We all know how many people they killed. What will we do about it? Nothing…..Well at least for couple more years, till the tribalistic and traitors die.

What’s Chavez doing? I have plans on becoming a member of the World Bank’s Boards of Directors. You’ve to eat these parasites from inside out Nevertheless, Chavez is doing what is in the best interest of his country, unlike the warlord regime who will sell Somalia to the lowest bidder.

It’s beautiful, absolutely amazing, the men were kind hilarious thou with their moves. Thanks, what is the dance called? I liked the way the women moved with their legs...how did they do that :confused:

I think the article mostly emphasized that the women were Persian and not Arabs. But anyways Arabs aren’t so far behind. Persians also do plastic surgery on their noses and are know for drinking. I don’t know what to say about these people who come from the Middle East, they like to intertwine everything with Islam, and then we wonder why Islam is viewed in such a bad image. But I don’t know why this article is only looking at women from Muslim families. Take a look at South America. Most Latino families are the same. They want their women to be chaste before marriage. It's also being done by the “born-again” US girls, who are 'born-again virgins', who've decided, after a sexual life, that they want to 'wait for marriage'. It’s a little bit too late for that. Either ways all these women are an insult to women who are still naturally chaste.

^^^And why shouldn't he be remembered? He was a victim of bullying and American rudeness, which probably drove him crazy....

Originally posted by General Duke: ^^^I agree the TFG gained the support of the US due to the ignorance of the Eritrean backed clan courts. The whole thing [Courts] was not well thought through, it was arsh reaction to Yusuf victory in 2004. As for the Ethiopian military it is there on the request of the legitimate governemnt to aid it in a time of need. You might want to hide that fact or like the "elders" who are the main topic of this thread play down the importance of this fact. The TFG requested support from any quarter and the Ethiopians came, due in part to their concern against the Eritrean led group backed by the Arabs. Thus their presence is not illegal, controversal yes but not without the backing. Thats why you do not get the UN security council demanding their imediate withdrawl. They ahve also made it clear they will leave when the AU troops arrive. The AU troops themselves have only a limited mandate before UN troops arrive. Its a short term answer to a short term problem, an occupation it is not. The main reason some get uptight about all this is because the Ethiopian armour gives an unfair advantage to the TFG But as you know life itself is not fair. It wasn’t due to ignorance, but the title they held and what they preached was what made America concerned. You could tell yourself whatever you want. TFG had two years before the ICU came into existence. Not to forget that the ICU only retaliated when the CIA started paying warlords to arrest Somali Sheikhs in Mogadishu. The world doesn’t route around Yey, so look outside the box. Big Brother came to rescue his little brother. There’s nothing that legitimizes this government. A bunch of handpicked warlords isn’t what generates a legitimate government, nor does the assistance the self-serving international community gives to the TFG. The international world clearly confirmed that no neighboring countries shall be involved in Somali affairs. Ethiopia is a puppeteer, an artistic one for that matter, and it will protect its marionette by whatever means necessary. It’s comprehensible to all that America and Ethiopia has a leash tied around the TFG’s neck. It’s Ethiopia who has invaded and brought thousands of its force to Somalia, and America who had spend millions on dollars supporting the Ethiopian led puppet regime. Ethiopia’s presence is illegal, and the TFG is illegitimate regime, for that reason their invitation is one which can’t be confirmed as a legalized one. Numeral high ranking individuals demanded the immediate withdrawal of Ethiopian troops from Somalia. Duke, the AU troops have already arrived. And Duke I will look it up, but when I brought up the fact that UN troops will arrive, you said there is no need for UN troops. I will remind myself to look that up. Ethiopia gives power to a regime which is completely controlled by Ethiopia and America. Why any Somalist shouldn’t be upset about Ethiopia supporting the warlords is beyond me.

