Somalee, nin hurda iga dheh.

^ open your eyes a bit. This has nothing to do with the flag. As a citizen of Somaliland, I have my own flag. What was at stake is the false sense that prior to 1884, the area that Somalis live in East Africa was called Somalia. This is what should be LOLed @ Making false history wont bring back Somalia. The only thing that will bring back Somalia is to face reality head on. Just saying.

Baashi, We all want Somalia to become peaceful. I as a citizen of Somaliland understand it is in my interest to see a peaceful and functioning neighbour in Somalia. Nevertheless, we mustn’t loose the plot here. The Garowe conference was a milestone for having held a meeting inside Somalia for Somalis, never the less I’m a little aghast that you would peddle wholesale what has come out from it. It would be more prudent to stress the ownership staying with Somalis, rather than what foreign powers have lined up to endorse the road map to nowhere. This path has been tried before, I’m sure you remember the Billions poured into UNISOM. This may sound like a game to you, but Somalia does not need winners and losers. The political climate that is built on a zero sum game cannot take Somalia to the next level. As long as we’re discussing which politician, and which region is vying for the lion’s share of the state, Somalia cannot heal nor can it move forward. I think the best solution is to spend more time in Garowe or any other town to reconcile no matter how many conferences it takes. Remember, in order to have everyone on board, the solution is more “XAL” than “XAQ”. A win win for every one so to speak.

Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar;771288 wrote: Here, the very word "Somalia" is mentioned in 1853 ! Talyaanigaa sheegeysid intuu joogaa. Mr. My Uncle told me, I would have thought you would make better use of Google. The citation you used is actually incorrect the word in that paragraph is Somalis and not Somalia. In fact, it clearly states Somali country a few sentences before the highlighted word. Earlier in the 18th Century it was called Adal. I do however see where Somalis lived referred to as Somali-Land. In any event prior to the arrival of the colonials to East Africa, the area in the Horn of Africa that Somalis lived was referred to as the Somali Coast, Somali Country or Bar Al Ajam or Bar As Somal. Therefore, one must realize that regardless of Italia’s colonization of Somalia, the ia denotes the latin suffix for land, which is what Somalis always called their land; The land of the Somalis. Also, it is quite possible that Somalia can be found in books prior to the advent of colonialism, just like we can find Somali-land. All that proves is foreigners translated what Somalis called their land into their respective languages. As long as neither Somalia nor Somaliland use the prefix or suffix British & Italiana there is very little to debate about which one is a foreign construct as they mean the same thing in English & Latin. Articles/Books Maps

A&T, I need not remind you Somaliland is prepared for any eventuality when it comes with its future relations with Somalia. We can either be good neighbours, or we can have a lot of bloodshed. The choice is yours. Either way, Somaliland is determined to remain sovereign.

Carafaat, I am not against the co-operation of Somaliland, Djibouti, Somalia on any given matter. Nevertheless, Somalia would have to first recognize Somaliland’s sovereignty before there could be any political co-operation. If Somalia continues to refuse to acknowledge the sovereignty of Somaliland then that is fine. Somaliland is not in any hurry to gain recognition. In fact, as I’ve said many times on this forum, non-recognition has done a great deal for Somaliland. Somaliland is learning to be self-sufficient. You just have to look at the numerous public private partnerships going on from the Dilla – Borama Road, Hargeisa-Jabuuti Road, Hargeisa-Salaxley Road, Hargeisa-Baligubadle Road, Hargeisa-Burco Road, Burco-Ceerigaabo Road. The nations of the west did not stumble on the “good governance” of their nations. They’ve spent hundreds of years to improve it. It is why you will find more justice in a western country than in a Muslim country ruled by a dictator. Somaliland has nowhere to go but up. Time is truly on its side. It’s survived economic and political crisis in its infancy and has proven to the world that it is a force to be reckoned with. Somaliland does not need to go against its principles in order to have some kind of political co-operation that is not even tenable in Somalia’s current political state. The ball in Somalia’s court to define what kind of relations it will have with Somaliland. Will it be based on hostility or on fraternal relations? So far, what has been eminating from Somalia has been nothing but hostility, yet Somaliland has shown much good will in taking Somalia’s refugees and assisting them in any way they can. The ball is in Somalia’s court.

