example would be Federalism because here you could get an even distribution of power. Each region has its own government responsible for the area, they have the basis for making decisions about things such as health, education, culture and the regional financial budget. But when it comes to national decisions, the National Council comes into play. It consistsof the respective government representatives of the regions, where everyone has equal squares and all decide together. This all clans and groups would be equally involved and no one would be disadvantaged. But I know that this is not as easy as it sounds, because ignorance is a virtue of the somalis. If you think about it once we actually have no significant reason to fight each other. We are one of the most homogeneous countries in the world we share language and religion. Normally, these similarities would be a guarantee of peace, but we have still managed to find a way to hate on each other. And the tool to incite hatred is the clan system if it is only used to show the affiliation and origin, it is perfectly legitimate but it is abused by those in power. In order to gain political advantage and and to secure their power, past leaders have used the clan system. They preferred their clan members at the same time they weakened other clans. The result of these tactics is that there is now great distrust between the clans. It will probably be the biggest challenge to overcome the distrust of each other. You have to talk to each other and forgive/apologize for the atrocities of the past like the hargeisa bombing. Only then a prosperous future within reach will be. We do not have much time, because as I can observe, more and more young Somali youth turn away from their home. They are even ashamed for somalia and I can not blame them for that. We are the only completely failed country in the world, it is not something on which you can be proud of. I for myself will learn and work hard so that one day I can become part of the solution. My dream is that my children and grandchildren are born into a prosperous, peaceful, and successful United States of somalis.