Originally posted by Caamir: Ghalib is one of the opportunists and spoilers of Somali conflicts. This is the last moment that a man complains of a time when his country has the support of the United Nations, United States, European Union, AU, and most of the Arab League countries. To turn against the waves of hope that the events ahead of us promise to the poeple, is misleading and reveals a pervasive motive that some spoilers share as common agenda. If it takes lives to bring peace and order, but you view the opposite--stateless and anarchy, then time will be our witness. "ethnic cleansing" and "genocide" are hyperpole terms with no substantive logic behind it. Yes people have died in the cross fire from both sides, but to use "genocide" to describe the actions of the goverment is very very misleading conduct tinged with fear that the government is dominated by a certain clan intent on revenging past wrongs. It does not appeal to common sense at all!! Those organizations are the least bit interested in Somalia. They’ve their own interests, and the interests of the Somali people aren’t concerned. You’ll apparently notice that by merely observing just whom those organizations are advocating for. Corrupted men, voracious criminals and worse of all WARLORDS and their ilk. Senselessly killing thousands of people indiscriminately is an insult to peace and order. Enforcing a warlord regime on people who wish better is obviously defaming to every human being. The warlord regime demonstrated how it could easily carry out brutal atrocities without any hesitation. Thousands died in mere days, all whom were civilians. Arbitrary shelling on civilian invested areas was done because of their opposition against the warlord regime. There is nothing that is misleading at all. Massacre it was, and so it will be labeled as. Deal with it.

Originally posted by Castro: You're more like a fight-seeker than a wisdom seeker tonight. Who said the anti-TFG crowd is right? We're just as rabid, if not more so, in our opposition as they are in their cheering. Some of them are principled (though it is the wrong principle, I believe) and some are just along for the ride. But history will prove only one of us right and that is little or no consolation to those who lost their lives and those who continue to suffer. We can pontificate from the comfort of our living rooms but more often than not, the events we argue over are a matter of life and death for some. Allow sahal. You’ve to twist some few arms in order to gain wisdom from those who like to conceal it. Not all anti-TFG crew solely oppose the TFG for one cause, each one has his or her hidden intentions. Those who oppose the TFG for tribal reason are no where near being right, others who oppose it for the mere reason that it’s immorally wrong to support a regime as heinous as the TFG are on the right track. History only sides with the winner, the loser will be portrayed as vicious creature, which had to be terminated in the name of humanity. The people who die will be judged based upon which side they were fighting for. Defeated are the wrongdoers while the winners are depicted as the conscientious warriors. History is without a doubt unfair. May the dead all rest in peace regardless of where they stood.

Well Good Luck my friend, they will forget about it by the end of the day. It's typical of Americans...

Again, didn't Seattle already protest? What will protesting do by the way?

