its not occupation if the government invites you.

OK, we all think the other side is ignorent or confused, lets call it a day and agree to disagree.

Sometimes I cannot help but smile at the sheer ineptitude of some folks in this forum. Lol. Just how does what applies to the TFG cannot apply to the ICU? Who actually enforces regulatory policies with regards to the lifting of the embargo? Once the gates are open, all hell will break loose. Whatever the TFG arms gets, others would get an equal measure. Talk about confused people. All factions will be able to get whatever they used to get, this will not change. proposed exemptions will only ably to the TFG, because if there is a country willing to suppply factions like the ICU, they would have done that already regardless of embargos but there is no such country. With help, the TFG would be better able to patrol Somali Airspace, sea and roads. As for "Once the gates are open, all hell will break loose. Whatever the TFG arms gets, others would get an equal measure", not exactly. Their would be a TFG or an African Solder with a big stick on the other side the gate who would beat any unauthized trespassers.

Naxar Nugaaleed:... Now how could you expect the TNG with one of the quintessential criminal warlord at his head, elected by fellow maffiosi warlords, keeping prominent ministerial and security positions will deliver justice to their very victims? Wasn't M. Dheere welcomed by PM Geedi himself? To add insult to injury, the Maffia in Baidoa are opposed to Shariah implementation and welcome relentlessly Tigre militias... DS, brother, the tfg is not headed by a "Criminal warlord". President Yusuf was a democratically elected president of puntland state of Somalia and was again elected as the president of Somalia. Before that he has definded puntland from southern warlords Such as Aideed and terrorist aweys. Before that, he lead a rebellion againist a Military dicatorship. Whee in this do you see a warlord let alone "the quintessential criminal" one? Also the sort of justice that you speak, can not implemented right now. As they say, an eye for eye leaves all of us blind, spacially in the case of Somalia with countless number of guilty people. The cabinet, a very largeone at that is not composed of warlords but has only a few and that is becouse their clans want them there. As for this Mohammed dheere thing, i have no Idea. He has insulted senior members of the government and was a bad host. He was a member of the anti terror allience and no igad nation, which Somalia is a member of, are supposed to host those individuals. Be that as it may, he is a host of Gheedi, we will see if there is preisedntial or parliamentary pardon. Lastly, "Shariah implementation" is a distraction from what people should be concern with. Are 90% of Somalis not muslims, if they were God fearing muslims there would no need "Shariah implementation". Our times and the setuation our country is in require a little more pragmatism than warlord can not be judges (which they are not, they are ministers) and "Shariah implementation" has failed in more pious societies then ours. Horn: I think you are duly misinformed about the implications of any possible lifting of the Somali arms embargo. Also adeer, anti-TFG does not equal anti-government otherwise we can imply, from your own assertion, that prior opposition to Abdiqasim Salad Hassan from various corners ment anti-government. I don't think I am misinformed about the lefting of the ebargo but if I am, please tell me how. How is it that being anti TFG does not equal enti government. TFG is the only legitmate national authority regonized by every international organization. Until its time is over and there is another one, it going to be the only one. So being against this TFG makes you anti government. We could come up with alot of reason as to why the TNG was illegitimate and the TFG Legitimate. For example, If we divide Somalia into three differnet parts, Somaliland and Puntland would make two third of the country and neither participated in the talks to form the TNG. The last third had no administration to inter talk on their behalf other than countless warlords or faction leaders, even so,not even these factions who controled that third of the country were invited. Instead, Somali "Intelectuals" from the diaspora flew directly to Jibuti with out even going to Somalia and decleared themselves presiden. primeminister and so on. What little legitimate authority that was there were few clan elders or leaders. The conference to form the TFG consisted of faction leaders, clan elders, "Civil Sociaty", those "Intelectuals" from the diaspora and local administrations, with the exeption of Somaliland. Whatever each community Somalia saw as the legitimate representatives of their community were there to represent them. Hope that clear it up for you. regardless, puntlanders should have supported and contrary to what you impley with this, they did support the TNG. None the less, this was not the cuase of the failure of the TNG. Salaad failed to take the advice of the elders to go to baidoa and build the government in that provencial capital until the national capital was pacified. Instead, he went to small house in the capital, fired three Prime ministers and instead of using the funds the international community give to rebuild the nation, became a warlord himself concern only with land graps and the rise of his sub-sub clan.

