Originally posted by HornAfrique: 98% of your rebuttal is dedicated to something I have never insinuated! Check yourself adeer, clearly you just want to engage me in discussion! ...Let's end it there for your sake. NinBrown, Munaafaqnimadiisaan ka fariisan weyney sxb!

Empreror, my esteemed friend, you know very well my answers to the questions that you have posed. But for the sake of clarification and for sharing it with the forum and particularly my TFG supporting brothers I will repeat it. What you, and anyone willing to partake for that matter, must understand before we begin this discussion is that it is only going to be fruitful if we assess each other’s viewpoints and have something concrete to base our arguments. For this we have the Book of Allah, the Sunnah of our beloved Prophet (Peace be upon him) and the exegeses and understandings of the prominent scholars of Islam. So we should see to it that we do not merely speak out of our whims and desires but have something tangible to cling on to so that we are not derailing far and wide in our benighted state. And we all know that in any matter which Allah has spoken to us about, there is no room for debate whatsoever! Now, beginning with the definition of the current situation in Somalia, it is apparent to any man of understanding that Ethiopia has marched with its artillery and might into Somalia to indiscriminately shell and bombard innocent civilians. And it is agreed upon by the scholars that if an enemy occupies the land of Muslims, even by the size of a hand span, then jihad become Fard Ain on them - and that in the incidence of such a confrontation, defending your religion and land (Jihad) becomes an individual obligation upon every Muslim living there; even on those whom Jihad is not usually permitted, e.g. the sick, the women, etc. This is Defensive Jihad. Ibn Taymiyyah goes on to confirm that there is Ijmaac (general consensus) on this issue and that ‘the first obligation after Imaan is the repulsion of the enemy aggressor who assaults the religion and worldly affairs.’ Not only that but he adds that there is no condition – such as supplies, military transport, etc. - required to engage the enemy but should be fought with all immediate capabilities. And this can be found in his book Al Fatawa-al-Kubra Vol 4. Pg 608. This is a refutation to those who flourish Al-Shabaab as being ill-equipped to take on the might of Ethiopia. The above explanations by the scholar are supported by the verses from the Qur’an in which Allah says ‘Infiru khifaafan ow thiqaalan’ (March forth light or heavy – Suratu Tawbah, 41). The scholars of Tafsiir have explained it to mean that you must march forth for Jihad in any possible circumstance that you are in - wealthy or poor, young or old, sick or healthy. When the call for Jihad is announced or when it becomes obligatory on you, you must march forth. The above verse was revealed during the battle of Tabook when the Roman army were on the outskirts of the Arabian Peninsula and haven’t even entered it yet. So doesn’t an army in our land, in our streets, in our homes become obligatory on us? Many of the TFG supporter’s arguments are that Ethiopia is helping us establish a government, otherwise they wouldn’t vehemently support it, and that she is helping us to reconcile. Have we become so low and depleted of all dignity that we seek Ethiopia’s assistance? The reason why so many voices of dissent arise within the Muslims today is their negligence of the Sunnah. Indeed, we have been told time and time again that the best example we have is that of our Holy Prophet – yet to his ways we turn a blind eye, deeming our ways to be more fruitful. The holy prophet was once going to Jihad along with the companions when one disbeliever requested that he may be permitted to accompany the Muslims and fight alongside them in the war. The prophet asked him if he was a Muslim to which he replied in the negative. Thereupon the Prophet told him: Go back, for I do not seek the assistance of a Mushrik. And here we are today shamelessly imploring disbelievers to tend to our problems and help us. Have we given up on Allah so easily? You say that you want to see the end of Ethiopian troops as well and agree that expelling them from our land is a priority. But you and many others have your reservations about Al-Shabaab’s approach and hence question their feasibility of expelling Ethiopians out of Somalia. Is it that your scepticisms are rooted in your evaluation of Al-Shabaab as ineffective? And that their inefficacy impedes the feasibility of their goals? Or are you questioning the methods