Xaaji Xunjuf;757984 wrote: Who said the old ladies from Burco are not happy with Siilanyo?

AsadSL;758071 wrote: Ofcourse it is. Its said openly by thier leaders and supporters. There is only 2 ways to go here either support somaliland or don't. In politics things aint always like how it seems.

who says that is the agenda of the meeting? And if that is the case, why would Puntland and Garowe Garaads try to undermine it? meesha siiyasado sare ayaa kasocda.

KoW, slow down with the insultst and personal attacks. Stay on the issue, what do you think of this delay of Khatuuma2 and these latest divisions between G6 and Taleex elders?

There seems to be division between G6 and Putlaand supporters as the Garaads and Absisamed Shire. Puntlands interverence is becoming fatal for Khaatuma2.

STOIC;757756 wrote: I have listened closely to the three part debate.The good professor at times comes across as Debbie Downer...I wonder why he choose not to discuss the Solution to the problems that posit current Somalia; the foreign intervention, domestic terrorism, and Imperial arrogance and lack of disciplined leaders instead of dismissing Somalis as a misfit for modernism....Yeah you can form a party, but also you need to give hope to the people you are seeking their support.This is indeed terrifying time that is trying the souls of the Somalis inside the country.The last thing they want to hear is a know-it-all party that was formed in lobby which people already know NOT to expect much from what passes as a intellectual God-send problem solver. There are elections in Somaliland. The good Profesor changed his strategy and hopes to rally support amongst Somalilanders, so to have a platform for engaging and seeking position in Somalia.

Naxar Nugaaleed;757574 wrote: BTW, to carafat who compared 4.5 to apartheid, how is is apartheid when the attempt is to make all equal. Is your argument whole thing is a crime/wrong/apartheid or that the distribution is wrong because those are two different arguments NN, The 4.5 system seperates ppl in diffrent blocks while they have the same political interest. Also the system values/rates some ppl higher then other based on purely clan. Apartheid did the same but then based on race. Imagine if the TFG goverment actually workeed across the country, ppl would get jobs, students scholarships, etc based on clan rather then merits.

MMA, I agree with you. Eventhough the 4.5 system was created for the parliamentrary representation within the TFG, the moral signal it gives to the wider Somali public is much bigger tend it was intended for. No Somali is worth half of another Somali!!!

NGONGE;757512 wrote: Once there is war in Somaliland, I sure as hell would be advocating for the 4.5 system (or similar variants), adeer. After all, I wouldn't want your long lineaged clan to rip me off. Wax fahan. The last time clan wars took place in Somalia, was during the Jubba/Kismaayo wars back in the '97 in the Jubba's. Since then the Somali conflict has been dominated by groups with diffrent political agenda's with little support from the own clan. For example it was the TNG vs some warlords from the same clan as TFG President, TFG/Ethiopia vs. ICU and TFG/AMISOM vs. Al Shabaab. The fact that ICU pacified Moqadishu and kickout warlods and later Al Shabaab managed to control by far the biggest part of Somalia, should tell you that their key succes wasnt the 4.5 system rather a system based on diversity, local ownership and balance between the clans. While the TFG is using the 4.5 system failed to gather little support from the people since it was created back in 2004. Now, just look at the situation now and how Al Shabaab is losing power while using clannism and actually the TFG is becaming slighly popular since Shariif/Farmaajo said farewell to the 4.5 system back in 2010. This should tell you atleast something. That the key succes in Somalia's reconciliation and governance is not dependant not the clan formula's, but rather on shared morals, value's and interest. And the 4.5 system has rather fractured Somali's(or clans) with common interest then it unified them along shared interest.

NGONGE;757492 wrote: You're just a windup merchant, adeer. SL does not apply the 4.5 system officially but that does not mean it doesn't exist. As for Siilaanyo, Cigaal & Riyaale getting the job and your people not getting it (horta yaaba hadhay?), well that only goes to prove that "longer lineage" does not equal proven ability. Waa la idin dhacay, inadeer. I know SL doesnt have the 4.5 system. And its good that tis immoral system is not institutionalised eventhaught qabyaalad still exist. Then why advocate for something (in Somalia) which you dont apply for yourself?