I believe these letters were ment to threaten the arab league more than anything else. No leader in Somaliland would suggest such a thing. We must not equate the people the people of Somaliland and these leaders who are out for their own interest. Somaliland people are Somalis so lets make a distenction between the people and te leaders. I think.

horn: What's ironic adeer is that "my warlord" in Kismaayo will just as much have the green light as Abdulahi Yusuf to import as much weapons as possible. What I am willing to understand, however, is even Hiiraale having more then the weapons necessary enough to defend the people he was sent to protect from Morgan is a detriment to his person, the forces he represents, and through that to the whole Somali nation. Though you can't possibly understand this sxb, when I stand against the lifting of the arms embargo, I am really idealistic in that I believe the current armaments will dry themselves up and will not necessitate the continuity of warefare (which would have happened long ago if the arms embargo was actually enforced). Even Hiiraale will not have a mandate anymore as there would be no more agression. Hence, Kismaayo will hopefully once again come under the administration of a Somali government and loose its designation as a "reer hebel" controlled city that has so tarnished its image during the civil war. This national security plan and partial lifting is not about allowing more weapons into Somalia. Correction: Factions like the ones that control kismayo will not be allowed to get more weapons. The lifting of the ban (Not that it ever stoped any faction from aquiring more weapons) will only concern the TFG so that it may build a national Army and security forces and get security assistance from the international community.

I am really suprized sometimes at what people here argue about and how they speak. Speaking as though their arguements here have any significance as to what happens in Somalia. For all the people who hate TFG and managed to perrsonify it into Ghedi or Yusuf, don't waste your breath: wither the TFG fails or not we shall see and nothing you say can determine the failure or success of the TFG. After 16 years of anarchy, should wee really argue about wither we want a government or not becouse anti TFG = anti government. People, A government is not an option and disarment is not an option. If you hate this government, you can only wait tell it fails. If you want disarmament (All sane Somalis do), foreign peacekeepers is the only rational way at national disarmament. These people have captureed this or that city will not work. If Somalis can disarm them selves, it would have been done a long time ago. it is said that a sign of lunicy is doing the same thing and expecting different results, For those who support this or that faction, no faction will ever restore our country (If that really is your intention). A government (TFG for now) and national disarmament is the only road we have to get to that goal. So what really is the source of your opposition aside from it is not in the interest of rer hebel or that faction?

UN council eyes foreign peacekeepers for Somalia By Irwin Arieff Reuters Tuesday, July 11, 2006; 6:12 PM UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - Britain circulated a draft U.N. Security Council statement on Tuesday that diplomats said could eventually open the door to a long-delayed deployment of foreign peacekeepers in Somalia. The draft statement, a copy of which was obtained by Reuters, would express the council's willingness to consider plans for a "peacekeeping support operation" as proposed by the African Union and the seven-nation regional Inter-Governmental Authority on Development, or IGAD. PHOTOS The week's events from around the world, captured in pictures. » VIEW THIS WEEK'S PHOTOS Diplomatic Dispatches Nora Boustany 's column reporting on Washington's diplomatic community appears each Wednesday and Friday in The Post. Before Graceland, A Less-Publicized Stop At Walter Reed Colombian Envoy's Title Is New, but Mission Is Same More Diplomatic Dispatches Save & Share Tag This Article Saving options Council support for foreign peacekeeping troops for the Horn of Africa country -- which has had no real central authority since 1991 -- would be crucial as the soldiers could not go in unless the council eased a 1992 arms embargo. The draft would also express the council's readiness to ease the arms ban to enable Somalia's shaky Transitional Federal Government to develop its own security forces. The Western-backed interim government was formed in neighboring Kenya in 2004 with help from IGAD. It is based in Baidoa, 150 miles northwest of Mogadishu, because it was too weak to set up in the former capital. Mogadishu, long dominated by feuding warlords, was captured on June 5 by Islamists seeking to impose Sharia law across the country. The Islamists also oppose foreign peacekeepers, although interim President Abdullahi Yusuf says they are needed to get his government on its feet and pacify the country. Council action on Somalia has been stalled for weeks over internal divisions. The United States has been hesitant to embrace the idea of easing the arms embargo, while China has argued this was merited by the need for foreign peacekeepers. A formal council statement would require a unanimous vote of the 15-nation council to be issued. Francois Lonseny Fall, Secretary-General Kofi Annan's special envoy for Somalia, told the Security Council in a closed-door briefing on Monday that Islamic hard-liners aspired to control all of Somalia and posed a serious threat to its fledgling interim government, his office said in a statement. But Fall told reporters on Tuesday he was encouraged that the interim authorities and the Islamists had met once in Sudan in June and were due to meet there a second time on Saturday. He urged both sides to launch talks aimed at stability.