Abdi Ismail Samatar Department of Geography University of Minnesota April 2007 The United Nations refugee agency (UNHCR) has declared that the war in Somalia has produced, since the beginning of the year, more refugees than any other country including conflicts in Sudan and Iraq. Such a terrible statistic is the product of the Ethiopian occupation of Somalia and warlord terror. Unfortunately, the international community continues to endorse a government of warlords and its Ethiopian supporters responsible for the mayhem in Mogadishu. Somalia’s Transitional Federal Government (TFG) is deeply sectarian and its president has for many years condemned large genealogical groups as the “opposition to be dealt with”. Despite the TFG president’s violent statements and Ethiopia’s brutal occupation of Somalia, the international community led by the United States has been trying to impose a warlord-government on the Somali people during the past five years, having facilitated the formation of a warlord-government beholden to the regime in Addis Ababa.[1] Unsuspecting Somali public initially welcomed this development despite their misgivings about the poor quality of its leaders and their loyalty to the Ethiopian regime rather than to the Somali people. After two long years of waiting for the TFG to articulate a national agenda, the public turned against the TFG and the population’s reaction intensified the hostility of the Ethiopian dictatorship who considers the TFG as its client. Subsequently, the public gave its support to a new Somali force, the Union of Islamic Courts (UIC), which for the first time in 16 years restored peace to the capital and two-thirds of the country. Unfortunately elements of the UIC played into the hands of the American/Ethiopian alliance through the irresponsible rhetoric and rash actions of a few of their members. These developments gave the United States the pretext it desired to support and endorse Ethiopia’s massive invasion of Somalia and that led to the defeat of the Islamic Courts. The United Nations, the African Union, and other international bodies failed to condemn Ethiopia’s illegal occupation of Somalia despite the Security Council Resolution 1725 which prohibited Somalia’s neighbors from interfering in Somali affairs. This silence gave Ethiopia and its allies some cover and they claim that the troops will withdraw from Somalia once an African Union (AU) force is in Mogadishu. Uganda’s AU contingent is on location in the Somali capital but the Ethiopian troops continue to call the shots in the country. Further, the Ethiopian commanders have sidelined the TFG and are behaving and acting as if Somalia is their colony. For instances, they instruct the TFG leaders what to do and what to say and often bypass them to call for meetings with “tribal leaders” and sign ceasefires with them. Further, the Ethiopian regime fuels the sectarian project evidenced by Prime Minister Zenawi’s recent claim that a particular genealogical group is resisting his country’s occupation of Somalia. This is the clearest manifestation that the TFG is an Ethiopian Trojan horse. Ethiopia’s violent military occupation of the country and the vicious activities of its Somali client have created pandemonium in Mogadishu. Despite all of this evidence the international community refuses to confront the fact that Ethiopia is illegally occupying Somalia. As if to add insult to injury, the American Assistant Secretary of State for African Affairs went to the TFG base in Baidoa, after the massacre of over a thousand innocent civilians in Mogadishu, to reinforce America’s support for the Ethiopian occupation and their murderous deeds in Somalia. Further, the “democratic West” and the AU continue to insist that the TFG is the legitimate government of Somalia, and have also called for and endorsed a reconciliation process which is virtually controlled by the chief warlord and the Ethiopian regime. Despite this the international community continues to insist that genuine reconciliation is possible under the gaze of the Ethiopian occupiers and sectarian militias. Carnage in Mogadishu over the last month demonstrated beyond the shadow of doubt that reconciliation in this environment is an illusion and that claims to the contrary are disingenuous. In addition, the TFG leadership has neither the confidence of the population nor the capacity to manage such a project. Given these conditions, it is paramount that Ethiopian forces unconditionally withdraw from Somalia and a neutral African Union force takes control of the capital to lay the grounds for a genuine reconciliation to occur. The death toll of civilians killed by Ethiopian forces and allied sectarian militias over the past few weeks, estimated at 1600 and mounting,[2] is grave admonition of the violence that is unfolding. The EU has noted that war crimes might have been committed and “there are strong grounds to believe that the Ethiopian government and the transitional federal government of Somalia and the AMISOM force commander...have through commission or omission violated the Rome statute of the international criminal court [iCC]." Similarly, human rights groups have indicated that the Ethiopian forces might have perpetrated war crimes. Reports of these events suggest that endorsing the Ethiopian occupations and the TFG and its militia is tantamount to supporting the murderous Interahamwe of Rwanda, the Hutu radicals which perpetrated Rwanda’s genocide. One of the features of the Rwandan Hutu radicals was the categorical demonization of moderate Hutus and all Tutsis. This is exactly the language used by the TFG president and his prime minister. Mr. Yusuf has often repeated that certain genealogical groups oppose his sectarian and clanistic agenda. Among those he singles out are those population groups who constitute the majority in certain regions. In one instance, he refers to taking revenge in such a way that some of the victims of the 1991/2 killing fields becoming today’s killers. This threat has materialized as the destruction of neighborhoods in the capital over the past few weeks demonstrates. In addition to Mr. Yusuf’s call for revenge, the TFG’s prime minister and the deputy minister of defense have subsequently convened a meeting in which they called on “their clan” to assist the Ethiopian troops in cleansing the city of the opposition genealogical groups. This language is quite similar to those of the radical Hutus before the Rwanda genocide ensued. Lastly, the combination of this rhetoric, the destruction of health facilities, the closure of the seaport in order to cut off new food shipments to the city, and the denial for humanitarian agencies access to nearly half a million people who fled the city points to a calculated strategy to decimate all opposition, even if this is the whole population. Sectarian rhetoric by TFG leaders has been aired through all channels which has thoroughly poisoned the political climate and completely destroyed whatever shred of legitimacy the TFG had with Somalis except a small fringe of tribal chauvinists. Condemning entire communities is the hallmark of fascist regimes (as was the case in the latter years of Somalia’s military regime). Thus, the international community can no longer insist that the TFG is the legitimate government (because it is recognized by the UN) and attempt to impose it on the population. Such an action could only exacerbate the unfolding human catastrophe. In light of the massacres of the past few weeks by the Ethiopian forces and the unfolding genocidal tribal rhetoric, it is paramount that the international community seriously reconsiders its role in Somalia, and heeds the judgment rendered by the Somali people that the leadership of the TFG is criminal. Since the Ethiopian regime and the TFG are so dependent on the support of the West, pressure from these quarters could produce results that are inline with genuine peace, reconciliation and democratic principles. Finally, the US government in particular and other Western states in general have condemned Mugabe’s persecution of the opposition in Zimbabwe. Mugabe’s deeds pale in comparison with the continuing horrific carnage Ethiopian troops and TFG militia have committed in Mogadishu and what might be in the offing. In addition, the murderous ranting of the TFG leader and the criminally sectarian maneuverings of the prime minister and deputy minister of defense, and the Ethiopian support for them is the stuff that produces genocides. These developments should send a chilling reminder to all who were deeply disturbed by the Rwandan genocide in 1994. The United States which is militarily and materially supporting the Ethiopian occupation of Somalia should either take responsibility for the carnage committed in its name or put political expedience aside and act to short-circuit another African catastrophe in which Western countries and their African clients are totally implicated. Source

