^ Well, as you can see Xamar was part of Zanzibar. Even so, I still don't see how that would be a religiously better because even the likes of Michael Mariano believed in the 1872 map. What if I say; it is important for my cousins to stay within Ethiopia so they can make the country's muslims the majority. How is dividing Oromo/Afar Muslims from Somali Muslim religiously better? Ain't that an extension of clannish mindset?

^ Fools have tried, wise men have failed. Well, comments like "I don't care whether its Godane or Shangoole" count for very little if at the same time you're claiming neither is closer than close to you. Your topic is "Man vs. Qabiil vs. SOL" and you need to fill the blanks yaa sahbii. That does not mean you tell us your postcode, but rather please give us your alternative to Ngonge's Clan is Everything. Are you with me?

^ Wlc back, Guru Inagah!

Originally posted by NGONGE: After all, he kept Messi quite for 92 minutes in that game the other day. He kept Brazil quiet for 92 mins , you mean.

Originally posted by Nur: I don't get it, How can that happen again, do you mean that if the confrontation in the south continues that he South will be awarded to different care taker countries as protectorates? No. Just wanted know what you wanted. I'm trying not to accuse you the way Ngenge has.

^ Don't start.

Originally posted by Che -Guevara: ^Horta saaxiib, last I know, I'm from Burtinle. I don't know where Qaloocan came from. Well, it's your choice if you don't want to declare your cards but the archives will narrow you to Puntland no matter what you say in this thread. As for Mr Goth, hypocrite or not, he has declared his cards and is out there to be judged. You on the other hand say qabiil means nothing but at the same time giving biased advice to certain clannish factions as to what they should/n't do, what gives?

Maaddeey Mullah, I thought you did the Hijra with Sh. Muu'min, did you make excuses at Heathrow?

Originally posted by Wigad: barcelona were playing dhex kujireh and real madrid was the man in the middle. Exactly. Sometimes it was hard to believe that was The Real Madrid. Being out-played by Barca is one thing, but giving away the ball so cheaply was just poor.

^ Aw Nuurow, what were the borders for Somalis before the Great Scramble? I know the people down south were sold to the Italians by a Sultaan in Zanzibar. Is that position a somewhat religiously, politically or morally better for Somalis to put themselves in again? we Somalis are just learning how to play cards (A Somali Clannish Joke, no offense to anyone!), Reer X turub baray!? You need to do some dacwa in the other section, we'll bring out the best in you.

^ Some people could read and write way before Somali lingo was written down. Besides, Mr Good sounds a bit funny. That's all a side issue, Che the man needs to come back to the thread and answer the question in the previous page. What does (your) clan mean to you? C'on now, you gotta come out and play....

^ Headless chicken, you mean. This was supposed to be Samba-football-playing Brazil you know, not LFC. Not scoring and being negative is not them. I blame Lucas.

^ I knew I'd smoke you out with that. Well, if you call this shackling.

Man vs. Qabiil vs. SOL Che what does (your) Qabiil mean to you?

^ Xaaji don't be a war-monger. It's not good.