by which they attain their goals? It is significant to understand that the feasibility of attainment of the goal lies in the method the goal is attained. The means of attainment is not detached from the end goal, but rather is itself inclusive in the goal. Do you follow me? The grave worshippers derive such a deep sense of khushuuc from visiting the graves that they cannot find from visiting the mosques of Allah. Though their intention is to attain Khushuuc from the remembrance of death and get closer to Allah, their means of attaining it is wrong. So does this mean that the Maslaxa (benefit) justifies the act? The means of attainment of our common goal that you propose are through reconciliation and other means as such, whereas Al-Shabaab’s approach is that which is adopted and endorsed by Islam – to fight with whatever means necessary to expel the enemy of Islam and protect religion, for it must protected at all cost. Now, my friend, which of the two means will reap fruits? Not worldly fruits, but the fruits of Imaan? Yes, the Al-shabaab too are not without imperfections. But their Instead of concealing the shortcomings of our Muslim Brothers, we are here brutally upbraiding their efforts, chastising them in their process and forever imprecating curses upon them. All the while, they are advancing forward so that Allah’s word prevails over the polytheists. It is nothing save our critical and at times derogatory viewpoints – us here in the Diaspora lavishly consuming a Western hedonistic lifestyle – that is impugning the character of those striving to defend their religion, their people and their lands from Kuffars. Even if you do not agree with the Jihad, apart from the fact that you will be doing yourself a great disservice, have the courtesy to give them the Xusna thanni or The benefit of the doubt - for they are your Muslim brothers. Or are you taking disbelievers as helpers in this world? Know that seeking help from a disbeliever is tantamount to Shirk of Uluhiyya (one of the most prevalent forms of Shirk in today’s society) as it is Allah alone from whom help should be sought. Seeking help is an act of worship, so for one to direct that act of worship to a disbleiver who doesn’t deserve it is a great error. And it is not permissible for a man to commit that which is Xaraam to please Allah (Ibn Taymiyyah) as There is no Maslaxa in it for him whatsoever. Shortly after the death of the Holy prophet (p.b.u.h) Umar addressed the companions and said that the with the prophet’s death, every man will now be judged by that he reveals – i.e. Daahir or what is noticeable from him and not Baatin, the hidden self. You have no knowledge of what lies in the hearts of these men, but we judge them by their apparent – and that, so far, has been one that is in constant war to expel an enemy from a Muslim land. Wallaahi, If C/yusuf said today that I will rule Somalia by the Qur’an and Sunnah and shows the outrwardly signs of his following of Shariah, I will be the first to support him. Lets leave what’s in people’s hearts to Allah alone, until we see it in their outwardly actions. Or are you slandering one whose feet are dusty for the sake of Allah, or is it that you believe that other forms of worship are more important than Jihad for the sake of Allah? ‘Ajacaltum siqayat-al xaaji wa cimaaratal masjidil Xaraami Kaman jaahada fii sabiili-llah…’ ‘Have you made the giving water to those on Hajj and the construction of the Holy mosque akin to the one who strives for the sake of Allah…?’ They are not equal, Allah goes on to say in the Ayah. Impertinent it is deemed of a man to pour scorn on another, out of the former’s inability to execute and accomplish what the latter can with gallantry. These are men who have given up their life for their religion, and we are here criticising them day in and day out. You are encumbered by cowardice, my dear TFG supporters, Cowardice. And it is this lack of courage and the Mujahid’s demanding task that affrights the frail hearts in your chests. So you dastardly manoeuvre past any calls for Jihad or Islam because of your inability to participate. But this shouldn’t stop you from stating the truth, should it? You are not certain about Allah’s help reaching them? Why? Do you accuse them of impiety so much so that they are devoid of Allah’s Nasr. Let’s think of what we say very carefully brothers before we fall into traps unbeknown to us. It is Allah who gives His Nasr to whomever He wills, and By Allah, a Mujahid for His sake and His Glory shall never be abandoned by Him. Wallacu Aclam. Subxanaka Allahuma Nastaqfiruka wa Natuubu Ileyk.