Originally posted by Castro: quote:Originally posted by Wisdom_Seeker: A regime America supports is a regime which isn't for the best interest of its people. Any Arab or South American could have told you that. Well, our TFG supporters aren't as smart as the Arabs or the South Americans.

Duke Last time I checked, neighboring countries weren’t allowed to interfere in Somalia, yet Ethiopia did. Ethiopia doesn't have the permission to be in Somalia today, but they are there aren’t they, in spite of what the international world says. Real danger? LOL! It was the other way around. America backed Ethiopia is a threat to Somalia and will always be. They made threats about Ethiopians in Somali soil . What gave them the confidence they needed was American support and orders, not the Islamic Courts. We have enough gun-men, care to tell us how many hospitals or shelters are going to be built? How clean water, food and basic necessities are going to be brought to the people who the Ethiopians made homeless? The only thing the TFG should purchase is medicine and food for the needy. Yemen, Ethiopia and Kenya, three slaves of America, how wonderful and the supporters of warlords and killers. The TFG only got international attention thanks to the Islamic Courts upraising. America rotated its neck 360 degree. America didn’t actually pay attention to the TFG, until the ICU came to power. All you have to mention is Islam, Shariah Law and America will support anyone who will counter-attack that group. People are only anti-government because of the overwhelming control Ethiopia has on the TFG.

We are forced to sit with a bunch of blood thirsty men, who swim in the blood of innocent people. America is forcing the TFG on the Somalis, regardless of what the Somalis in general think. If America gets the opportunity to exploit this regime it will do so and since the TFG is full of men with no morals they could easily be of some use to America. A regime America supports is a regime which isn't for the best interest of its people.