Carafaat, I wish you were more practical and realistic than you`ve been thus far. You cannot have war and peace in the same instance. It is a fallacy to believe otherwise. In the same context, Somaliland and Somalia cannot co-operate on foreign policy when they do not recognize one another. The very corner stone of Somaliland`s foreign policy is built on among other things advancing the de jure recognition of the sovereignty of Somaliland. Conversely, Somalia`s current foreign policy is to combat tooth and nail the de jure recognition of Somaliland. All you have to do is read the media in Somalia regarding the trip to Jubba by Somaliland and the reaction to the latest endorsement by the erstwhile savior of Somalia Mr. Augsta Mahiga. The agendas of the two polities are diametrically opposed. The only time they can align is when this diplomatic cold war is reconciled. Until then, it is very difficult for Somaliland and Somalia to engage politically. Now the question is sidee Xeegona Xeego u noqotaa, Ilkana ku nabad galaan. The only avenue left to foster co-operation of the peoples of Somaliland and Somalia is to let refugees come to Somaliland and participate in humanitarian assistance. Anything more than that and you`ve lost the plot I`m afraid. Keep in mind, Somalis irrespective of the politics of their countries, Djibouti, Kenya, Ethiopia, Somaliland, Somalia, are one people. They are kith and kin and have direct relations. There is no enmity and there is a lot of co-operation in the social and economic spheres. Trying to make the jump to political co-operation is premature. Somalia will first have to make a single administration for the likes of Gaalkacyo & Beledweyne, before it can enter into an EU style Pan Somali East African arrangement with Somaliland & Djibouti.

Carafaat, I beg your forgiveness but you come across as a tortured soul. Your attempt to comingle what is mutually exclusive such as love & hate, war & peace is wishful in my humble opinion. There are certain things one can compromise, but sovereignty & religion is not one of them. The restoration of the sovereignty of Somaliland is a fait accompli. The die has been cast; the genie cannot be put back in the bottle. This is something you will have to wrestle with, either you agree or you disagree with the decision. After some careful consideration, you will come to a position you will be comfortable with. Then your ideas on unity, co-operation & familial ties will crystallize and become much clearer. I notice you`re very much concerned about the fate of Somalia. It is quite natural to want to help and find solutions. The solutions for Somalia are simple. It is to reconcile among first as families, villages, towns, cities, regions and then at the national stage. It is also to practice what our religion tells us about fairness, equality, justice, and above all living with your neighbour in peace. The problem is nobody wants to go this route. Unfortunately, each community in Somalia wants peace at the expense of another. Each community feels if they hold out just a little while longer, they will win the top prize of dominating the rest be it politically or economically. This zero sum game playing out in Somalia has its roots in the previous regime. Every community wants to be the new MOD. Instead of working together, they work against each other. How can you then help a people who are constantly scheming to deceive the other? It is not in the Quran for no reason that Allah only changes the condition of a people unless they change what is in themselves. You will hear the cry of Somalinimo, the talk of Unity but nothing in terms of actions and deeds. It rings hollow and reminds me of those verses by Qamaan Bulxan: Baadida ninbaa kula deydeya, daalna kaa badane Oon doonahayn inaad heshana, daa`in abidkaaye Dadkuna moodi duul wada dhashoo, wax u dahsoonayne The farce we`ve come to know as the Somali Reconciliation Confrence, is in full swing right now in Garowe. It appears we are at a turning point in Somalia`s history as of late. Somalis are actually discussing things inside Somalia. It is quite the achievement. Insha Allah, they will build on this step to iron out their differences and take the necessary steps to build lasting peace. The short cuts that have not worked so far will have to end. In a nutshell Carafaat, what you can do for Somalia is pray that they take ownership of their destiny and not abdicate responsibility for their condition. However, what is not feasible is to tether Somaliland and Somalia together as if they were Siamese twins. You cannot be equal if there is no equality, I`m sorry to say.

Abtigiis, I have to borrow a few words from Ronald Reagan in reply to Jimmy Carter " There you go again" LOL

LOL now it is about semantics In any case, moaning about foreign interference does little. Every country in the world has to deal with foreign interference; the difference is Somalia is paralyzed. It is better to focus on getting out of the comma, than to endlessly cry about "OTHERS". It is plainly obvious there is foreign interference. The question is where is the response after 21 years?