Emperor, Insha-Allah I will come to you with my reasoning. I will give your question the just answer that it deserves markaan soo laabto ee i sug.

Originally posted by HornAfrique: Clap, clap adeer you have debased Horn. You have debased the integrity of a cyber character who has been on this forum for over 6 years, has never had reason to hide his feeling, has never been shy of his political stances, has a length of forum history that could objectively speak for him, and in effect has never been one to speak in tongues and dodge from speaking bluntly and clearly as possible. You are almost entertaining. That is if I was more apt to laugh because of you rather than at you. Juvenile? You betcha; then again what about your handicapped cacophony was not? You are Dismissed adeer and I say that sincerely . Like I said previously, leave SmithNWestern and HornAfrique to themselves. They do not need middlemen. Horn, ina adeer – Your ship has capsized amidst a blustery storm and now you are huffing and puffing, despondently, struggling for some air to subsist. But Alas! The currents are too powerful and your heaving lungs are giving up. Soon you will be submerged under water, with no aiding hand to cling to… You speak boldly of your integrity – An ‘integrity’ of which your recent revelations act as a rebuttal to its integrity. And the astounding it is that you owe your integrity to your 8 years in SOL. Perhaps our fellow Nomads who have been here for a very long time can tell us whether it is the longevity of existence in SOL that provides one with integrity or, rather, their coherency and consistency in voicing their opinions and arguments. Your very own opinions lack clarity and have Qabiil as their fortress – and sure of it I am that any argument buttressed by absurdity of Qabiil is bound the recoil back to its inventor as irrational, however blind to it he may be! And you speak of Integrity – do you even know the meaning of integrity, so to speak? p.s Remember a Forum, such as this one, allows one to participate in any thread of a topic posted. But if you are secretly insinuating at me to pardon you with your calls for my dismissal, I certainly will…

Originally posted by HornAfrique: quote:Originally posted by Jimcaale: I suggest the psychotic kid should get too religious about his persona instead of playing elevated soul to chastise others. Looks like a personal insult to me. Looks like Jimcaale's got himself a fan... * affinity after exposure alert! * .

Originally posted by HornAfrique: quote: Stop wallowing yourself in the glories of yesteryears sxb Speaks volumes I say. p.s. Hadaan Duke cidiisa ama "qabiilkiisa" aan necbahay ama aan jeclahayba umaan baahnin in nalasoo dhex galo. Adigu un ha lug-go'in. ^^ For a man who hasn't got the GUTS to come forth with his opinion, you are a deplorable one! It is good that you opted for a statement from which you will receive a less harsh criticism and insisted that we should leave you alone - but you got caught! You only detracted your earlier statement, cognizant that it will substantiate my claim about your inherent Qabyaalad - and it has (thanks to Jimcaale). Qabyaalad is what oils the wheels for you my friend and everyone in this forum is aware of that! Pathetic, you are Horn, truly a debased character!

Originally posted by Abtigiis & Tolka: Hagaag Abdilatif. Sometimes, I am just repsonding to set the record straight, and not to convince anyone who is clearly not intersted in objective argument. Mahadsanid. Abti, sometimes it is best to refrain from debating with stones. And sometime some people's opinions don't matter - for they will never change a thing nor will they contribute anything remotely valuable to society! POSTER: You may have realised that the initiator of this thread has gone awol! Take no offence to it, for it is but his custom. The man, evident from his inability to substantiate his arguments with substance of his own, has an incredible ability to quote and copy & paste - this of course, fellow nomads, serves as his substitute for wit!