Grace Natabaalo Kampala A total of 10,940 prisoners are rotting in jail in various prisons around the country without trial. Hundreds of the prisoners have overstayed their remand for a period ranging from one to five years without their cases being heard in court. Of the 10,940 on remand, 2,369 are on murder charges, 1,366 on robbery, defilement (3412), rape (389) which are capital offences only triable by the High Court. Ten prisoners charged with manslaughter and 3394 others on petty crimes like house breaking, theft, assault and trespass among others are also rotting in jail awaiting their trial. Source Could this be the future for Somalis, if the TFG takes full control :confused:

Aweys Osman Yusuf Mogadishu The Somali government revealed Sunday that traditional elders and leaders of ******, Mogadishu's powerful clan, should attend the Somali National Reconciliation Conference which will be held on June as Abdulahi Yusuf, Somali president, announced in early March. Mohammed Guled Gamo Dhere, Somali interior minister, who took part in Shabelle Radio program (The Focus) by phone from Lower Jubba provincial town of Kismayu, 500 km south of the capital, indicated the reconciliation conference is open for all Somalis. "I urge the political leaders and traditional elders of ****** clan to give up opposing the transitional; and rather support it. They should join those who will attend the national reconciliation assembly. They should not incite violence in this country which has had no central authority for over 15 years," he said. The volatile city Mogadishu has been calm for the third day following the fighting between government forces backed by the Ethiopian troops and Islamic Courts fighters. Despite massive lootings on civilian properties, the government soldiers have been evident in all main streets of the capital, searching cars and buses for guns and explosives. Somali political analyst, Abdinasir Ahmed, says the routed Islamist fighters might come back in the intention of being suicide members. "If this UN and international recognized transitional government dose not come with a different political solution towards the people opposing its existence and its Ethiopian allied troops in the country, a new type of violence like suicide bombings will be seen in Mogadishu," he said. Ahmed reiterated that the government's two top leaders, President Yusuf and premier Gedi, should be committed to peaceful dialog with the Islamists and the clan leaders to achieve a lasting political solution for the impoverished Horn of Africa country that has seen no affective central government since the ouster of former dictator, Mohammed Siad Barre in 1991. These two leaders objected to including the routed Islamic leaders in the reconciliation process. Mr. Yusuf made clear early this year that his government will not let people posing as an organization to attend the conference. Yesterday in a press conference he held at the presidential place, the president stated his government won the Islamic Courts fighters. "Those who have been wronged and misled do still have chance to give up their arms and go among their people. We will not let the terrorists be strong in our country again," he said. The news comes as residents in Mogadishu were complaining after several houses and privately owned companies were ransacked by looters when government and Ethiopian soldiers occupied insurgent strongholds in north of the capital. Hundreds of heavily armed men hired by business companies in and around Bakara market, south the capital, had to register themselves at a government police office opened near the market. Many of them waddling their guns could be seen queuing outside the office to receive an identification card for their guarding jobs. This form of registration was introduced by Abdi Qeybded, the commander of Somali national police force after he and Bakara trade committee convened in the capital on Saturday. In the meeting, the trade committee has also agreed to surrender their heavy weaponries to the government. The government, its part, guaranteed to the committee that the security of Mogadishu business companies would be the responsibility of the transitional government, Qeybded, told journalists Saturday. Source

By Jama Mohamed Ghalib Tuesday, April 24, 2007 As anticipated, catastrophic consequences of human suffering of the recent war of invasion of Somalia sanctioned by the United States of America have been tremendously unfolding. Pathetic news casts continue to emanate from the Somali capital, Mogadishu, by the hour and numerous accounts of these have already been written by Somali scholars and non-Somali writers. All Somali managed cyber-cafes and many other international websites contain a lot of these accounts, as well as stimulating poems of land mark values. A great deal of constructive debate and analyses are abounded. I have read with keen interest many of these written accounts including pertinent articles by Prof. Abdi Ismail Samatar, one of which contains some concrete proposals for a new transitional structural arrangements. And also a PINR article lately prepared by Dr. Michael Weinstein whose reporting on this subject I often concur with. I would, however, like to add a few emphases to the ongoing discourse, just for the record. The international community have not even so belatedly come to grips yet with the fundamental basic realities as the only course of resolving the present Somali crises, including the following: The key to any such resolution is an all-inclusive and genuine reconciliation process to be held in a neutral venue that can lead to a positive political settlement. Nonetheless, any steps ought to be taken in this direction is for the time being out of the question unless and until the so much abhorred Ethiopian invading forces leave the country and end their illegal occupation, ipso facto. The international community naively continues begging the question by their mantra pronouncements of supporting the Ethiopian foisted Trojan horse, the so-called TFG that ingratiated itself with the unholy invasion of the motherland that visited mayhem and misery on the Somali people. By its own making the TFG is already dead for all practical purposes, once and for all. Its supposed incumbents have miserably failed to serve the nation in the last three years and can never be accepted as national leaders by the Somali people. They are not even acceptable to an overwhelming Somali majority to play any more future role in the national crises, because they have become the marked cause of these immediate crises and cannot be part of their solutions. They have become pariahs and not many Somalis will ever want to sit with them on the same table. Read On....

