BOB;797466 wrote: Brother aniga sidaan u arko arrinta taas keentay waa labo siyaabood, 1- Ma nihin dad wax qora oo waxaan nahay 'oral soceity' taas oo keentay in ay meesha ka baxdo taariikhdii Soomaalida iyo Soomaaliya. 2- Aqoon la'aan, ma nihin dad taariikhda qiimeeya sababtoo ah ma fahamsanin macnaha ay leedahay inay bulshadu barato taariikhdeeda taasoo keentay inay sahlanaato in wax walba been laga sheego. tusaale ahaan maanta qabiil Soomaali ah oo haya taariikhdiisa saxda ah lama hayo aan ka aheyn wax la abaabulay oo aan runta wax sal ah ku laheyn taasna waxey ku tusaysaa jaahilnimada dadkeena haysta, sababtoo ah marba hadaa taariikhdaada aqoon waxii doono ayaa laguu sheegi karaa and eventually you'll believe it...waxaan maalin walbo doodi jirnay wiil madoowga south africa ah oo wuxuu ku doodi jiray in dadku asalkiisa kasoo jeedo daanyeer markaasuu wuxuu iisoo quote gareen jiray Charles Darwin's branching pattern of evolution and my own cousin isaguna wuxuu rumeysanyahay arrinta Che kor ku xusay oo ah in Soomaalida qaarkood carab kasoo jeedo taasna waxay ku tusaysaa inaan nahay dad lunsan oo aan historygooda aqoon oo raadinaya meel ay kasoo jeedaan iyo cida ay ku abtirsadaan. Over all I'd advice you not to take the easy way out and settle for what little you know of your history, do your own little research and read every book that you can get your hands on whether big or small, old or new and I promise you, it will do you a world of good and expand your horizon...knowledge is the key my brother and remember don't limit the capability of your mind for it has no limit so do some exploration and who knows you might finally find the key to unlock this mystery called Somali. Peace, Love & Unity. BoB, Some years ago I started asking some questions to some elders on our origin. How it was possible that one man can have procreated so many millions of folks? Where the real inhabitents of the regions are? Who build these ancient coastal cities if our folks are nomadic? And lastly if it was possible that some smaller clans have merged with our clan. Well you can imagine that it ended in a heated and emotional debate. Questioning or doubting the original clan hypothesis is not merely a historical questioning for some, it's an highly emotional charged issue for some that has direct effect on today's situation or status. This has triggered my curiousity and I started digging deeper, till I finally came to the same conlusion as you wrote here above. that we dont know a lot from our history, that our oral told history is unreliable and the on to often history is politisized.

I have been once to Erigavo with a plane, stayed for few hours. The plane flies along the cliffs and its a amazing sight. The Sanaag folks all looked the same to me, with their Indian like appereances and singinh voice(warr heeeedhee seeeee tahay). Nowadays its quite amazing that those folks live peacefully next to eachother and we should commend them for that. Rather then insight new wars about who was the mosty empty land, most poverty striken villages. Of all the regions I have seen, Sanaag has the most potential interms of development and yet its the most under developed? How come? I am afraid its a victim of Somaliland/Puntland hostile approach of the region. It has the most to gain from Somali Unity between Somaliland and Somalia.

Nassir and folks, outsmart everyone. Badhab, Dhahar, Lasqoray officials collect double salaries, never fight eachother and because of their two way strategy are boss in own house, both Puntland Somaliland rarely dare to operate inside Mkaahir territory. And if they do, they are shot in the back warning them who is boss in the house. Kudos to Makhir.

Ma Maslax Siad Barre qabteen?

:D

OdaySomali as a former bounty or Cheesehead(Kaaskop), I welcome you back to Somalinimo.

Jimce wanaagsan.

ElPunto you are right. But we cant change history but we can shape the future, a much better future inshallah. And that future we can only shape through cooperation, mutual understanding and most importantly for our people to fairly compete in striving for the best. Djibouti's dont have to compete for being the best in education, business, good governance, better politics, better policy, better poiticians. Waa meel ood lagu so xirtay. And I dont want Somaliland nor Somalia to become meel ood ku xiran. We need to compete with all Somali's, Africans and the world. Only the weak fear competition and institutionalize monopolies.

AfricaOwn;797383 wrote: Not sure why you had to mention me, I disregard Djiboutie. Then I should apologize for putting you in line with Djibouti fans and dictator cheerleaders like XX.

