Time Is Up

"204,000 oo Qof oo ilaa Hadda ka Barakacay Dagaalada Muqdisho..." UNHCR Dagaalka Muqdisho ee u dhexeeya kooxaha muqaawamada iyo ciidamada dawladda waxaa ku barakacay dad ka badan 204,000 qof laga soo bilaabo May 7, 2009 ilaa July 6, 2009. Dadka tiradoodu dhantahay 204,000 qof waxay u barakaceen o 55,000 ilaa Afgooye IDP, dadkaas 32,000 oo ka mid ah waxay u barakaceen Ceelasha, 13,000 ka mid ahna waxay u barakaceen Lafoole. o 60,000 waxay ku barakaceen Mogadishu dhexdeeda ama goobaha barakacayaasha ee ku xeeran Mogadishu, sida § 23,000 ilaa Dayniile (oo ay ku jiraan KM10-13 iyo Garas Baaley) § 9,800 ilaa Dharkenley (oo ay ku jirto Kax Shiqaal) § 9,600 ila Kaaraan (oo ay ku jiraan Jabuti Gode iyo Galgalato) § 9,100 ilaa Wadajir o Tiro kale oo dhan 89,000 qof waxay aadeen meelo sii durugsan oo ay ka mid yihiin: § 24,000 ilaa Shabelle Dhexe (Middle Shabelle); ooo ay ka mid yihiin 11,000 aadey degmada Jowhar. § 23,000 ilaa Shabelle Hoose (Lower Shabelle), oo aysan ku jirin Afgooye. § 18,000 ilaa Galgaduud, 6,000 oo ka mid ah waxay aadeen degmada Dhuusamareeb. § 6,700 ilaa gobolka Juba Hoose (Lower Juba) § 6.000 ilaa Gobolka Bay § 3,900 ilaa Gobolka Gedo § 2,100 ilaa Gobolka Hiraan § 1,700 ilaa Gobolka Mudug

^^ tani waa mid xiiso badan, fabregas baa raba inuu i tacliimiyyo fabregas mind you is not younger than me

^^loooooool

Aaheey! Soo dhoqso yaa Fabregas alsuumaali

North, brother, I just wanted to see if the man really understands what he celebrates for. For the rest of this jammaacah, Me i daali laakiin hal mid baa caddaatay, he does not support alshabaab. And that is something i can take home now I am off to the other thread, i think Fabregas' xanaaq is promising.

Fabregas, I asked you if you support Omer Hashi’s assassination on religious basis or even personally believe it was correct thing to do. You answered yes, and challenged me to prove if that is a Keliggii Muslim thing. Here is our exchange saaxiib. Originally posted by Fabregas: quote:Originally posted by xiinfaniin: Fabrb, adeer i am not wailing for i didn't know umer hashi. i asked you what is your stance and you resorted describing what you blve to be facts on the ground. do you believe the assasinatino of umer was justified from religious perspective, or from your personal piont of view? I just you to come out like Kashafa did, and subscribe to the kelligi muslim shcool . do you have the entellectual guts to do so ninka banooniga ciyaarow? Yes. Now prove to me how this is keligis Muslim school of thought. I challenge you . edit: yowmul juma aya la isku jihadi. I did give you why I think alshabaabs conduct is based on theology and characterized it as a Keligii Muslim. I have never heard from you. As-sukuutu yadullu calaa ridhaa Here below is what I wrote few days ago. Originally posted by xiinfaniin: ^^this is how: martyrdom is a religious act. Those who do it, do so out of conviction that their act will raise the Islamic flag, defeating the ambitions of teh enemy of islam. The young boy who murdered the 60 people, did so because in his mind he was killing murtadis. Meaning omer hashi not only was he wrong in his political inclinations but more importantly he was murtad and the shedding of his blood was permissible from that theological basis. Not only that but those whom killed with him were also perceived to be murtads for various reasons as well. Alshabaab and the keligii muslim school will never apologize the loss of those 60 people. They think those killed deserved to die because they were working for the dawlah al ridah. Now most people (of course keligii muslims will fiercely argue otherwise) agree that those killed were all muslims. They were muslims when they were in the previous tfg. They were muslims when they were against previous tfg. And they were muslims right before they were murdered. Don’t get me wrong there are numerous casualties in this conflict. but one side acknowledges the tragedy to be what it is, a tragedy. The other, the kaligii muslim side, believes they have monopoly who is muslim and who is not. Those who are not Muslims sharif included must be eliminated. Once the theological legitimacy is settled the means become secondary issue. tell me know what are the basis for takfiir, yaa keligii muslim al fabre? Now, there are two ways to go about this. Either tell me that you don’t subscribe to alshabaabs view of things, just like Me did in the other thread. Especially their judgment that those who are against them are gaalo and their blood is xalaal for them ( and there is plenty of evidence of this, so don’t protest it brother). Or defend it by whatever means you think will make sense to you. But don’t protest my characterization of you based on your position on the Somali conflict.