The Reporter Bruck Shewareged Sunday, April 29, 2007 Addis Ababa (The Reporter) - Merera Gudina, a senior opposition figure, called for the withdrawal of Ethiopian troops from Somalia as heavy fighting in the capital Mogadishu claimed the lives of hundreds of civilians. Merara, leader of the United Ethiopian Democratic Forces (UEDF) party, told The Reporter that the military victory against the Islamic Courts forces was not followed by political victory or national reconciliation which is now postponed to July. "If you see from the (Ethiopian) government's point of view, the options left are difficult. Pulling out will raise the question: 'why in the first place did Ethiopia go to Somalia?'" However, Merera warned that staying in Somalia had consequences. "If you see it from the public's viewpoint, I would say pulling out is a better option", he said. He argued that Ethiopia's poor economy cannot sustain a military presence in Somalia for long. "For a poor country like Ethiopia, interfering in others' business will be a heavy burden." "America stayed four years in Iraq and nearly sixty years in South Korea militarily. Doing the same thing is difficult for Ethiopia," said Merera, stressing his point that Ethiopia's fragile economy might suffer due to war expenditures in Somalia. Merera criticized Ethiopian government's choice of "allies" in Somalia who could not so far bring about peace to the country. "Key figures in the Somali transitional government are well known. They are not saints", Merera said, referring to the many former warlords included in the transitional government. He accused them of lacking legitimacy in the eyes of the Somali people as many of these warlords lacked popular support due to their past during the decade-and-half-long civil war. "The warlords were there for 15 or 16 years. Everybody knows them. The Somali people may not be expecting anything new or good from them," he said. Source: The Reporter, April 29, 2007 SOURCE

