Originally posted by -Serenity-: ^ . thats a good one. quote: Originally posted by xiinfaniin: ^^Internetka layskuma hallayn karo---waa xoolo jinni. Not really Xiin. I've met lots of very nice (and surprisingly sane ) people online. I cant really say there is anymore risk involved with meeting people online than offline. Do you? Che, dee runtuun baan sheegayey. ^^Only a very smart and careful person could sift through all the rubbish Internet is full of and arrive the same result as you did. Most people however are neither smart nor careful. True there are a lot of benefits one can take capitalize on in the Internet. Yet the risk of using Internet as a primary dating means out way its benefits. I wouldn’t recommend it. Che, maxaa odoyaasha laga dheefayaa you asked. Well, yaa gabadha aad internetka ka raadinayso ku siinayya hadday ku yeesho ? Haddaad guursato ood isfahmi weydaanse yaa ku maslaxayya (hooyadeed way kuu sab-sabi kartaa laakiin inay la carootanna u dhow )? Ever heard nin duqi ah doqon maah, martiyina mudul maaha? ***Ducks from Serenity****

^^I stand correct on his name. And yes i know he is republican. But its his foriegn policy i am attracted to and not his domestic standings adeer..

Originally posted by Che-Guevara: quote: Nin gu' kaa weyn garaad kaa weyn Waxaas odayaasha Soomaalida niyada isu dhisa ee wax kale manoo sheegaysa ninyahow. Adeer waa buuxaa. Check this: Nin yari intuu geed ka boodo buu talana ka boodaa .

Jack Hagel is my man--if he decides to run that is. The rest are different sides of the same coin...

^^lol. Nin gu' kaa weyn garaad kaa weyn, aw kamaa qaala sowmaal!

^^Internetka layskuma hallayn karo---waa xoolo jinni.

^^Wax waalan . Balaayaad iska dhigeysaa, allow yaa ogaada xattaa weligaa dooro ma qalin. Ciidul adhxaha soo socota make sure you go to the sloughter houses iskuna day inaad neef ariya qali kartid...

^^ Zafirow, for a second waxaan mooday inaad rabto inaad warlord noqoto!

^^Redka, as you are beginning to find out a secessionist can’t easily shake off the ever-visible Ethiopian influence on Somaliland entity. Be proud of it, explain it in the light of the said newly found companionship like Duke does, or change your stance on it and join Xiin. There are others who tried to be both and the result was quite devastating--their center simply fell. Here are some facts to consider: SNM was a rebel movement. It had a legitimate grievance against Barre’s dictatorial regime. It’s political platform as far as we possibly know never included dismembering Somali republic. It looked, smelled, and walked just like other movements against Barre’s brutalities and injustices. That it abruptly morphed into a secessionist movement that fanatically seeks independence from an already dead regime is just a one big fat to propagate adeer. Wallaahi it’s lame to even attempt to make a case for this. Ethiopia didn’t create the sad realities on our soil-- it just exploits it. It exploits secessionism just like it does with warlordism. All these settings provide the correct values for it to solve the complicated Somali equation. That’s the big picture. Reading your long post however you seemed to have conveniently forgotten my implicit depiction and instead attempted to defend the exposed! I suppose it’s your literal mind that’s leading you to take the exact meaning of what I wrote and disregard the political context that gives its proper meaning. No matter. Now you complained the qabiil biases that I hinted. Check this adeer and see how transparent you are in that regard; in your mind Somaliland is the net product of its intellectuals, elders, and scholars while Puntland is chiefly an Ethiopian creation ! Just chew on that. One day you will IA come to the realization that if Ethiopia and Kenya are nations with diverse ethnicities and religions, dividing Somalia on the basis of yesteryear’s colonial legacy is just another trick to hold us back and give advantage to our adversaries in the region. One day Insha Allaah~~

Another banter…Ethiopia knows what it’s doing and needs no welcome from anyone in Somalia. It’s the lowborns that need Ethiopia so badly that want us all believe that a milestone has been reached or a greater regional understanding has been achieved. Come again.

