very enlightening. thank you.

I definately agree with you about re-inventing ourselves. I believe the primary step is revolution of the Somali mentality/ psyche to a different set of ideals that transcend self/ clan- interest....so education is a solution but we need to work on how we can establish and let the new ideals to flourish.

Blessed thanks- sounds interesting- particularly that last one..I know about certain somali lit. being intractable and Somalis are far from being efficient writers. Chimera- Im asuming your a sis, interesting..Not much into such but would probably take interest in scifi written by a Somali person..can we expect some from you in future? Looks like others dont want encourage my nosiness.

Qodax- thanks I really appreciate the cut and paste job.. ( you saw that poem and you thought of me huh?..how nice) but lets give credit to the poet too.. Kulmiye- if only we could get a lump sum ( or even a letter of thanks) for our enduring loyalty and love

thank , quite funny...goats being hurled under airoplanes..what some writers would think of!

oh..thats a disturbing story..but it's interesting because it brings together a whole set of ideas and experiences of "another world"..its seems too real to be just pure fiction thought up in America or wherever you are.

I think in general we need to preserve our culture for the sake of preservation, for posterity's need but we do need to practice only that of it which is helpful for our future and definately we must discard the useless aspects which are a hindrance to our progress. I dont see how a piece of traditional cloth can make us have pride.

dear Taleexi, other methods waxaan ula jeeda kuwa aan hadal badan iyo sheeko iyo been been u baahneyn- the more modern methods where you just fill in forms: find some who is looking to get married and see them ( over a cup of cofee in silence) check if that person meets your requirement and you meet theirs get a personality/ compatibility check for good measure marry the next day bal isku day ee war bixin nasii haday kuu shaqeyso iyo hadii kaleba.

Welcome Sum1notSomali, I'm surprised by response nomads! you seem quite hostile to be honest...if this kind of query is not worth your time just ignore it...I didnt see anything particularly offensive in the question and neither would I jump to conclusions about the poster's culture... Dear poster, We dont discriminate against or segregate those women you call "pariah" in our society and no Somali women are not known to talk about their intimate relations with men...they are every bit as decent as other muslim women. hope that helps

lol i knew someone would take that interpretation...

JazakaAllah sis..its a good reminder..and one would have to be reward oriented and akhira focused to benefit...without that it wont matter if it is 6 seconds or 60 seconds. but I like it ..thanks..off on a 60 sec break.

Salaam citizens, If you dont mind me being nosey..what are you reading currently? Also give us interesting quote or two if you want. Hope there will be some Somali tiltles too. Thanks.

Thanks Paragon..good article...I'm definately with you on these points..marka hadii inta badan af-macaanidii hore ay dhamaato guurka kadib waxaa is weydiin leh -ma dhab bay aheeyd mise shukaansiga/ hasaawiga wuxuu ku dhisanyahay been iyo xero galin ( dhanka ragga markii laga eego)? Aniga waxaan qabaa jaceeylka saldhigiisuba inuu yahay ayadoo la is xurmeyo - taasna waxaa kordhin kara adoo si fiican u ogaato qofka aa nolosha la wadaageysid qiimuhuu leeyahay. Gooni - you raised some interesting points...funny too. Hunguri- I think your last point is spot on.

Kool Kat - lol@ seef seefeey ..before i get caried away with the animations ...abaayo waa iska kaftan laakiin wiilasha qaarkood xad ma laha oo way dhaafsiiyaan 10ka sano...I'm just being sarcastic with the indecisive lot. Taleexi- I'm sure you Knew all this. Let me also remind you it's Humming bird! ..Not here to hammer anything. As for your question - I wouldn't advocate shukaansi ( the somali version ) as a general rule..I'm sure there are more successful methods... Ms-MoOns - true but let them aim for the best I say.

Thanks ..interesting article but it isn't surprising since more exposure would lead to conversions.

Ismalura - perhaps 10 yrs is too long for some:) Fat B - its missing a lot of the crude/ vulgar language you might be used to..sorry to disappoint you.