Aw Nuurow, Eid Mubaarak to you too and apologies for jumping the gun. 1. Isn't only the size that makes clannish loyalty different than Patriotism? if so, then why do some of us think negatively about clannish loyalty while being patriotic (Waddaninimo - Somali Patriotism) ? Good question, one which I've asked in the mad house section of SOL. Some "Somalism" propagated by some folks claiming not to be clannish is nothing short of hypocrisy - especially when done under the banner "isku diin..". 2. Does Patriotism aka Nationalism, compete with our loyalty with our Maker's Absolute Sovereignty? Does the flag and the National Anthem represent a modern Idol? I mean a form of false deity whose devotees hold it sacred above everything else? Well as long as your flag got tawxiid writen on you're covered. On a serious note, the phrase "Ilaahay ka sokow...." should apply on the "sovereignity" at the very least. It's all in the interpretation because there's no single movement that does have flag or Coat of Arms that I'm aware of. 3. Is grouping of peoples along colonial demarcated borders a legitimate right reserved for past Colonialists if Colonialism itself is deemed as an illegal crime committed by Nations who invaded peaceful nations, occupying their lands, stealing their resources, enslaving their peoples and then, as they cut their losses an ran away, hastily demarcated the lands they occupied as per their interests and not as per the wishes of the indigenous peoples? In an ideal world, colonial borders are not justifiable. Fact is; even the most vocal groups on this issues (like Shabaab) have so far chosen to respect the colonial borders of Somalia (with Kenya and Ethiopia). One can have ideals and principles but pragmatism rules. The question is; is it smart to shout from the roof-tops in the first place? The other issue is; if the likes of Shabaab got rid of colonial borders; where do they stop? Hanjabaaddan "ilaa iyo Alaska" ma kadhab baa? is there a half-way house other than the nationalistic "Greater Somalia"? 4. What is the strongest cohesive force that unites different peoples of different races, colors and languages?? Well the obvious answer is Islam, but I'm not going to jump the gun again, so I'll leave it to you. 5. Are the United Nations and African Union entities that sanction morally binding and encompassing authority over member nations' Sovereignty? Do they reserve the right to recognize the representatives of the member nations based on: A. Principles of the Organization, B. Principles held by the Member Nation's People If it becomes different than the Organizations founding principles? C. Does the African Union, and the UN own its members or its the members who own the Organization? Nur 2010 eNuri Political Islam Bridging Islamic Principles With Modern Governance Once again; in a perfect world, things should not be as they are. Imperialism exists in a different format compared to the 20th century version but what are we going to do about it? Muslim countries can chose not to play by the these organisation's rules if they are prepared to take the pressures (Iran is under as we speak) or just grin and bear it like the Arabian Sheikhdoms. They could demand opt-outs if there is a clash of principles. One can argue Norway is not a member of the EU and Switzerland - of all places - joined the not-so-democratic UN not long ogo. The Americans in reality do not recognise the International Criminal Court and some countries are not members of the NPT. As things stand, The reality is; the International Community (read Uncle Sam) decides who bends the rules and gets away with it.

Originally posted by Kamaavi: We have a right to be in dealing with ALL injustices, invasion, secession and colonialism. This is not a place to ‘play’ nice. We respect each other and try to reason respectfully but playing nice is not really a prerequisite. Deal. What does that all mean and where do we start? There's a lack of trust to put it mildly. Not along ago, certain SOL member jokingly PMed and demanded "ONLF ta taageer waryaa" . I replied; "Taageer noocee Saaxib? Hoos Hoos mise Jihaad baynu ku dhawaaqna? Perhaps in between , like Siilaanyo did only for Shariff only for the mullah to decide it was time to have tea with Meles a few moths later. Excuse Landers' hesitation but even the likes you and me are old enough to remember the Front as part of the establishment too, don't we?" Not long after that ex-change it became clear some of the people that claimed they were freedom ffighters were once again part of the Ethio establishment. Even the ones that are still claiming to be freedom fighters like the Admiral are accused of sabotaging and killings the likes of Doolaal (AUN). The Kikuyu pupets like Gaandhi and Axmed Madoobe are heroes, you brag. What's left yaa sahbi Muriidi; Kili5's regional Ethio agents. I'm gonna give it to you short and sweet. I don't hate you, I just don't trust a single bone in your body - with justifiable reasons. Nin SSDFti ku biiray baa laga haya; Maxaan hog Abeeso galay Maxaan halaqyo ugu tegey Maxay miciyo i heleen Maxaan waabay hirqaday Maxaan geerida ka hadhay ~ C M Amiin (AUN)

^ Waa af-kanool cay iyo cabaad ku booda marka runta loo sheego. Muriidi You out-number the Tigres and have Eritrean support, what else do you need? The problems is the likes of you are lead by the likes of the Admiral, Prof. Gaandhi and Axmed Madoobe. The rest of you are lead by Daud, Ilays and co. The supposed younger and educated like yourself are no better because they too are mis-lead to blame the likes of Rayaale and Siilaanyo instead of facing the reality. But hey, one must not grumble. The question is; WTF is it you want us to do for you?