Originally posted by Muj: Red Sea: quote:Originally posted by xiinfaniin: Ethiopia is the birthplace of the secessionist ideology. That it’s going to take the first step to further develop its baby makes most sense to me. Oh really. Do you have anything backing that claim? Is Somaliland influenced by Ethiopian politically yes, no doubt, however did Somaliland come about because of Ethiopia, no way, that is absurd and laughable. If you are making the case that the SNM was born in Ethiopian, they you luck basic understanding of it all. The SNM was created abroad, operated from Ethiopia for few years. They were kicked out after they signed agreement with Siyad Barre. The chairman of the SNM at the time they were in Ethiopia happens to be Siilaanyo, he actually condemn the Ethiopian aggression in Southern Somalia. So please before you make cheap comments like that, make sure you speak with some sort of evidence in hand. Or are you simplisticly relying on your elderly 'hadii kale waxan lahaa' here, no aahay to you there old man. Kashafa, The good thing about the SL situation is,which many people dismiss and aren't in clear understandin of is that, Somaliland contains multi parties. I feel the same way about Ethiopia and I am outraged as I am sure many Somalilanders are about Ethiopias' doings in Southern Somalia. The majority of sane beings dont support it, nor would want to have anything to do with Ethiopia beyond economical relations for the survivor of the region, military relations is no no. Somaliland simply requires a change, it needs it . Of the three parties in Somaliland, Udub is by far the most disliked, use to well received, but no more. This time Kulmiye has the edge over Udub in many ways. The chairman of Kulmiye party, mr. Silaanyo has publicly spoken out against the Ethiopian bombardment of civilians in Southern Somalia and compared it to the massacre that took place in Somaliland under the facist regime of Siyad Barre. Somaliland is indeed influence by Ethiopia, that is no secret at all, however where Somaliland hugely differs from the TFG(Puntland included) is the fact that Somaliland isn't made as claimed by Xiin, but rather the current adminstrations is under extreme influence of Ethiopia. Unlike the TFG, which regardless of the change made still would be an Ethiopian servant, just because it was actually made to be. On the other hand Somaliland needs a new leadership, who is not willing to take crap from Ethiopia. Ethiopia yes is more power than Somaliland and can simply rolled into Hargeysa without much defense, however Somaliland has been going around the world for last decade and half and is well know as being peaceful oasis which needs no disturbance, therefore it would be impossible for Ethiopa to simply invade Somaliland without an International outrage, unfortunately, the world has turned deaf ear to Muqdisho. Knowing that Mr. Silaanyo and his Kulmiye party have nothing to lose and alot to gain by telling Ethiopia straight on, that they will not take alot of crap from Melez and that Somaliland will make decisions on its own. Silaanyo met up with many Somali galbeed elders when he came to Minnesota few years back, he promised them if he took power in Somaliland that they would be no more handing of innocent men over to Ethiopia, because of being 'terrorist', Udub party is in charge of Somaliland, blame them, not somaliland, so blame Riyaale and his right and left wing men and not Somaliland. Somaliland is a country to be, whether we like it or not, and no I wish not to gain recogntion from Ethiopia, however that doesn't hault our wants for recogntion as seperate country, functioning on its own. So simply say as I say, down to Udub, viva Kulmiye. Just like most of the American people dislike Bush and his conservatives, we indeed also dislike Riyaale and his Udub party. Your explanation is deficient in many ways. The problem is not that you lack understanding of the current situation in Somalia; rather the problem is that you suffer from the same ills we Somalis suffer; Qabiil. That’s really it. How else can you tell me with a straight face that Somaliland is a country, and not a region in Somalia? Look back what you wrote, Redka, and reflect on it. Siilaanyo does not like what Ethiopia is doing you said. And I reckon you would dismiss Ina Waraabe’s kind comments toward Ethiopia in a similar fashion. In your mind, the problem is with udub, and not with Somaliland. A nice try but the facts hinder you. One can’t help but notice how far you went to explain hard facts away. But the truth is both stubborn and rude. And here the truth is that the goal of securing Somaliland’s recognition justifies the means. You are blaming Riyaale for your political ills. The man, my good brother, is only conforming to the reality on the ground. And the sad reality is those who are dominant in Somaliland’s power centers want to secede by any means. They do know, unlike you, that Ethiopia is what sustains them politically and militarily. They don’t love Ethiopia necessarily but they do appreciate its significance in the region. And they want a good relationship with it. Given the political goals they long and desire, they just can’t do without. This is the catch though: the old man in the south garnered Ethiopia’s support to reach his political goals, likewise secessionists everywhere do the same thing and are found in Ethiopia's capital begging the same support. That the goals differ makes a zilch difference as both failed to recognize that Ethiopia’s interest in the region clash with theirs as Somalis. Why blame one with passion, I dare ask, while conveniently explaining the other away! This is really repetitive and boring but those whom the unity of their people eludes them, and in their blindness sleep with the enemy in dismembering our fallen republic have no claim on honest…