The continuing slaughter in Mogadishu attracts little international attention outside Toronto and other centres of the Somali diaspora, but experts warn that the bloodshed could soon affect the entire region. Sunday, April 29, 2007 Starved and terrified civilians fleeing their homes. The stench of death hovering over the steaming streets. Tanks and missiles blasting through the night. Cholera victims dying in the dust. A plague of war has descended on the Somali capital, Mogadishu, claiming more than a thousand lives and displacing an estimates 300,000 people, as the country's transitional government, backed by Ethiopian troops, continues to battle for power with supporters of an ousted Islamist regime. It's one of those complex regional wars that attract little international attention – but this conflict is closely watched in Toronto and other centres of the Somali diaspora. What much of the world doesn't realize is that this little war threatens a humanitarian catastrophe that could have spillover effects in the region, and the West, for years to come. "It's a genocide in the making," says Mohamad Elmi, an Ottawa-based partner in Mogadishu's independent HornAfrik broadcasting network. "People are fleeing in every direction, but they're being wounded and killed and there's nobody to help them. Now, all the political agendas are merging, and everything we've feared is happening. If it continues this way the whole Horn of Africa will be in flames." So far, most of the slaughter has occurred in Mogadishu, which lies on the western shore of the Indian Ocean: a chaotic city of 1 million where a United Nations-backed Transitional Federal Government had been unable to take control since the TFG was set up in 2004. Last June, the clan-based Islamic Courts Movement seized the city, imposing order until it was ousted six months later by Ethiopian troops backing the government, with military support from the United States, which feared Somalia would become a beachhead for Islamic extremism. Now, as the fires of the Somali conflict burn higher, sparks are spreading to other volatile areas. "This brings us right back to the surrogate politics of the Cold War," says University of Winnipeg president Lloyd Axworthy, a former UN envoy for Ethiopia and Eritrea. "You have all the same elements: lack of settlement, special interests and international players trying to carve out their own requirements for the region." Last Tuesday in the eastern ****** region of Ethiopia bordering Somalia, an ethnic Somali militia attacked a Chinese energy facility, slaughtering more than 70 people and kidnapping eight Chinese oil workers. Somalia has laid claim to the Somali-speaking ****** region since the late 1970s. The grandfather of Bashir Makhtal, the Somali-born Canadian being detained incommunicado in Ethiopia, was once a leader of the separatist ****** National Liberation Front that carried out Tuesday's attack. Makhtal, a former Toronto resident, was deported from Kenya to Somalia and then to Ethiopia in January. Although his lawyer says Makhtal's has not been in Ethiopia since he was 11, the detention is a sign of the Ethiopian government's concern about unrest within its borders. David Shinn, a former U.S. ambassador to Ethiopia and U.S. State Department co-ordinator for Somalia, say the ****** attack was the largest the separatist militia has undertaken in many years. "I think the timing is more than coincidental. They can see that the Ethiopian forces are tied up in Somalia, so it's a good time for them to strike." While the ****** attack was taking place, suicide bombers targeted Ethiopian troops fighting in Somalia. The bombers were part of the Young Mujahideen Movement, which has adopted the jihadist tactics of international terrorist groups. Although some foreign fighters have joined the Somali war, experts say it would be a mistake to simplify such complex regional conflicts by labelling them religious-based ideological clashes – a view taken by U.S. President George W. Bush's administration, which sees them as part of the worldwide "war on terror." Analysts who study Somalia argue that fierce clan-based struggles have created something more akin to a gangland state than a battleground for Muslim extremism. "The current fighting is a combination of the former Islamic Court people and a more important group, the *** sub-clan (of the major ****** clan), which feels it hasn't been given enough power," says Shinn. "There are a lot of business interests at stake and Somalis are consummate businessmen." Those caught in Mogadishu's deadly crossfire see the new conflict as a flashback to 16 years of warlord rule, which ended when the Islamic Courts – formed from the large ****** clan and backed by powerful business leaders – restored order in the capital. The TFG had been unable to get a grip on the fragmented country but kept a foothold in Baidoa outside Mogadishu. When the Islamists took the capital, many people rejoiced, although warily. "What most Somalis want is peace and security," says Khadija Ali, a former TFG minister and now a graduate student at George Mason University in Virginia. "But they will never have it unless the parties are willing to solve their problems peacefully." The Islamists were at first welcomed for their crackdown on violence and criminality in Mogadishu, but their strict application of sharia law, media censorship and clan nepotism soon caused resentment. They also outraged Ethiopia by threatening to seize the ****** region. The Islamic Courts' ouster has brought only more bloodshed to Somalia, in spite of declarations of victory by Somali Prime Minister Ali Mohamed Gedi. Corpses are rotting the streets of Mogadishu and hospitals have all but collapsed. As the city is reduced to rubble, the impoverished towns to which residents have fled are unable to cope with their needs. Humanitarian agencies have been largely unable to help war victims, and the UN has warned of a disaster if fighting continues. "Ethiopia is caught in an unwinnable war, and there's no end in sight unless it and the transitional government have a paradigm shift in the way they deal with each other," says David Mozersky, Horn of Africa project director for the International Crisis Group. "But now the fighting has gone so far that neither side wants to make an effort at conciliation." Clan and land issues have fuelled an already volatile mix of hostilities, says Andrew McGregor, director of Toronto-based Aberfoyle International Security Analysis. "The troops in the TFG are from the large ***** clan. And as far as the ****** are concerned, they're simply an occupying army," he says. The clans have fought bitterly in the past, and now the ****** "see their old enemies back in the streets." Complicating things further, Ethiopia's dedicated foe, Eritrea, has reportedly offered training and support for ****** rebels and has harboured Somali fighters opposed to the TFG. Ethiopia has accused it of sponsoring terrorism, making the prospects for peace between the two neighbouring, and still warring, countries more remote. Eritrea labels the charges a politically motivated smear. As the Somalia conflict rages on, says Axworthy, "this is the seedbed of an entire breakdown in the region. What's happening here will push back into Eritrea, Sudan, Djibouti and the whole region." But it is the Somalis who are suffering most, after losing up to 1 million people in more than a decade of fighting. As they pray for an end to the killing, the few overtures for peace between the warring sides have failed. Says HornAfrik's Elmi: "Somalis just want to get on with their lives. They say: `Show us the buck, not the bullet.' If as much effort was put into peace as war, Somalia would be paradise instead of hell on Earth." Source: Toronto Star, April 29, 2007 http://www.hiiraan.com/news2/2007/apr/how_the_war_in_somalia_could_spread.aspx