Qabiil is to some extent relevant for Somali's. But it should not be institutionalized so that extend. Let people judge for themselves. May I need to remind you that if SL had such a rigid and institutionalized system, your Adeero Siilanyo, AUN Cigaal and Riyaale would never have become President. As with such a system its all about clan and shorter linrage's would never get a chance. Only people like myself who have a bigger and longer lineage would make it.

The 4.5 system is wrong. Not only it institutionalizes Qabyalad and it even advocates institutional discrimination and makes it acceptable. Therefor this system is a crime, a crime against humanity. Comarable with Apartheid. All Somali's should denounce this system and it should never again be introduced in whatever institution. Siilaanyo would have said, waaaa uuffff.

Juxa ma gabar baa? maan ogeyn, xaal qaado nuune. ha ila yaabin anigu dadkii dhaqankii hore ayaan ahay. gabadh sigaar lama cabo lama chew gareeyo. I am very principle. Laakinse magacan Juxa waa maxay? iyo calankan burcad badeedhka ah?

wtf, pass on the message ah? are there 2x Mr.Juxa's or are you a Mrs.

She is funny and hilarious.

ok that is reasonable. We should get to together. your place or mine?

i have two wives. Serieusly cosidering a third one, preferbly in another country to have nice get way weekends.

Sigarettes.and visits to the red light district here in town. http://www.google.nl/search?hl=nl&sugexp=ppwl&cp=16&gs_id=1t&xhr=t&q=cholocade+coffee&pq=cholocade+coffee&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&biw=1024&bih=499&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi#um=1&hl=nl&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=red+light+district&pbx=1&oq=red+light+dis&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=37076l39436l0l40097l13l11l0l3l3l0l243l1332l0.7.1l8l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=d52d54a33dab53de&biw=1024&bih=499 And what is yours Mr.Juxa?

She is a beauty, smart, confident, hilarouisly funny, strong, she can handle any man. I never dared to fight a women again, after I met her. I warn you guys, you better back off. P.S. And one of the most compassionate people I have ever met. What she has done, very few moslims would do or dare. wee duceesatay. Illahay kheyr ha siiyo.

hypocrites! everyone has an addiction. If it aint smoking. then it must be something much worser.

Knight of Wisdom;757403 wrote: Miskin, I 100% agree with your logic. I really appreciate how you put it and made me understand it. I support this Rules. True, I intentionally did use tribal names, only because I couldn't find anything to substitute with it, especially, when I and my opponent were narrowing it down the tribes we were focusing on. Khadar, thanks walal, you're right. I should've continued and use the general substitution for clans, such as PL/SL/Galmudug/SSC/Jubbaland/Kilinka Shanad/Awdal/Banadiir/ and so forth. I agree with the Rules, just like Jaale Siyaad banned the derogatory name that used to be used by Somalis when they are referring to Beelaha Gabooye ama Madibaan. Therefore, the owner of SOL did it a good thing by restricting the clan names.

Knight of Wisdom, you seem to admire strong men like Siad Barre for their crimes, Why do you wish to lable Siilanyo for crimes. Do you hope this will clear your lot for their crimes?

Salax, do you think Gaamuur and his likes care about who commied crimes?

. Wakhtiga la khaarajiyay Mr Buulle ayaa ku doodayay Guri uu hantidii ummada reer Somaliland uu ka dhacay xilliyadaasi oo uu kaga dhistay magaalada Muqdisho ee Somalia. Mr Buulle ayaa la sheegay gurigaasi oo uu ka dhistay hantidii shacbiga reer Hargeysa uu xoogga kaga qaaday xilligii maamulkii Rajiimkii Siyaad Barre ee uu ka amar u taaglayn jiray gobolkan Hargeysa la sheegay markii uu shalay subax u tagay qoys ku jiray gurigaasi ilaa 1991-kii oo uu ka dalbaday inay uga baxaan gurigiisa, murankaasi ku dhex maray qoladii guriga ku jirtay lagu khaarajiyay Mr Buulle. Isla markaana goobtaasi ku geeriyooda. According to the article he was killed while he was trying to get back proberty and not in duty for TFg, what some claim here.