And the truth is these ops, regardless of its author, are/have been/and will always be ineffective as long other initiatives remain stalled. Somalis everywhere in Somalia has learnt how to duck and deceive when the need calls for. I reckon this particular op is a retaliation from Geedi whose life was almost taken in the last suicide operation. Give them few days, and the momentum will swing to the other side. And the cycle will continue…

Originally posted by Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar: About oow . Oow laba ayuu u kala baxaa: a prefix and suffix. When it is a prefix, it is spelled aw [i.e., Aw kuuku, Aw koombe, aw oowe being examples] and oow as a suffix, dhibl oow , gaa boow , etc. Aw/oow are gender specific. Solely used to a male gender. Ay/eey [same as ay being a prefix and eey being a suffix] is for female gender and follow the same lexical laws. Ay eeyo, Ay maayo, Ay faay, etc. Cadd eey , macaan eey being the other examples. Aw is used in the context, mostly, when it accompanied by real names or well-known nicks attributed to persons, some real, such as Awfaarax, and others being nicks, such as Awmaar, [Raage Awmaare's surname, though he spells 'Oomaar' where most wrongly assume a corrupted name of Cumar.] Aw means, literal or not, "the father of ..." So when we hear the names or nicks like Awkoombe, it literaly means 'the father of koombe' [koombe which means qasac = can] since he is short. However, it is not strictly literal since he is not exactly the father of can. Or one can also say 'koomboow,' but it has a more aura in the aw context. Oow , though having the same base meaning -- i.e., "the father of ..." -- and unlike the aw , has the unfortunate of having a less connotation, less aura surrounding the it, thus we have yariisoow, kuusoow [awkoombe and kuusoow having the same meaning, but you can see it feels different], etc. It is same explanation and natural language as above with ay/eey . Ay follows the same context and way as aw , and eey [yariiseey, kuuseey] as oow . This is even extended to 'ab oow ' and ab aay ' words, which interestingly has the same root word of ab , only oow/eey (aay) being different, following the grammatical rule. What is more interesting, though, is that 'ab' is believed by some where Soomaalida kasoo faractameen as an ethnicity, that is why you heard that well-used phrase of " ab iyo isir uma lihin ," meaning it is and was not the dhaqan of our forefathers. Ab also has the base root of ' ab ti' and ' ab tirsi,' which the latter is obvious, meaning 'counting the forefathers.' ------------ Saldhig Carabi ma'aha, taas anaa kuu haayo. Laba erey 'sal' iyo 'dhig' ayuu ka koobanyahay. 'Xoolana' goormee noqotay Afcarabi? Xoole dhowr micno [Carabi kale] ayuu yeelan karaa, oo laga wado xoolaha, laakiin aniga kan maalka ayaa keenay ama wealth. In Soomaali context, it is used xoole as a wealth. Fadhi kursi waala dhihi karaa, oo fadhi kaliya ma laga wado living room. About waxgarad being macalin, that is the closest meaning we have in Soomaali. Macalin kama wadin the sense Soomaalida use as a dugsi macalin, but qof waxbartay in a sense of 'mutacalin.' About qani, it is an old Cushitic word. Perhaps it is them, the Carabs who borrowed, not vice versa. The Master has once again spoken. Thanks much saaxiib. War hoy inta MMA noolyahay wax kala hara. Allow ma taliyey !