Stoic, we all know who AT is. He does not need a political agenda to talk about Zina & prostitution. It is as Somalis say " Bahalna caydhiin ma daayo, nina caadadii ma baajo". What was interesting in this thread is that the waashmaan of this forum did nothing. LOL

LoL, I love how you like to hide under the cover of a blanket, and bring every Somali under the same tent. It is not all Somalis that have failed; it is those from Somalia alone. Djibouti is doing well, so is Somaliland, and to some extent so are those in NFD. Somaali Galbeed is another matter all together. The five regions Somalis live are not all the same. Until you realize, it will be very difficult for to unify the two banks of Beledweyne, the two sides of Gaalkacyo, the multiple factions of Somalia. The collective sigh in despair does little for the action needed to be taken.

Che, how long will deflecting blame to "Shisheeye" work? Remember Allah SWT, says HE will not change the condition of a people unless they change what is in themselves. It's been 21 years, there has got to be another way than to continue to talk about the interests of neighbours and states further away. Yes, this current reconciliation conference in Garowe is not in the hands of Somalis, but at least it is inside Somalia. Maybe next time, it will resemble the attitude of FUBU; for us by us. Just maybe the people of Somalia will stop wailing and do the right thing for once like that Spike Lee movie.

Xiinfiniin, waxba ha is yeel yeelin. Meelo aan la gacan toogalayn ayaad wax mariseen. Wax cusubna ma aha. Ninka meesha waashmaanka laga dhigayna waxba kama qaban. Taasina mid inagu cusub ma aha. Ee waa halkii Salaan Carabay : Hadaad ficil hinaastay asaad, hiilin kari wayday, ma afkaad ku hawl bixi cidlaad ka hanjabaysaaye. Waxaad moodaa in siduu uu NGONGE u sheegay, where it counts Somaliland is in control from Borama to Lascanood from Seylac to Ceerigaabo. If you can't harm Somaliland on the battle field, nor economically, and now not even diplomatically when the BOSS of Somalia is openly calling for Somaliland's recognition, what is left is to resort to insults. As I remember, as another great poet said af xumo nabadna way kaa kaxaysaa, colaadna wax kaagama tarto. Markaa kaadi badane waa loo gogol badiyaaye bal iska soo qufa naxliga bal inaad ku caafimaadaan la arkiye.

xiinfaniin;766945 wrote: Hadduu saa yeelo shamso iyo qamar ba waa iga furanyihiin You will divorce shamso & qamar if AT makes an apology? Who said any one wants AT to apologize? Who really cares? You're pissing in the ocean and so is AT. This is nothing but a distraction and some soothing for ones soul when we hear Somaliland is progressing. Don't have a heart attack now. Don't let the sorrow make you take it out on shamso and qamar. Don't treat them like some article of clothing you can toss whenever you please.

NGONGE, It is very interesting you mention that Somaliland's biggest enemies are all Somali. I had to pause there for a moment and say to myself it couldn't possibly be so. NGONGE must have written it by mistake, he must surely mean Ethiopia or Kenya or Yemen. Our biggest enemy couldn't possible be people we share ethnicity. Then it hit me. The behaviour of Somalis from Somalia is to wish that Somaliland disintegrates. There is nothing subtle about it. Unlike those from Somalia though, the Somalis in Somaliland behave differently. We constantly pray Somalia becomes peaceful. We wish them well. Allah is almighty and just indeed, that is why Somaliland continues to prevail despite the odds. As for this topic, the likes of AT,MMA, Suusle & Abokor only understand the frankness of Xaaji Dallaayad in his poem Biri Ma Geydo: Gudo baas mid laga keenay oo garac ah mooyaane, Ma gilgilo duqeytida ninkii aw ka soo go'aye Then we have people like Xiin who was praising Mahiga with his road map to nowhere but as soon as he mentioned the obvious that Somaliland is a beacon for Africa has decided to wade in the mud and tar his erstwhile savoir. Xiin I assure you, Somalia will not come back at the expense of Somaliland. Somalia will have to do the heavy lifting on its own, or continue to let Ethiopia/Kenya/Uganda do as they please.