Oodweyne;797410 wrote: I am afraid that is not what have happened. In the sense in paper at least everyone may seemed to be singing from the same hymn sheet; and accordingly the Brits are quite happy to think that they have pull off a quite a coup in here. But, the taste of the puddings is in the eating, indeed. Hence, each party went away determined to achieved it's "maximalist objective" in Somalia; while taking care of in paying lip-service to the party line as was defined in London Conference. Consequently, the only way to "short-circuit" that saying of one thing and acting in another way, in which some of the actors of the Somali scene are capable of doing, is to return the problem of Somalia, internally, So, that way no party could feel that they were hard done by the other Somalis. And, it's in here that a great deal of care must be taking; particularly, in the sense that no party ( read clan ) in post-TFG should feel that they were bamboozled by any of the agreement that was so far cobbled together. Because, if that sense of being taking for a ride by the other organized clans were to settled in the mind of the other clans (or region), then, our old game of looking for a "protector" from the neighboring countries will continue. And, your usual spoiler politics will again come to be seen in action in Somalia; regardless of how many threats Hilary of this world gives in the air-waves. All in all; things have been signed that could give the impression that things are moving forward. But, I fear, once, the nitty-gritty details of the clannish jaw-jawing of what happens in the ground and how to interpret the agreement in the post-transitional period gets under way, as well as the meaning that is buried what was signed there, then we shall see all these talk of harmony going out of the window. And, furthermore, we shall see whether the London Conference by then will be worthy of the paper is written on, indeed. But, lets hope for the best in here.. Diffrences can be overcone when one sits around the same table and there is some sort of coordination, arbitrage and mediation from a third party interference in a permanent structure. And this what his been solved in Londen. So far the African Union, its bodies deal with Amisom dealt and security. IGAD with the political side of things facilitating political interest of Ethiopia, Kenya and Uganda. UN wth its SC montiring group, its agencies,UNdP, UNDSS, etc deal with mainly European donors. UK, US had their own bilateral structures and meetings on Somalia. Arabs, with hugh influence on Eritrea, Libia, Egypt had their. Arab League. Qatar has hugh influence on Eritrea and Libya, so Qatar is included in front group of powers. From Mainland Europe I can confirm Somalia is on the political agenda. So far only the Development Ministries and Agencies were responsible for Somalia Policy with barely any political involvement, agenda or interest but funding the UN's political initiative's. This has changed, in Londen the real political kindpins were present FM Ministers and Head of States. These new structures should therefor leadera to a more clear international policy, power brokage when needed and for sure Ethiopia will operate carefully having the world's attention focused on Somalia. Somali actors walking away or frustating the process? Less likely because in the past being 'coperative' and consequences for ones 'funding' was hardly interlinked. AMISOM, TFG institutions, get funded and folks get paid irrelevent of their results. For Donors funding was hardly linked to donors political wishes, resulting to failure till tjhe deadline was nearing and west threatened to pull plug and cut funding. You remeber the results booked in months time, not seend in 4 years before. Since Londen donors wishes and donors funding is interlinked , through this financial "working group" having the button and pressure constantly on. Rather then giving support for 4 or 5 years support beforehand and therefor a cart blanche to doing nothing.

What's wrong with Schiphol ya Norf.

Oodweyne;797313 wrote: PS :- I hate to get in the way of the friendly fire between our Mr. Mintid on one hand, and Mr. Carafat , on the other hand; but, I thought, to return the discussion to it's original moorings of this piece; and, therefore, lets leave Somaliland out of it. For, it's the case, that, whether you like it or not, Somaliland, politically and diplomatically, have done a great deal of good out of that London Conference. Hence, lets now take the rest of Somalia and see what sort of "prognosis" this conference could be said it's pregnant for them; in so far as they are concern. Oodweyneh, Mintid, The outcome of the Londen Conference is very postitive for both Somaliland and Somalia. But for diffrent reasons. Somaliland is finally 'plugged' on to the international community and politics in the region. And its de facto status of Its institutions, position and status has been Internationally underligned and confirmed . And inshallay this will result in more development And economic support and it moves away from the "humanitarian" seal of the NGO's. Direclty dealing with its donors. And for all the reasons you guys mentioned. For Somalia this Conference is quite positive for whole other reasons. Everyone who analysis the conflict in Somalia over the past 20 years will come to The conclusion that it's not lack of int support that kept conflict going nor can the cause Of the conflict be blamed on Foreign Powers. However it's a political conflict with diffrence In ideological and political vision of the country that has resulted in the conflict and the incoherent intervensions Of the diffrent foreign powers kept the conflict going. With many diffrent players supporting Diffrent groups from the start in 1991 till now. This gave the diffrent groups so much space, support and funding That politicians felt never obliged to broker a deal or concensus with eachother And each time one leader trying to force his solution or way on other groups (trationalist, modern or religious groups). This was the case from 1991 and has Lsted till today. Instead of playing for arbiter, foreign powers mostly suppported one The groups. Now what the Brits have done and is quite incredible. For the first time ever they have Gathered and brokered a deal between all these Foreign Powers with each their own agenda's. No country was missing and they signed the agreement and are from now on together on A permanent basis involved and responsible through structures on finance, security and politics That will be responsible for the international involvement and the national implemention. So the int community will speak, act, finance and operate with one voice. Making it difficult for anyone Somali's and foreign countries to operate individualy without consent. Remember there is no conflict between the Somali's. Only diffrence in vision, ideology and politics. And now There is one table where one have to sort things out together without anyone walking away Or securing support from whoever. So understand my optimism for Somalia.