^^^looooooool. Oops..

Why not ask Puntland to hand over their guns, before Somaliland?

They can’t stay forever tahliil, that’s completely impossible. However, if they wish to linger around, than the TFG will only lose the people which had little hope in them, the resistance will get stronger, and the violence will return more popular, man-power and well prearranged. The Ethiopians along with their slaves will perish or the Somali people will. I am well aware of the incompetence of the TFG members. There isn’t a single one which has a brain cell which functions normally, they have confirmed that themselves. But for the moment, let’s use them as stairs. Puppets aren’t gifted at getting things right or doing anything right for that matter. We have passed the stage of clannish mindset, at least some of us have. People from all walks oppose the TFG. Even non-Somalis see that the TFG is only competent at supporting Ethiopians who massacre innocent Somalis and demolish the Somali nation even more. They’re in no way motivated by nationalism or Islam, but rather money and the greedy to obtain more of it. I don’t expect anything from the TFG, but I expect people with political knowledge to play manipulative politics with the TFG. Most of them aren’t educated about democracy and the political game played today. They’re familiar with dirty politics, which involves bribery and assassination old African style. Ethiopian isn’t as bad as America which makes Ethiopia as powerful and influential in Somali politics today. It is time to play smart……

Student placed stone in Cho's memory By UPI Staff United Press International April 27, 2007 BLACKSBURG, VA (UPI) -- A Virginia Tech senior has revealed that she was the person who added a 33rd stone to a memorial for the shooting victims, remembering the gunman. Katelynn Johnson told the Virginia Pilot she counted the stones at the edge of the Drillfield two days after the April 16 shooting. "I just lost it," she said. "I broke down. I was seething. I remember saying ... 'How could people be so mean?'" Johnson, a Minnesota native majoring in psychology, and her boyfriend, Jim Keane, added the stone at 4 a.m. More recently, the memorial has been reduced to 32 stones again, although Johnson said the one that was taken is not the one that she and Keane placed there in memory of Cho Seung-hui. Johnson sent a letter to the student newspaper, The Collegiate Times, after learning that a stone had been taken away. "We lost 33 Hokies that day, not 32," she wrote. "In my opinion, no life has less value than any other. Cho was a human being ... Who am I to judge who has value and who doesn't? I am not in that position. Are you?" Copyright 2007 United Press International, Inc. All Rights Reserved This young lady is quite right, Cho should have a stone placed in his memory...

Duke Behind the Gun? Politically, the TFG was inept and powerless, but with the gun it transformed. Still I only praise political parties, which are well organized, well financed and have members which are both well capable of leading and protecting the people they represent. The TFG isn’t that organization. It came to power through the barrel of the gun, and its members aren’t what I would call “leaders". You kept insisting that Ethiopians will leave soon few months ago. When is soon? 5 years from now? We could certainly get our act together, but only when the Ethiopian troops return to their nation.

^^^ LOL Barre already warned us about Yusuf... By the way Gitmo is more fitting of him. He could talk with the insurgents, AQ members and terrorists