^^'Adiguba caqlaad leedahaye carar maxaa dhaama' baa ka dhacday walle Faaraxow . Paragon, Nairobi lagama maarmo.Sinnaba loogama maarmo. Soomaaliduna xabbadoo dhacaysay ku caana maalaan. Raggeedii. Salaamaat adeer.

^^And there, Somali tragedy continues…

Ethiopia is the birthplace of the secessionist ideology. That it’s going to take the first step to further develop its baby makes most sense to me.

^^ You are a tough nut to crack---that much I admit. But your attempt to capture us and obscure the reality on the ground, not with logic and sound argument, but with a mere noise (though this one was quite friendly) is just not going to cut it. I know putting tfg on the hot seat and discussing its clausal failures is indeed a score point with you but that you loudly said so is what’s unDukish here.

Me, Here are my breaking points (not really points ) : Somalis has been fighting for 16 years. The civil war has caused a lot of sufferings. Apparently one group got the upper hand and utterly abused it. The heinous crimes they committed have no parallel even with current Ethiopian shelling. But all that was primarily internal fighting and however it seemed hopeless and gloomy, the criterion for peace was quite agreeable. It was as simple as this: hold reconciliation conference, address illegal grab of land and properties, come up with just framework for power sharing, and form a temporary body that governs in the transitional period. Easily said than done but I dare say that was the bulk of what needed done to arrive a permanent peace. Now our current problem consists not only our previous elements of contention but it also seems that a major rework has been done to it and it got altered fundamentally as a new element got introduced to compound the difficulty of solving it. The Alqacida card and the sanctioned foreign factor are the two new variables in the Somali equation. How to solve it is equally complex and requires cool heads with exponential thinking ability. The sequences are very important here. With all the current issues, two stand taller than the rest; legitimacy and security. How do you go about it then? Tackle those two first and then you have a chance of engaging the reconciliation task. I don’t have the silver bullet, as it were, but I think in the interim, and with Ethiopia out, peace is only possible if Somali question is taken up comprehensively. We need to shun from this piecemeal approach foreign powers prescribed to us. Somaliland and Puntland must be part of the effort of reviving Somali state. That would inject new dynamics and perhaps change the nature of politicking in the south. Do the tfg supporters share that opproach ?