Originally posted by Emperor: What a topic, one heck of a thread, I enjoyed reading the replies as well, I guess I have no room to squeeze in as a TFG supporter, or may be I have , I leave the rest inay sifiican iskula jeexjexaan, laakiin si nadiif ah oo xirfadaysan hala iska qanciyo sheekada Alshabaab. Other than that, I have to give it to one man, I admire LX's sincerity, LX Saxib I trust you are a man of virtue with good intentions. Haha! Empreror - in badan baan ku sugayney ee ma hadaad soo dhacday Sxb! It would be really great if you could, on your side, share with us your perception, the pitfalls of Al-Shabaab and the way ahead now!

Originally posted by Kashafa: Soomali kala baxthay: Gaal-diid vs Gaalo-raac. Muslim vs Munaafiq. Wadani vs Qabalisto. There is no need to rely on tortured explanations and choked forced arguments. Originally posted by Abtigiis & Tolka: Talking about negotiation is a milder way of saying let us submit to the rule of Ethiopia. Maxaa lagu wada hadli. First the status quo must be reversed. Indeed! Death is certain - choose the way you want to die!

Originally posted by Sophist: I havent seen Raad yet; but invited to the Launch dinner tonight. War Hoooy! war nin baa soo ambaday!

General Abti, in 1991 you were chased out of Mogadishu, bedraggled and in threadbare clothes so today for you it is obviously a case of Inagaa wadana! But I applaud your transparent support for your uncle and your unwavering stance, however despicable it may seem, unlike many of SOL's cyber poltroons. Horn, Your feighned piety is apparent to all sxb, so quit the sanctimonious approach of reproaching General Duke. Whilst you beguile your corroding heart with lies about the senseless loss of life in Somalia by A/Yusuf and his Amxaars, we all know the grounds for your such twaddle. It is our of your utter contempt for Yusuf and the tribe he hails from why like to see the end of him - so stop disguising it as a hate for the Amxaars. Whilst you chastise General for his support of Yeey, are you oblivious to your blind support for Barre Huuraale. The only reason you support him is the lame waa tolkay and tolkay deserve this and that rubbish! Quite this never ending rigmarole and be a man! If the ailing Huraale were to expire today, where will you channel your allegiance? Stop wallowing yourself in the glories of yesteryears sxb - things have moved on and being wistful of a time that never will come will not help you in any way! As for your Calaacal that few people lost as much as you did - it was your revered Aabe that caused the worst devastation upon entire clans - and you come here and preach us of your supposed suffering! Bollocks Mate!

Considering that Somaliland is a pioneer in torturing, blind-folding and transporting innocent Somali civilians into the waiting hands and prisons of emaciated Ethiopian Soldiers over the border, the posters intention is clear - to circulate anything slighty, with or without a shred of evidence, besmearing the name of Puntland. Doesn't the posters own blind secession-impregnated government return ONLF refugees back to the Ethiopians to torture and kill? Doesn't his very incompetent adminstration hand over innocent civilians in exchange for ammunition and to prove their unflinching loyalty to the Amxaars? Don't they confiscate the properties of innocent O.gadenians and then transport them to Balligubadle and to the Ethopians? How dare he then talk about other people's actions whilst disregarding his own? You seek recognition by detaining innocent people, repatriating them to the hands of Ethiopians, imploring westerners, torturing Muslims in the name of terror and then have the audacity to talk about other people? Soomaalidu waxey ku maahmaahdaa, maroodigu takarta saaran ma arkee tu kale tan saar buu arkaa!