is not different clips from different tapes. They got different clips from the same tape because they can't show you the whole tape!

me, the difference is not between ataturk and Siyad, bu between Somalis and turks. Turks realized that his programs were in the interest of their nation and Somalis realized that siyad was not from their clan.

So, you agree with what the taliban did, aprrove of what the "wadaads" did in huriwaa and when people report consider it propagenda?

why is this in the politics section?

One party system is never in the interest of the people. One group/party ruling always leads to dictatorship. So, I will disagree and say that it is not in the Somalias interest to have one group in the former capital. Just in case things lead they way they seem to be leading, the government needs to deal with someone else. Put simply, division (not as much as before where every neighborhood was controled by thug) in xamar between illegitmate groups is good for Somalia.

Thank GOD! There was nothing to talk to about anyways but to tell them to put their weapons down and we all know that these terrorist would not have done that.

I fail to see western values or Liberalism in what your talking about. People should really stop labeling every and all things western liberal.

Although it has taken a long time, the third branch of the TFG was formed. No less important than the Golaha barlamaanka and Golaha Wasiirda, golaha garsoorka was sworned in today. Baydhabo: Tiirkii saddexaad ee dawladda oo la dhamaystiray kadib markii la dhaarshay golaha garsoorka DFKG. Saturday, July 08, 2006 APL Baydhabo (AllPuntland)- Magaalada Baydhabo waxaa maanta ka dhacday xaflad ballaaran oo lagu dhaarinayay guddoomiyaha maxkamadda sare ee Soomaaliya , xeer ilaaliyaha , garyaqaanka guud iyo golaha garsoorka. Xafladdan waxaa kasoo qayb galay madaxda dawladda Soomaaliya sida madaxwayne C/laahi Yuusuf , raysulwasaare kuxigeenka ahna wasiirka arimaha gudaha Xuseen Caydiid , Wasiirka iskaashiga gobolka ahna raysulwasaare kuxigeenka Ismaaciil Buubbaa ,madax ka socotay golayaasha dawladda , ganacsatada , saxafiyiinta iyo fannaaniinta . Xafladdii dhaarinta ahayd ayaa waxaa ugu horayn ka hadlay guddoomiyaha maxkamadda sare ee dawladda Soomaaliya Yuusuf Cali Haaruun , wuxuuna ka faallooday shaqada garsoorka , wuxuu kaloo ka hadlay fursado tabobaro oo u yaalla golaha garoorka. Wuxuu uga mahad celiyay in hawlahan golaha garsoorka oo kaalin ka soo qaatay xubno ay kamid yihiin uqaybsanaha qaramada midoobay ee arimaha Soomaaliya Francios Fall iyo wasiirka qorshaynta C/risaaq Jurile iyo masuuliyiin kale. Wuxuu sheegay guddoomiyaha maxkamadda sare in xeer ilaaliyaha , gar yaqaanka iyo guddiga garsoorka oo gaaraya 25 ay heli doonaan tabobaro lagu dhisayo aqoontooda. Md: Haaruun wuxuu kaloo sheegay in waddamo dhowr ah oo ay kamid yihiin Suudaan, Masar , Talyaaniga , Jarmalka iyo Malaysiya laga filayo tabobar ay siiyaan golaha garsoorka. Haaruun wuxuu intaasi ku daray in kharashaadka ay ku hawl galayaan golaha garsoorka uu gaarayo 48 kun oo doollar , haddii ay wax ka dhimanaadaanna ay dalban doonaan. Intaasi kadib waxaa hadalka qaatay wasiirka arimaha gudaha Xuseen Caydiid oo sheegay in wax lagu farxo ay tahay inuu dhamaystirmo unugyadii saddexda ahaa ee dawladdu ka koobnayd. Md: Caydiid wuxuu sheegay