Me, in concluding this aborted discussion let me describe and characterize your stance. You vehemently oppose Sharif’s TFG on the grounds of sovereignty and national interest, you do not however support alshabaab (the only alternative to the tfg out there today), though you like what they are doing for the moment. That, my good brother, despite all the efforts to sound deep, makes you a man without tangible vision for better Somalia. You border being deeply in love with anarchy; to you alshabaab’s violence, the destruction, the suicide bombers, and the death and destruction, which are daily occurrences in Xamar, to you that represents the birth pangs of new Somalia. The sheer notion of upheavals and revolutions appeal to you, even if the disruption makes things worse, not better. I hope I am fair. From that point, and as I depart from this thread, let me say few words about current TFG. TFG, ya Me, is a legal fiction recognized by the world. It does not have the organs of a state. No entity in Somalia does. But it is a political arrangement that could work if given the chance. What it tried to do was to transition the county from a war ravaged to a relative political stability. The plan was to absorb armed Islamic factions in the south in to this entity so a national dialogue (where other political entities in the North of the county can engage with tfg) can commence. It did not happen, NOT because tfg felt big and refused talk to its opponents, rather it failed because alshabaab felt they could indeed defeat the tfg and have that part of country all for itself. That is how this conflict started. It’s between those who want to be so pure that they would not even compromise with their fellow countrymen, let alone with the neighboring countries, and those who can read the painful reality on the ground, and wants to end this conflict. TFG IS also a known commodity. It’s NOT anew phenomenon. Those who support it do so because they firmly believe that for Somalia to come back we have to start from somewhere. It is that somewhere. It’s far from perfect; its basic political construct is clannish; both chambers are filled with men with questionable characters; it does not enjoy the support of all Somalis. But given where Somalia is today, with the exodus of its intellectuals, the desperation that reigns supreme in its most important regions, the vulnerability of its women and children, the choice is clear: start somewhere and gradually improve it as normalcy comes back. And this tfg, mind you, particularly calls for reconciliation. It’s not a threat to our national interests. The lack of sovereignty preceded it. The weakness you see is the result of two decades of civil war. In fact if Somalis do not come together sooner, they will get even weaker, not stronger. The presence of foreign troops in Xamar is justified on security grounds. Had alshabaab accepted peace overtures Sharif presented to them, it would have not been necessary for these troops to continue their presence. The reason they are here is known, if alshabaab’s way is to be had, more troops acceptable or not will come. The reasons are known as well. For those who have any sense of nationalism and Islaanimo would see this alshabaab bravado is taking Somalia to the wrong direction. But for a born anarchist like you, who confesses that he does not favor alshabaab yet supports the continuation of current violence because he does not like the composition of the current tfg and the selection criteria of its members, it does not really matter which direction this group takes Somalia. You just want Sharif and the tfg defeated. You don’t care what happens next. Living in London, I might add, you can indeed avoid not caring what happens next. That is understandable from that perspective. But it’s morally deplorable. Simply put, I cannot see anyway out of this conflict other than a political settlement. I will always give my support to those who share that view. Those who out of sheer ********* make every effort to settle this conflict by overpowering others are in my opinion wrong. They will, one way or another, lose. I put alshabaab in the latter category. Needless to say Sharif’s tfg falls in the first category, and hence my support. wa ku kaas awoowe.

Balaayyaa ilaah ku saladday

^Now you realize that you come unprepared. Awoowe dhan isugu leexo. It’s very simple; can you defend alshabaab as a political ideology that vies to control Somalia? If you say yes I am willing to give you the leisure to even assume tfg defeated and done with. Assume there is no tfg; alshabaab is the victor in Mogadishu. Ugandans are utterly defeated, and whatever is left of them, were airlifted out of Somalia. One last note: don’t question of my manhood awoowe. If you go there, this conversation will be nasty.

^^Simple question: do you read my introductory lines of this thread? What about the heading of the topic? I mean are you just saying things or you are a dumb terminal waryee? EDIT: the reason I started this thread was because of your below assertion in another thread.I gave you heads up that I wanted to debate with you on this point. But you have disappointed. Originally posted by me: I do not support Al Shabab, however I believe that they are a necessary evil. what engendered this thread

Me, you have accepted my invitation without apparently knowing why I invited you. I wanted someone who can stay within the parameters of the issues at hand. This thread is about alshabaab and how they are necessary evil (as you put it in another thread) for Somalia. You refused to talk about alshabaab and went on tangent talking on old issues we excessively covered before. You said you don’t want to defend alshabaab ideology. And that ended our discussion ya Me. I must note that it would be logical to say if you were wise you would not support someone whom you can’t defend his objectives. Now the rest of your talk is cantarabaqash.

^^Ma intaas baad rimanayd awoowe? You think you are good at attacking tfg entity (which is essentially a political arrangement, that most people understand its disadvantages and advantages) but cannot put forth a reasonable argument for the viability of the alternative in the form of alshabaab. You want to cheerlead for them, but in the final analysis, you are unable or not ready to defend the ideology, and the objectives they are fighting for? I am not sure if it’s fulaynimo or dhicisnimo. It could be both. In either case, this is exactly what I wanted to prove. That those who our the loudest when it comes cheerleading the destruction of Somalia in the name of liberation do not have the slightest clue as to what it’s that they want. They are empty vessels whose looms excite the viewers at shore! But they truly are, well, empty. I want someone who can defend what he believes. I do not want to deal with natural whiners. Me is a natural whiner. I am done with Me.