Originally posted by The Duke: There have been mistakes, 1. In terms of security, the crackdown was started quite late, time was given to these groups to reorganize and continue with their usual action. 2. The supposed meetings with Ahmed Diriye groups was handled badly from a PR point of view, though insiders new the real deal the public should have been given the trut regarding these meetings, that in fact they were nothing more than this group being told to detest from their actions. 3. The TFG mishandled the evacuation of the city, they should have been clearer about their intentions with the public; though they tried it was not effective. 4. The TFG information outlets are still weak, thus giving the hearsay merchants far too much room to spread anti government propaganda. 5. The training and recruitment of officers across the country has not been effective and the episode in Kismayu has shown that more training is needed and more mixing of the forces rather than clan blocks within the army should be goal. 6. The incompetence within the TFG is something that I can not ignore nor would deny, for example the removal of Buuba from the foreign Ministry position while he was one of the most effective, loyal individuals within the cabinet was a grave mistake. The lack of transparency and accountability with regards to funds are more than mistakes. Duke as ever is getting defensive and is not willing to concede much at all. With all fairness take away 5 and 6, and you are left with grievances about the tactical moves tfg adopted in this war. The fundamental failures are either deliberately ignored or incompetently neglected. No word on the return of the warlords, no word on the compromise on their sovereignty in allowing Ethiopians to mass arrest persons it said were of interest to them, no word on the obvious lack of strategy as to how to move forward, even if the people were willing to tolerate them as a transitional entity, and above all no word about the utter failure of losing the regional game (if one assumes tfg understood the game that’s being played here) and completely relying on Ethiopia’s commitment to rescue them from the current insecurity. Thusly your efforts, though admirable in principle, are clearly hindered by the inherent biases you have toward the success of the tfg. No matter. Let me though concede a one point to you and tell you some thing you would like to hear: tfg is the strongest entity on the Somali soil amongst Somalis today given the help it gets from the foreign powers that support it. But that (and I am not taking that concession back, just commenting it ) yaa Duke is neither here nor there as Somalia’s problems are political in nature. If all Somalia needed were a military solution (locally organized or otherwise), Aydiid Sr. would have been the president of the Somali republic as he admittedly out-muscled all most everyone that stood in his way. So seeking military solution to a political problem is akin to repeating the mistakes our former strongmen made before it, and that, in a more basic way, is the mark of this entity’s failure. Of course, and in the big scheme of things, trusting a country whose strategic interest in the region is diametrically opposed to ours with the cardinal function of bringing stability and security is the most flamboyant trademark tfg posted…

^^At least you would agree that his army is providing whatever security there is for both the tfg personnel and the general masses of the city! I am gonna let the semantics be your forte but confirm that point for me !

^^I was trying to depict the big picture lest we get lost in the gloom details of our sad situation. I wanted you and others who genuinely support this tfg thing to take two steps back and observe how Somali matters are playing out in the context of the current regional politics of fighting terror and what not. Obviously you refused to do so. You want to bury your head in the sand. No matter. We have been there before so lets not flog this dead horse even further. It’s really meaningless. A side question I have for you adeer: is there anything that you are willing to concede? Any thing that you think terribly went wrong from the tfg side or from the side of your helpers for that matter?

^^Dayniile reported that Zenawi met with his subjects and gave reassurances. It also reported that the man left and didn’t stay as some expected. I don’t see any objections to that yaa Duke? As for Xamar being safe, well lets pray it becomes safe.

Meles Zenawi oo isla galabta dib uga laabtay magaalada Muqdisho Sida ay noo xaqiijiyeen saraakiil ku sugan xarunta madaxtoyada ee Villa Somalia, waxaa galabta dib uga laabtay magaalada Muqdisho ra’iisal wasaaraha Itoobiya Meles Zenawi oo isagu manta duhurkii soo gaaray magaalada Muqdisho. Ra’isal wasaaraha iyo wefdigiisa ayaa caawa maqribkii ka dhoofay garoonka magaalada Muqdisho, iyadoo ay sii sagootiyeen madaxda ugu sareysa dowladda. Ra’iisal wasaaraha ayaa ayaa laga filayay inuu caawa ku hoydo Muqdisho isla markaana maalinta berri ah uu warbixin ku aadan safarkiisa siiyo warbaahinta gudaha iyo dibedda, gaar ahaana kuwa Muqdisho.