in haddii ay yihiin wasiirada Soomaaliya ay u heellan yihiin inay is garab taagaan lana shaqeeyaan golaha garsoorka. Waxaa ii muuqata ayuu yiri in arintii lawada sugayay ee ahay dhamaystirka caddaalladda dalka in laga gudbay , muhiimna ay tahay in dastuurka dalka ay ilaaliyaan . Madaxwaynaha dawadda Federaalka Soomaaliya ayaa halkaasi hadal kasoo jeediyay wuxuuna tilmaamay in madaxwayne ahaan ay sharaf gaar ah u tahay in lasoo dhamaystiro tiirkii saddexaad ee dawladda oo ah golaha garsoorka , horayna ay u dhisnaayeen golaha wasiirada iyo baarlamaanka. Wuxuu xusay madaxwaynuhu in golaha garsoorku uu baaxad iyo awood le'eg yahay labada gole ee dawladda ee jira , hawshooduna ay tahay midda ugu wayn ee la qabto. Madaxwaynuhu wuxuu sheegay mar haddii saddexdii gole ee dawladda la dhamaystiray inay ku xigi doonaan in golayaashii caddaaladda loo sameeyo gobollada dalka iyo degmooyinkaba. " Gobolladu shaqayn mayaan, boolisku shaqayn mayo, canshuurtu shaqayn mayso , hawsha dawladduna socon mayso , haddii aysan si hawl karnimo ah shaqadooda u wadan golaha garsoorku" ayuu yiri C/laahi Yuusuf. Madaxwaynuhu wuxuu ka codsaday garsoorka inay gaar ka qabtaan (ilaaliyaan) , oo wixii khalad ah ay ka qabtaan , ama ay tallaabo ka qaataan. Marka la isku soo wada duubo golaha garsoorka oo ahaa tiirkii saddexaad ee dawladda ayaa dhamaystirmay , waxaana u taalla mid kamid ah hawsha ugu wayn ee golayaasha dawladda oo ah caddaaladda bulshada. CCC Farayaamo AllPuntland. Somalia: President says the government structure complete Sat. July 08, 2006 09:43 am. Send this news article Mohamed Abdi Farah (SomaliNet) Somali interim president Abdulahi Yusuf Ahmed said on Saturday the general formation of the government has been accomplished today since the members of supreme judiciary committees were sworn. President Yusuf addressing at a ceremony in which the chairman of the supreme court of the transitional federal government Yusuf Ali Harun held in Baidoa, the capital town of Bay region in southwest of the capital Somalia, saying the supreme court can not operate if it is not built the lower courts, the regional authorities and prisons. He said the law should be judged for fairness since the government officials may breach the rule and it is more needed the Supreme Court have to take tough measures against all officials who fall into foul. "Today I can say that the structure of whole government institutions are complete but according to lower administrations are incomplete and they should be arranged sooner," president Yusuf said while he was participating an inauguration ceremony of the Supreme Court leader, the general judge and the general attorney of the government. The chairman of the Supreme Court Yusuf Ali Harun who was speaking after under oath said he would work hardly to complete the rest mission of the lower courts. "The supreme court can do a lot about restoring the law and order at the same time the Supreme Court will training the judges of the court to act their duty," Ali Harun said. Meanwhile, a plane carrying the first part of the Somali police officers who have had three months training in Kenya landed in the Baidoa town airport. They were about 98 policemen who have finished their course. They were trained to security laws and allotted to protect the government officials.