^^Nationla politics and alshabaab can not be said in the same breath. alshabaab is a global movement. My question still stands. War Me ma ii maqantahay, mise sidii nimaan ogahay baad baxsattay?

loooool@Gabal Wallaahi waa talo

Tolow Me ma ii maqanyahay?

Me, what about the legitimacy of aid agencies with whom your alshabaab collaborate with? Kaama caqli badni ee waa ka weynahay awoowe

Northern, I am hoping Me will be a reasonable person. I hope he does not get mad at me like Febrages did.

^^The money is from an infidel entity. You don’t protest that. But you protest the accounting firm that will handle it. Caqlow ba’a Edit: thread ka kalaan kaa rabaa awoowe, wax walba haka murmine xagga iskugu kaayya keen,xoogaa daacadnimo ahna doodu kama soo harto ee ogow.

^^lool Me lives in an infidel land

^^Really? My questions are not silly; they are relevant. All I asked you was to tell us what you think alshabaab objectives are. You dodged. That tells me that either you don’t know what alshabaab's objectives are or, to use Aw Tusbaxle's words, you are too timid to share it with us. Now let me make it easy for you. Here below is what I think is one of alshabaabs objectives. Alshabaabs are not fighting Somali warlords; they are fighting current world order. Alshabaabs are not fighting to reconstitute or revive Somali republic. Somalia just happens to be staging ground for their ambitious goals of toppling other states including Ethiopia, Kenya, even Jabbuuti. The atom of their theology is that the world is divided between Muslim and nonMuslim. Muslims who have relationship with the current world order will be targeted. That includes states as well as individuals. If Sharif resigns today, alshabaabs wont be satisfied for their goals are greater than changing a nonexistent system in a failed state. They will continue their march and the war will continue---you will correct me here if I am wrong, but I believe that with alshabaabs mindset and thinking, the Somali conflict will continue if they prevail as you wish. The coverage of the conflict will spread. You may find that admirable but here is one painful fact associated with the continuation of Somali conflict. 1- as alshabaab wars continue, so does the displacement and exodus of Somali population. As it’s today most Somalis have already left the country and it’s really miracle that we still have a sovereignty given the thinning population in a vast land with no central government to guard it. Even more will flee from the ensuing mayhem. All you need is to imagine what will happen when this conflict spreads to the Northern areas (Puntland, Somaliland). And what happens when the Somali populace exits Somalia by large numbers? Is not that a strategic gift for other states that have long term interest to see Somalia weakened? Is Somalia today in a position to fight the world order that exists? Forget their methods for I am sure even you find them deplorable. Talk to me their end goal awoowe? Just like the warlords before them, alshabaab see the lack of strong Somali government that controls its borders advantageous to their cause. They want to preserve the vacuum. There is a discernible difference however. That is, where ever they control those who don’t contest their rule would find a reasonably habitable environment, measures taken by the current world order as a result of alshabaabs control notwithstanding. But is that what you want yaa Me? Waa ku bilaabay, ee hawsha wad. Don’t dodge it again.

Maryan Mursal ma la daayo. Waa fannaanad, maalinba meel bay ka ciyaari edit: Waryee Aw Tusbaxle goor maan ku diyaariyaa alaabtii?

^^Bravo. Waan kuu joogaa awoowe. Keligii Muslim, & Khaawarij labels will stick if you go the way Kashafa went

Me, adeer what do you want me to talk about? I started this thread for you to explain why you think alshabaab is righ. Or even why you think alshabaab are necassary evil. I mean cant you just share what you think are the real truths about alshabaab? Read the title of the thread. You are the Macallin here, I am the miskiin wanting to know and learn. alshabaab is the subject of discussion. Sharifka boqolsanaan ka sheekeyneyey. Waa nin nabadeed. Qoriga si fiican uma qabsan yaqaan. Dawladnimuu rabaa. Belaayadaan Ilaah ku salladay weeye waxaan rabaa inaad naga dhaadhiciso. Jooji tororogta waryee.

Me, yes I am serious with my statement that alshabaab is the central issue of current Somali conflict. That might not have been the case two or three years ago. But it’s today. The reason I started this thread (note the title, please) is because I want you, yaa Me, to understand what you are supporting. Without alshabaab the guns that constantly blaze in Mogadishu’s aisles would become silent. AMISOM would have left. Somalia would’ve made progress in moving toward resolving this prolonged conflict. Come again and answer the question. Lets narrow the discussion about alshabaab, their objectives, goals and methods. PS. Why do those who support alshabaab feel uncomfortable talking about this group’s objectives? Only Kashafa the Keligii Muslim had the balls to say what it’s he believes in. NGONGE, Me adaa dayacay