SOMALIA: Migrants targeted in Somaliland HARGEISA, 10 November 2011 (IRIN) - Migrants in Somaliland, especially those from Ethiopia, have increasingly come under attack since the government in the self-declared independent state in September ordered employers to fire all "illegal foreigners" as part of its commitment to expelling them from the territory, according to rights organizations. "Many of those targeted for attack in the past one-and-a-half months live in the eight IDP [internally displaced persons] camps in Hargeisa," said Abdillahi Hassan Digale, an official of the Ubah Social Welfare Organization, which champions the rights of minorities and IDPs. "We have recorded 23 cases of violations, mostly by security groups [young men hired by the community to provide protection services] in these camps. They ask for bribes from the migrants; if they don't pay up, they are threatened that the police will be notified of their presence in the country." Digale said most of the illegal migrants targeted were employed as watchmen, domestic servants, rubbish collectors, construction workers, farm hands or latrine diggers. An estimated 90,000 illegal migrants, mostly Ethiopians, were thought to be in Somaliland by the time the government issued the directive. On 25 October, the government announced that foreigners working in Somaliland without permission from the Ministry of Labour and Social Affairs would be relieved of their jobs and urged employers to prioritize citizens for work. Human rights organizations estimate that about 45,000 illegal migrants have left Somaliland since the government directive but those remaining were living in difficult circumstances, with some hiding in their homes for fear of deportation. Others have been camping outside the Social Welfare Centre - run by the international NGO Save the Children with funding support from the UN Refugee Agency, UNHCR - fearing attacks and deportation. Digale told IRIN: "Only 50 percent of the total estimated number of illegal immigrants has left Somaliland while the 50 percent who remain continue to suffer human rights violations in their settlements, afraid the police could deport them or the citizens could attack them. Already, some have not been paid, despite working for their employers for a month-and-a-half. Others have been beaten by members of the local communities." Abdi-Hakim Mohamed Elmi, an Ethiopian working as a construction worker in Hargeisa, told IRIN his employer had confiscated his tools and refused to pay him for two days' work. "Three weeks ago, I worked on a construction site in 150-ka street in Hargeisa, earning 70,000 Somaliland shillings [uS$12.70] per day; when I was not paid for two days, I decided to report to the Dalodho police station but I was told there was no-one to follow up on my case," Elmi said. "I have not gone back to the construction site since then because I am afraid my employer could hurt me." Khadir Abdalla, from Ethiopia's Oromiya region, who lives in the Dami IDP settlement in Hargeisa, was attacked 11 days ago by a group of young men in the camp. "I used to collect trash in the local government area," he said. "A group of young men came to my home one day and asked me to come out. They asked why I was not adhering to the government directive to leave Somaliland. I told them I would go but, instead, they started beating me using sticks and punching me. They took whatever I had. I did not report them to the police because I was afraid... I would be deported." Ahmed Yare, another Oromo Ethiopian in the Cakaara IDP settlement, said: "Young men came to my house 19 days ago and asked why I had not left the country. I told them I did not have the fare to travel. They beat me up, injuring me in the head before they left." Rights violations Ahmed Mohamed Said, chairman of Somaliland's Counter-Trafficking Network - an umbrella body of local NGOs working with the International Office for Migration (IOM) - said it had registered about 50 cases of human rights violations in the past three months, mainly targeting watchmen, domestic workers, latrine diggers, street sweepers and beggars. "We submitted these cases to IOM who provided the victims with psycho-social support, rehabilitation and food aid," he said. "There are networks of human traffickers supplying labour from Ethiopia and south-central Somalia; when someone arrives in Somaliland, these middle men link them up to potential employers on condition that he will give up a portion of his salary to them." Ahmed Elmi Barre, director-general of Somaliland's Ministry of Rehabilitation, Resettlement and Re-integration, told IRIN the ministry had not received any reports of human rights violations against Ethiopians in Somaliland. However, rights groups say at least 30 Ethiopian Somalis were arrested 20 days ago in the border town of Lawya-addo. But Mohamed Muse Bu'ul, governor of the region of Selel - from where Lawya-addo is administered - told IRIN the arrests were for security reasons. Bu'ul said: "We know in the region, there are about 450 foreign workers; arrests can happen for security reasons... A year ago, Somali militia who are members of ONLF [****** National Liberation Front] landed in Somaliland's western coast; for this reason it is our duty to keep an eye on the security matters in the area." maj/js/mw [END] This report online