Juxa;797239 wrote: Carafaat civilized adigaa ahee orod ku dharag Actually, I never paid more then 20 euro for a bike. I think someone else ayaa katiinka ka jara. Laakinse indhaha ayaa ka xirtaa. Ilaahay daradiisna bil kadib waa la iga sii xadaa. Lool

BoB, I didnt know we had a history going back to Romans and Greek. How would you explain that we Somali( or atleast I ) have such a narrow vieuw of our history? And that we are hardly interested in the much wider, broader and divers history?

BOB;797215 wrote: Carafaat, We just don't like Galti people, we can't help it and if you have a galti accent then lord have mercy on you as we'll eat you raw and use your bones as our toothpick. lol Peace, Love & Unity. Subxanalah, hadaa waad badbaadayba. I dont what Galti means. But next time I will bring my Waamo dictionary. I wont relay on my Maay Mmaay translators anymore.

Abti Oodweyneh, Indeed you would be the ideal Master teacher of debating. Unfortuantly the Somali debate is to often clouded by hot tempered folks, dogma's, spinners, stereotyping and personal disqualifications. It's so difficult to debate when one accuses you for all kind of things. The funiest was when someone accused me of being a Unionist, because of my abtiyaal(the Lions of SL). Any advice abti, how to debate with Somali folks on content?

General Duke;797287 wrote: Yeah, but admit it you hate Puntland and its people more...lol. Duke I oppose only the clannish politics of elites from the Qardho-Garowe-north Galkacyo holy trinity. But I do admire their progressive outword looking visionary and their diplomatic skills. I do oppose for the same reason my own clans narrow minded clannish politics. If you would only knew what they call me. But I dont mind because I know what is wrong and what is right. And clan politics makes the diffrence between the two more vague.

Mintid Farayar;797307 wrote: In other words, no answer outside of regurgitating what every teenager knows who read the blueprint/roadmap concocted in Nairobi. You can do better than that. Care to take another shot? Remember, foreigners have their plans and Somalis have their actions with an annoying tendency to frustrate those plans... Further then this I cant go with speculating. But please do tell us mighty minti.

War Abdiwali astura oo daraja ha kasii xumeeniina. Silence is the best option and let others do the defending. Take example of Farmaajo folks. Where is Gabbal?

Mintid, you admit Somaliland cant push it's agenda on foreign powers? On your question Minti, TFG is politicly dead. It's funeral is being orchestrated by the Queen of Britain herself or atleast her servants of the FO. And from August we shall see a new project or working group for Somalia(Southern) that is and it carries hope of changing things for it corrects mistakes of the previous attempts. And then Somaliland will talk with Somalia. There are diffrent options on the table and I am campaigning for of those options. Thus my presence here, Minti.

Singers it has in dozens.Who copy and steal works made in Somalia. Not even the best ones. Wadan wada barjeeniya ayaa difacisiin. You should tell the truth, maybe then they loose the chauvinistic attitude.

Duke, you obviously dont know Djibouti's history. The only man who fought for liberation was assasinated in 50's by collaborteurs and French. Since then nobody fought for liberation not even liberatuon from ignorance. I have never met a Djibouti Scholar orAcademic. And the only Djiboution here on SOL, GOETTIA parades around with the French flag ashamed of this barjo country.

Duke, Name one known Artist, Scholar, Inventor, Business person, famous company, name one thing that Djibouti has contributed to the Somali race, African continent or the World. One thing we should thank Djibouti for? It has given us the failed TNG goverment that costed Somali's a decade of getting a real State.

Xaji Xunjuf, Mintid Micnoyare and Africaown regard Djibouti has their true example of a country, their mission for Somaliland is based on becoming the next Djibouti and their vision doesnt go much further then that. Let's see what Djibouti has contributed to the wider region, Africa and the World. Djibouti's main contribution consist of, waa la Barjeeniyaa. Eating Jaad in the morning. Is this trult what you envision for Somaliland?

Mintid Farayar;797220 wrote: @ Carafaat Although, well-meaning, you're new to the game, saaxiib. That much is obvious. Like I've told you numerous times, you and I don't matter. It's the people on the ground who do. What do you predict for your project in the next half year? What will become of the TFG, the current vehicle for Somalia's and your hopes? What will happen after August? Things to think about-since you claim to be a betting man. Don't let personal inclinations/ties muddy your vision. Stay in touch with what's happening on the ground and assess from that vantage point rather than ego-centered debates around cafes. Mintid, You assume that I have no idea what is going on the ground? Well check Mayor Jiciir's and Minister Duur's action today. He cleaned the streets from illegal kiosk argumenting that it's needed for Aqoonsi. Somaliland's goverment is already recognized as an authority with legal power over it's territority and it's domestic souvereign is neither questioned. But lets talk international souvereignity and what this has to do with clean streets. What do the folks on the ground know about foreing politics, international diplomacy, the rights and responsibility that come with international souvereignity. Mintid, I have said it before. You argument is of the same level and logic of a Geeljire. Sxb, explain how you want to fill in this international souvereignity Somaliland so badly wants. And what consequences it will have and which reer wil get the WTO Ambassadorship.