Well said Che! Dheregtaa dadkan u been sheegtay. Seeknowledge - you make intellect your top priority, even though you have yet to harvest its fruits, and let be those who make religion their top priority. Lazie - even children my dear, Even children! Xiin said Alshabaab will continue to engage Ethiopians in every opportunity they get, and Ethiopians will punish the innocent civilians for it. Yaa Xiin, Ethiopian withdrawal from Somali soil is not going to come about as easily as you anticipate it walaal. If an intruder knocks down your door and points the nozzle of his gun at your face and is intent on killing you, are you you going to inveigle him to talking terms or think of ways to repell him? An Ethiopian withdrawal cannot and will not be done by coming to an arrangement with them...! Baashi said What’s wrong with having negotiated peaceful settlement between all warring factions? Despite your cries of 'gibberish' and 'nonsense', meesha wax lamaad iman adeer. As for the 'determined and resourceful' enemy that you have mentioned, know that the few people they are fighting are more determined and more resourceful. The Amxaars are intent on winning this war and returning jubilantly to their families, while on the other sides the Al-Shabaab have relinquished their will to live. They have given up on life already sxb! ...Negotiation you say? Qalbigaa daamur kaaga yaal heedhe! Negotiating with an invading force is out of question ee meesha wax kale ma ku haysaa? or is Socod Badane's theory tenable?

The amount of people expressing their unreserved abhorrence for Al-Shabaab has become transparent here over the time they’ve began their pursuit. These people, often in the comfort of their western homes, come up with all sorts of explanations to justify their innate weakness. A disease is in their hearts – a disease that gnaws at their insides as each day passes by and though they are not oblivious to the truth, they simply turn a blind eye to the state of affairs Al-Shabaab have no scholars, they proclaim, they are just a bunch of kids armed with guns and a false understanding of the basic tenets of Islam. They have disregard the very fact that majority of the Somali scholars have indeed affirmed in their outright statements the declaration of Jihad to repel the occupying forces. Other loosely salivate their tongues with the cries of FITNA, FITNA! proclaiming that the so-called Jihad is nothing but spreading Fitna and bringing about the destruction of a large population of blameless folks. After first enlightening themselves about the meaning of Fitna and what it entails, is it not worth contemplating for a second about the possible consequences of an Ethiopian presence in Somalia? Or are they disregarding the fact that in their places of stronghold, such as Baydhabo, even offering Morning Prayer or growing a beard is considered a sign of extremism which could lead to being shot? Fitna would come about as a result of giving the Ethiopian and their stooges a carte Blanche to wreak havoc throughout Somalia – not the dispelling of them. And in this we say that Al fitnatu ashaddu min-al-qatl (Fitna is far greater than the killing) . Others, with a very weak Imaan, draw attention to the supposed ineffectiveness of the Al-Shabaab and to the futility of their actions. Al-Shabaab, they state, cannot achieve anything tangible at their current state. The Ethiopians are mightier in both man and machine, they say, and the hopeless retaliation of Al-Shabaab would simply exacerbate the death toll of the innocent civilians. Little do they know that Al-Nasr is from Allah! Others, in their benighted minds, are happy to see Al-Shabaab put their arms down and assemble at a table for reconciliation talks, fully knowing that such infertile calls for reconciliation are but saab aan biyaha celin. They entertain themselves on the false pretence that the Ethiopians, who are in Somalia simply because of the schisms between the warring tribes, will merrily be singing farewell after this moment and all will be rosy! How blithely they take the situation to be! Then we have those whose slogan is ‘As long as it’s not in my backyard’ and laze about nonchalantly in the comfort of their houses unmoved by Ethiopia’s blatant indiscriminate killings of Somalis. Particular culprits of this notion are the Northerners – unaware they are that Ethiopia is looking to advance upwards to molest them once it’s done raping the South. Islam protects five things – 1. Religion 2. life 3. honour 4. wealth 5. intellect Each is dispensable according to the needs of the other – with a top priority of protecting religion at all cost. So if you cannot and don’t have the heart to protect your religion, your land and your people from the invaders, you either be quiet and quit slandering those who are in the killing fields, or have the courtesy and humility to support them in your heart - for they are doing what you, 'o coward, can't do!

Dad dullaysan baad tihiin hadaad maantana tiraahdeen xabashi nama xasuuqin.