Leave it to Somalis (Must unislamic of all muslims if you ask me) to think they can create an Islamic state, when they can't seem to form any form of government and insure stability for more than a decade and half! Before we embark such lofty ideas,can just agree to peaceful people again with a government. Throwing such ideas to the fire that is Somalia will do nothing but accelerate our unending march towards primitivity and barbariansim.

for the love of god, instead going to some unknown atlas, do a search on north east africa and east africa. Somalia can said to be in Eastern Africa but not east. The following is Northeast Africa http://www.gutenberg-e.org/osc01/images/osc06x.jpg this is east africa http://www.nethotels.com/english/images/east_africa.gif Lastly, when comes to the geography of Somalis, this is what you need to know before corract other ignent folks Northern or Southern Africa: Somalia would be in northern Africa Western or Eastern Africa; Somalia would be in Eastern Africa. If you find this confusing, just use horn of Africa.

Somaliaonline not arabiaoline

SOOL is puntland for now and the forwseeable future. The instability of the fronteirs of puntland can not be blaimed on a man in dubai formore than garowe. This is coused Afqudac (Prsident but acting president for the most part)from ceerigaabo and Xaabsade (Minister of the interior)laascaanood who seem to be concerned more with money rather than security and stability. Also at foult are the poelple of Sool and sanaag who voted all three of them instead Mahamed Abdi Xashi. I too believe that certain people in puntland are being marginalised but not Only sool, sanaag (Bari iyo konforba) and cayn but also Goldagob, burtinle and bosasso. This shameless president cantinues to marginalise all but his sub-subclan. Sad as this maybe, it is no couse to call for "Sool, sanaag and cayn to go their way". we must wait for the next election and make sure to learn from the past. If puntland can not be united, how can we call for the unity of all Somalis?

Lol Somalia is not located in northern Africa, but eastern Africa. Poor soul needs some help with his geography Somalia is in Northeast Africa, Sometimes people say east or north but the correct one is northeast. East african is Kenya, uganda and tanzania.

People, this is only clips from the the video. Lets not jump to any conclusions and what and see if it confomed by more sources. These radicals have repeated that there were no foreigners so if it is true, they will bring the fighters showed in the video to confirm that they are really Somalis. Right now, they could be Somalis, arabs or even asians. East African, not only Somalis, can look like arabs, indians and south asians. Furthermore, the similerity between this video tape and those from fighters from iraq and afghanistan and it would make true what alqacida was saying all along. It was not that long ago that the president said that fighter in mogadishu were being assisted by "Asal raac" from all over the world.

I never ruled that out and there is no agreedupon border between southern Somalia and ethiopia.

Allamagan: Dhubad was just too kind to help you out when it was too hard for you to digest it. I highly doubt that is what dhugaag was trying to do and what he was saying and trying to do was clear to me unlike what you said. As for you, digest what I don't even understand? Stop being silly and try to be more articulate. Why bother saying something if your goal is not to be understood. "As to Kismaio, I just want to say you one thing, waxaad xoog ku qaadi weyseen baryo iyo ina yeey iyo dowlad baanu nahay kuma qaadaysaan. Like it or not Kismaio is under Gedo authority" Kismayo ayay ethnka degtey. Sorry to inform you but their is no gedo administration. What little administration there is, is from the brief xabasha occupations. as for kismayu, shufto, wadaado and warlords from southern mudugh and galgaduud control it for now. This we you keep talking about has never tried to take Kismayo, if they did, we would not be talking about it right now and that is because it has not been and still not in the interest of "us guys" to do so. Unlike you, we know our interest, instead of worrying about other peoples lands and cities, I would advise you to do something with that mars-like desert called Galgaduud were you come from and well return. Ma fahamtey misa adna far wein ba kugu qora?

Dugaagbad, who made you the spokesman for PB and allamagen? Only they now what it means, please let them answer and isqoriska iska daa. bilaashbad isaga xanajeneysa. is that, understood or I make more cear for U. Horn, taaduba ma qarsane bal anaguna an arag meeshey ku geyso. "Kismaayo iyo Gedoba dadki dagnaa baa dagan. Dabadheer daraadeed dadki loo keenay waa wax cad. It is not for us to accuse people of what we are guilty of now is it?" Cajiib, I don't remember claiming or occupying anything. Kismayo waxba ha isku wereerina, we will get to the bottom of that issue one day ee focus on the whole region. "Gedo in laba boqol sano ka hor in dadki xoreeye ay deganyaan Miskiin laftigiisa wuu qirtay" Hayaay, ileen "Xoreenta" i.e. occupation goor hore ayad belowden.