Jacaylbaro, when do you think Somaliland will send troops?

Salaan Sare Saxiib. Farole will not deliver, neither will Sharif. Nevertheless, what needs to be celebrated is the shift from wandering in the desert like the lost tribes of Isreal. They have finally come home. This is a turning point for Somalia's rebirth. There will be hurdles, Ethiopian/Kenyan invasion, AMISOM/Uganda interference etc, but those can all be overcome when you are prepared to take your destiny in to your hands and sit down with your fellow citizens to hammer out a solution no matter how long it takes.

NGONGE, The most senior would have to be Mr. Mahiga who is sponsoring this conference; however, between Sharif & Farole on paper it Sharif. It doesn't look like it though. In any case it is a sight for sore eyes. This conference being held inside Somalia is a breakthrough. Sooner or later something that will stick will come out and benefit Somalia.

Masha Allah. Water is a precious commodity. Many people will be able to benefit.

Che, where in my statement have I absolved anything? Now incase you try to derrail this simple yes or no answer, I actually feel that any "atrocity, murder, crimes" commited by any group or groups of people is horrendous and should be prosecuted. The issue;however, iswe have you equating the "atrocities" of a rebel movement and that of the STATE. Now again, do you actually equate the palestininian rockets/rock/ak47/bomb, against the tanks, helicopters and fighter jets of the isrealis?

Che, when are people going to grow up from the blanket statements? Are you actually equating the "atrocities of SNM" and the genocide of a state? I'm not talking about factions like USC, SNA, SSDF, SSNM, and the plethora of other rebel movements. I guess in your eyes, the plastinian rockets and the Isreali tanks and planes are equal. Thumbs up.

http://allafrica.com/stories/201109230675.html The below two paragraphs sum up Somalia's never ending peace reconciliations that reconcile no one. A Roadmap to Nowhere Dr. Michael A. Weinstein When one focuses on the official statements about, meetings concerning, and documents issuing from the "transitional" process, one falls prey to the illusion that they represent something real; when one opens one's eyes to the situation on the ground, one realizes that the "transitional" process is not a genuine effort at nation building, reconciliation, and peace, but a way of getting to the point at which it will be possible to pretend that "Somalia" is a political community/state. That result seems to be the best that the "donor'-powers can hope for, given their "benchmarks." It appears to be what they are willing to accept; it is difficult to believe that they believe that their ideal scenario is anything but rhetorical cover. The distance between rhetoric and reality - what is aspirational and what is operational - is a consequence of the failure of any of the domestic and external actors in "Somalia" to do the work and preparation necessary for a transition to an effective, functioning, and legitimate government. That would take time - perhaps years - and the "donor"-powers/U.N. have sat on their hands until recently - and now they are in a headlong rush to impose a solution. Seemingly unconscious of the irony of his words, Mahiga said on September 2: "In one year, we want to achieve, literally, what has not been achieved for over seven years."

Not a single person thought it through. LOL As much as I don't support UDUB & Ahmed Yusuf Yasin, he makes a valid point. Somalia is associated with nepotism, corruption, anarchy, chaos, mayhem, genocide, etc. The list is long, but you get the idea. The former Vice President is suggesting any sub-clan that wishes to join Somalia, must be prepared to loose 5,000 people at minimum. This is what Somaliland has gained from Somalia, war, misery, loss of life and nothing else. Considering the past, and taking stock of the present choas with no end in sight, the prediction that is all Somalia has to offer is spot on. The way you gentleman have read this qoute is totally upside, as Somaliland is not known for wholesale genocides. You should look in the mirror before you make baseless accusations of HE Ahmed Yusuf Yasin. I must say, even our least refined politician stands heads and shoulders above those of Somalia who are still slumbering when they need to wake up and save their nation.

Sayid that qoute by Tolstoy is quite correct. It is probably why Somalia Proper with all it's human capital, entrepreneurship, survival instincts, wealth, health , educational facilities, and yet have problems with the most basic simple rule of humanity and our faith which is to live in peace with your neighbour. 20 years is a long time to be blind to this common sense.