^ We need vegetables, they need fish and salt. We need hydro-power, they need port facilities. Some mutual interests might be classified info. Most of our needs from them are short term only. :cool:

Send troops not navies to Somalia, says Uganda (AFP) – Nov 12, 2010 KAMPALA — The world is wasting its money on ineffective naval operations to tackle Somali piracy when it should be spending it on the African Union's force in Mogadishu, Uganda said Friday. "The international reaction has been: 'Let's deal with piracy. Let's have our commanders there.' It is a good reaction, but it has not been successful," James Mugume, permanent secretary at Uganda's foreign ministry, told reporters. Reflecting on Uganda's tenure at the UN Security Council which expires next month, Mugume urged the panel to vastly strengthen the AU force, arguing it will be more effective against piracy than international naval patrols. "The concept of operation we presented to the Security Council is: let's take over the territory of Somalia. Let's block the ports ... and the issue of piracy will automatically be reduced." Ugandan troops make up the bulk of the AU's 7,500-strong force in Mogadishu, which has chiefly been protecting the fragile Western-backed government since 2007 but has failed to break an Islamist insurgency led by the Al Qaeda-linked Shebab group. Following the July 11 suicide bombings in Kampala that killed at least 76 and were claimed by Somalia's Shebab, Uganda asked the UN to give the AU force a more robust mandate and support its expansion to 20,000 men. Neither request has been met but, according to Mugume, "the security council did not say no." He argued that Uganda's plan to curtail piracy is "cheaper," than the current measures in place. "It's more sustainable and it brings regional peace and stability," Mugume said. European, American and other navies have deployed dozens of warships to take part in anti-piracy operations in the Gulf of Aden and Indian Ocean at an annual cost believed to be in the billions of dollars. Somalia's pirates, whose cumulated ransoms in 2009 totalled less than 100 million dollars, have never been more active and currently hold some 30 vessels and more than 500 crew hostage. --------------------------- Dharaar baa iman doonta mujrim oogo madowoo islaam sheeganayaa agablaay hambadaada isa sii kaba raasho -ku darsoo Axmed-doolow waxaan ahay xog-ogaaloo hir fog baan arkayaa orna waa maqlayaa waxna way urayaan Aaminaay waan gabyayaa nin abwaanana waan ahoo ereygiisu tuf leeyahay Hadeydaan i adeecinoo ergedaan ahay maanta ka abaal ka dhacdaan Ilaahay balankii ibtilaa dhici doonta Dhulkay eyro ku fooftana Afrikaan madmadowiyo ajnabaa degi doona iyagaa talin doona Ergo (1992) ~ M X Dhamac "Gaariye"

^ His and the people they share land with in SSE (Somaliland, Somalia and Ethiopia).

Originally posted by Kamaavi: ^Well by counting those Eelo, Burco, Odweyne, Adna etc..., it seems you have more Colleges than you have toilets. What is up with that? Well that's just one indicator of progress but I don't expect you Caamo to know that. In fact many more are needed. Years back, there was a minister making a speech and was interupted by Gen Barre who challenged the minister about the Somali population figure he had just given. The minister replied; if the population was that great as the General claimed and the country had so few schools, hospitals, etc it means the Kacaan had failed. The speechless General sat down and the minister continued with his presentation. Guess who that smart ex-minister was? Originally posted by Kamaavi: Mr Haile Sellasie couldn't persuade to change the mind of my uncle Makhtal Dahir after imprisoning him for 27 years. But you will not admit the truth, and values of the resistances that my uncles founded for Somalis. C'on now, the likes of Makhtals and Doolaals were genuine freedom fighters AUN. I was talking about Cabdiraxmaan Maxamed Cabdalle Xasan (Wasiir-ku-Xigeenkii Arrimaha Gudaha ee Xayle Salaasi)

^His people.

^ Some real, some not but free to express his views.

^ Well your kids might go Jigjiga Uni but in SL the kids have...freedom of choice. There's Burco, Camuud, Eeelo, Hargeysa, Adna's and others. The problem is only the Ethios seem to impress you. Originally posted by Kamaavi: Wacadkuu *****-wagaash kufriga la galay, xornimo been ah kuma seegin. Talk the talk but end up being Xayle Salaasi's junoir minister.