As promised here are the lessons mr Qodax and for all my other brothers who may be interested. Sister lets help these brothers out..please let us be gentle with these fragile creatures...lets not hang their dirty laundry from the balconies. 1.Know who you are/ your values and where you want to reach in life and act on those values by know who you are..i don't mean your tribe identity or what professional title you hold but rather the values you believe in and what you aspire to...make sure that you include among these values ones that women find endearing. 2.Be independent by this I don't just mean the independence assured by financial security but also the capacity to reach views independent of tribal affiliations..a withdrawal from the pack mentality is a rare quality so be fair and independent of thought wherever possible. Being independent is broad and would touch every aspect of your life including catering for your cravings -for instance if you cant survive without xalwo kismaayo its best to learn how to make it...don't rely on a woman who knows how to..you will end up enslaved by her. 3.Keep up your appearance well first make your appearance attractive then keep it up...I mention this because more than likely your image will need adjusting despite what the mirror is letting you believe...it's well known that men are more susceptible to self delusion. Why is it important at all? Its important not because women are shallow creatures who cant go beyond your outer image but because that's all most will have access to..1st impressions count as do repeated ones. 4.Make knowledge seeking ongoing affair and make it broad a man who is not being enriched with knowledge continually or who has lost the appetite for it, is as good as dead..women like men who are living , who are easily excited by knowledge as they are naturally by the prospect of copulation. Make that knowledge broader than the confines of Somali politics...it helps when you are interacting with people who don't major in that subject. 5.Contribute positively If you can provide real and overwhelming evidence of how you add value to the world most people would support the continuation of your existence..women included. 6.Be genuine in your relationships with people and see the positives in others the world and its riches will not fall to your hands on account of your machinations so don't go out there to fool others..it is not helpful to put on a mask to charm a lady..she will discover your ugliness sooner than you can claim your beauty. Also the sooner you remove your spectacles of doubt and paranoia the sooner you will see the good in others. 7.Strive for improvement in your character and realise your limitations The prophet (SAW) came only to perfect the character, so that area deserves attention on account of that alone. 8.Pack away your macho image and express emotion granted some women relish a macho man but even they would want it mixed with some tears and tremors...but generally speaking its worth practising some human emotions such as expressing fear, love, sadness if it isn't second nature for you already...it may come handy when you have committed grave offences and risk being kicked out by a woman. 9.Acquire and accumulate patience more than any other virtue one half of that patience you will need for the women who associate with you and the other for the rest of your life. 10.Don't be impulsive think before you speak or do never propose to a woman until you have analysed her for 10 years..women are rather complex than they appear!

Qodax- lol @ " copulatory senses"....I guess comments like that dont just pop out of no where....will see if i can get some posted later today....I'm spending way to much time here. Ms MoOns, thanks and welcome to you too abaayo...catch u later.

I hope you didn't expect me to dig into the archives to make a better judgement of your wisdom....( as that would be a waste of my time)...it is sufficient to look into a few of your most recent posts to reach my conclusions and if you remember my original post in this thread was a general comment/ observation/ question -not one aimed at you in particular. It would take deep study for me to figure out which clan you are holding the fort for and rest assured I am not in the hoodwinking business but I appreciate your cynicism....it would be most unwise to believe in charlatans and hypocrites...but we cant let cynicism stifle our future. Lol..adeer, you didn't have to go so far as inform me of the grey hairs of you chest to tell me that you have accumulated wisdom in much the same way. It's not in my code of ethics to insult old men..and so apologies if you felt offended. And certainly it is commendable for a man of retirement age to spend his time at SOL so long as he is there to impart his wisdom and not get caught in mud slinging. I agree that your criticism shouldn't necessarily be interpreted as clanist rhetoric but it is rhetoric non the less...it wont get as anywhere..as much as meaningful discussion might. Peace

" The true believer loves Allaheven if He afflicts him with trials and tribulations, even if He allows him very little in the way of food and drink, clothing, social status, health and well being, and popularity with his fellow creatures. Far from trying to escape by running away from His door, he uses its threshold as a pillow in which to rest his head. he does not feel estranged from Him, and he makes no protest when He gives presents to others and nothing to him. If He does give something, he is grateful and if He refrains from giving he is patient. his desired goal is not the receiving of gifts. his desired goal is the sight of Him, to enjoy nearness to Him and be able to enter into His presence. " The Removal of Cares by Sh. A. Al-jilani

With sermons and homilies like yours, we will never get to the jist of Somalia's issues and maladies too. What you see here is a clash of ideals, a clash of visions. No one can say one is superior to the other, but it is neither childish nor an oddity. Some times we just need to move beyond the gist so we are not forever stuck in the past. Having recognised that your visions clash and that none is superior does it make sense to repeat stories of the past as if you were entrusted with holding the fort for your tribe at SOL? Your stance remains childish though not an oddity judging from the manner of your response. And with the hastness in your judgements, I will not be surprised if your caps end before you celebrate your silver jubilee with 50 posts in SOL. This is a joke. Compliments of the new season, quacking bird! Well I don't plan to hang around here until retirement age and thanks for alerting me to this joke..I would have taken it otherwise. May your wisdom edge a little forward for the coming years.

So is the high level intellectual discussion that SOL is famed for? Sad really...boys will be boys...these are just waiting to hit puberty so they can join their dads in the slaughter fields. tasteless! with that type of mindset we will enver get anywhere.

However counterintuitive it all seems, I think it's right for some Somali's to start thinking out of the box and experimenting with such as ideas as they see in their interest... we shouldn't hold them back...we Somalis need to be flexible at times and we need to let others to make their mistakes if that is what their endevours turn out to be.

Ngonge- nice teeth..your presence alone is nerving..God knows what will happen next Qodax- Good...but I didnt know my emotional thread had anything to do with politics.....I'm starting to suspect that you r part of the secret police in these regions. about cuisinal skills - you should know that's what every modern man needs to impress a lady not the other way around!...hopefully my forthcoming lessons will help the menfolk here to know what is expected of them as mr perfects. Juxa - thanks thats more like it Showqi- the menu wuu isku dhax yaacsan yahay: ma isku dirqin karo..biyo caadi kaliya walaal...mahadsanid