General, After his unsuccessful attempt at Majiiyahan and Galgala, now Cadde Muuse’s teetering administration has its eyes on other lands. I tell you this from the start sxb - Don't count your chickens before they hatch. It’s NOT going to happen ee waxba hasii miliqsane dhareerka iska bi’i. Your foul-mouthed chieftain has nothing more to offer than a load of profanities.

War odayaashii SOL maxaa helay. what's with all this filth nimanyohow? Talaxumo ma halkaasey idin gaarsiisey Generalow?

Originally posted by Libaax-Sankataabte: Xiniinle, more like angry Awoowe. It is shame ( and I said it ) these guys would be fooled and played like that by these French (Excuse my language here ). Why release hostages when you don't even have a safe exit yourself? Kuwaas oo kale ayaa Somali ceebeeyey. Waxna iskama celin karaan, dhibaatona joojin mayaay ... caruurtooda ayuunbaa gawda laga guri. PS: three of these "pirates" held by the French are my own "cousins" and it was shocking when the call came last night that ina hebel and ina hebel are some of the characters in French jail. LSK, waan ka xumahay sxb. To be quite honest though, I am not saddened that these pirates were shot at and held captive by the French, anyone who causes fasahaad fil ardi should be ounished - what saddens me more is Dowladna waanu nahay baan afka haynaa, quwwadna ma lihin. Any Tom Dick and Harry can come to Somalia, strafe entire villages with air raids and handpick anyone they want to transport back to their bases and we cannot do anything about it! Now thats GUNNIMO! Originally posted by General Duke: My uncle is the President of the republic of Somalia adeer. Stability, law and order benefits the President and those who love the union.

Originally posted by Libaax-Sankataabte: These pirates got played by the French. The pirates were captured and few of their relatives were killed without any single harm to the French hostages. Now that is a clever commando mission. Shame. Sidaad ugu sacaba-tumaysid wexay ila tahay aad ayaad ugu faraxday arrinkan. Libaax, Allaylehe Libaax!

Looks like Amin Arts has summed it all...

JC, lool waa iska kaftan e bal soo daa waxaad haysid. Somali Kaftan = Hard talk + No hard feelings!

Udubyohow dhidbani, weligaa dhisnow - Very good slogan I must admit! Very creative...although the rest of it is pure Cantrabaqash!

FTG - a secular government which invited the Ethiopians to persecute Muslims - Are fighting so that Their word prevails. Sh. Shariif's group - are willing to fight so that Ethiopians are out of Somalia (nationalistic interest) Al-Shabaab - are fighting so that Allah's word prevails (An takuuna kalima-tu-llahi hiyal culyaa) You choose which side you want to be on...

A special just for Oodweyne: Doqonkii dibbira waa lagu yaqaan daaca qudhumede Darajuu ismoodsiiyaa dabadeed yidhaa I daawada e Muxuu been daldalayoo taariikh dabakhan nagu afuufay Darandoori muxuu noogu riday hadal duluc sii ridnayn Dacar uurku la bukiyo muxuu nabarro soo daadshey Damiinkii Suldaan ahaana muxuu ka daba-naageeyey Looma dirsane tolow muxuu durbaan dhawaaqla’ tumay Dulliyohow ninkastoo damiir lihi daaqad kaa aragye Dugsigaa kuu been sheegiyo daaradahan dhaadheere Meel lagu diriryaadan aragoo degin daayin abidkaaye Duul cadhaysan baan kusoo geliniyo darawiish lalaya e Labada daamood baa kuu buxiyo uurkoo daahsanaaye Damaacigana waa laydin ku yaqaan nimakiinan daacaya e Cagadhigta walle dooxooyinka Nugaal doobi kuma culataane Dameeradiina iska dhaqdoo dhaansada dhulku waa dooge Dusha ka rartoo fuula ileen dunji waad u lahaydeene Intaas uun baan idinleeyahay maanta...

Wouldn't you call a Rapist GUN?