Kulankii ugu horeeyey oo ku dhex maray xarunta Villa Somalia Meles Zenawi iyo waxgaradka, siyaasiyiinta iyo odayaasha dhaqanka beelaha ****** Ra’iisal wasaaraha dalka Itoobiya Meles Zenawi oo maanta soo gaaray magaalada Muqidsho ayaa kulankiisii ugu horeeyey oo fool ka fool ah la qaatay waxgaradka, siyaasiyiinta iyo odayaasha dhaqanka beelaha ******. Meles Zenawi oo la hadlay xubnihii kulankaasi ka soo qeyb galay ayaa u sheegay in ciidamadiisa Itoobiyaanka uu kala bixi doono dalka Soomaaliya haddii la helo xasilooni iyo nabad ka dhalata Somalia. Sidoo kale, Meles ayaa sheegay inuu magaalada Muqdisho u yimid, sidii uu wax uga ogaan lahaa amni darada ka jirta caasimadda, iyo sida lagu xalin karo amni daradaasi, wuxuuna waxgaradka iyo odayaasha dhaqanka beelaha ****** ka codsaday in si wada jir ah loo soo celiyo amnigii iyo kala dambeyntii, lana taageero dowladda federaalka Soomaaliya. Sidoo kale, kulanka ayaa waxaa ka hadlay ugu horeyntii Ugaas Cabdi Daahir Ugaas Nuur oo isagu ka mid ah odayaasha beelaha ****** isagoo sheegay in ay iska cadahay amni xumada ka jirta caasimadda Somalia, ayna sabab u tahay dagaaladii ka dhacay magaalada, isagoo sidoo kalena sheegay in beelaha ****** ay diyaar u yihiin in xal laga gaaro arrimaha murugsan ee Somalia, balse loo baahan yahay in dowladda Itoobiya ay dhex dhexaad ka noqoto siyaasadaha Soomaalida dhexdeeda ah. Sidoo kale, waxaa isna hadlay xildhibaan Max’ed Qanyare Afrax oo ku dheeraaday amni darada ka jirta caasimadda iyo sida wax looga qaban karo, wuxuuna sheegay Qanyare in wax lagu qaban karo in la isla wada shaqeeyo, dadka degaanka Xamarna arrimahooda ay iyaga ka arrinsadaan. Ra’iisal wasaaraha Itoobiya ayaa u riyaaqay hadalada ay soo jeediyeen xubnaha siyaasiyiinta iyo odayaasha ah ee ku hadlay magaca beelaha ******, wuxuuna u sheegay in isagu uusan wax ka qaban Karin amni xumida ka jirta caasimadda Somalia, balse loo baahan yahay in dadka Soomaaliyeed ay dhexda u xirtaan sidii loo xasilin lahaa, sida uu hadalka u dhigay Zenawi. Xubnihii kulankan ka qeyb galay ayaa waxaa ka mid ahaa Axmed Diiriye Cali, Ugaas Cabdi Daahir Ugaas Nuur, xildhibaan Max’ed Qanyare Afrax, guddoomiyaha gobolka Banaadir Max’ed Cumar Xabeeb M/dheere, taliyaha ciidanka Booliska Cabdi Xasan Cawaale Qeybdiid, agaasimaha idaacadda Hornafrik Axmed Salaan, Xasan Dhimbil Warsame, wasiirka arrimaha gudaha Max’ed Maxamuud Guuleed Gacmadheere iyo xubno kale oo aad u tiro badan. Wararkii ugu dambeeyey ee aanu ka helnay illo ku dhow dhow xarunta madaxtooyada Villa Somalia ayaa sheegaya in daqiiqado ka hor uu ka dhoofay garoonka magaalada Muqdisho ra’iisal wasaare Meles Zenawi, inkastoo galabta saxaafada lagu war geliyay in maalinta berri ah uu saxaafada war siin doono ra’iisal wasaare Meles.

CG & Naden , to fill in for Northern’s absence here, Muslims are not longing for monarchic dictatorship under the cloak of religion. The talk about the return of Islamic governance primarily means the establishment of a relatively just government, just like other secular governments in the world, but a one with fundamentally different mission. A mission of serving the masses by serving Allah that is. Past models may not be the perfect example to cite when it comes to its structural maturity and development in governance, as Naden alluded to, but it had the right principles and the ideal outlook and was indeed the best then. With today’s well-advanced knowledge about almost anything, what makes you think I dare ask that a Islamic government with a framework of accountability could not be established, and be the best again? And oh how could I resist saying a word to my friend JB. Fishing for trivialities, like this topic truly is all about, and finding snippets of negativity to discredit this way of life is not going to cut it yaa JB! If that was not what you intended blame it not on my comperhensoin but on my age instead...