Shujui or is it Mancini, im pleased to see you have not lost your sense of humour, (you know how power corrupts ) you sure gonna need it!. Would you like to tell us how one becomes a 'moderator' or would that be breaking 'camel milk secrecy act'? Is it an OBE like award from King Libaax or is it more of serious work? And lastly and not least will this be able to end your recent obsession to find out wether Angel Dust is Sami Gurl?

Libaax I don't see a ''systematic elimination of an ethnic group or groups from a region or society,'' taking place, the people in that article were decribed as of origin mainly from Bay & Bakool regions. 'Ethnic cleasing' is best suited describing the actions done to make them come to Somaliland in the first place. Although I DO NOT agree with the Somaliland's govt actions and reasons I think it might end-up reversing what you might call 'ethnic cleasing''.

I have to agree with Nino, some of the articles posted in here need clarifications. I don't mean to put Etrepreneur on the spot, but these two comments spring to mind posted 18 June Bro/Sis the word "ugly" is a relative word..depends on what you mean by ugly...To be honest I find the arabic names and to a certain extent the so called muslim names "very ugly" but that is my judgement. posted 22 June, 2003 Brother Kheyr. A good topic. I want to come back to this issue later on in the week because I have to rush. But I would agree with you. From my experience, the more I study the more sceptical I become of the words of Allah ( have to admit it). I think university education, in particular post graduate courses and onwards give you the ability to question things including religious arguments. I have found myself repenting every hour due to my thoughts. Insha allah waan ku soo noqonayaa mowduucaan. There are other comments sometimes posted in the 'intellectual social debate' part of SOL that that I think fall into category Nino's question/topic.

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^^^admirable indeed, if only you did the same when SOL came to you with the moderator offer, but you couldn't resist to be part of the establishment did you? Is it true you had to go through some initiation ceremory and did they make you changed your nick to Mancini?

'Me? I thought, OBE me? Up yours, I thought'

Libaax ST I don't think the average Somalilander is behind this ethnic cleansing. Libaax ST since when was asking people to go back to their hometowns and villages 'ethnic cleansing'? Was this misrepresentation of facts when it comes to Somaliland a mistake or is it part of your duties as a SOL Moderator? This what Guraad's allpuntland.com claimed ''Victims admitted to Garowe main Hospital, where the injured are being cared for, were internally displaced persons (IDP) of non-**** origin mainly from Bay & Bakool regions reportedly fleeing detention and deportation if arrested by the local police in Hargeysa and Buroa.'' Rudy i expect somaliland to welcome any one who is somali or african! ce viva somalis! period! homes! In an ideal world maybe, but Somaliland is not able to cope that just yetI don't think. Does Somaliland have the schools, hospitals and other publics servises required by this people when it struggling to provide them for Somalilanders? Someone please tell me how to solve this problems because it is more than giving people land to settle as refugees. Im not a constitutional expert but Somaliland breaking away has some implication on the citizens of the rest of Somalia which I think is why some of you opposed its independence in the first place, so what the fuss all about? . PS Its worth asking yourselves why these people are in Somaliland in the first place, is it because they fled your 'leaders' whom you all want Somalilanders to accept?

Gediid you are going where? I hope that was a slip of the tongue bro I'm certainly interested in your venture but why restrict ourselves to camel milk only when my little research shows we can might make a few bob on camel wool and hides too. There is another thing which I've just found out about which might require your powers of persuasion and selling abilities. Check out this link >>>>>camel milk and urin Hadiths If you think that would be a hard thing to swallow for the nomads, what about this Jew's idea of camel milk ice cream? >>>>> Camel milk can help prevent African famine I think we are on to something big here . BTW, I might be in Somaliland sooner than you if everything goes well Insha a Allah.

Lets all be serious for a sec, are you expecting Somaliland to welcome everyone just because they are Somali or should there be a system of keeping control on the numbers of people who should be allowed to stay? If there so what sort of system should that be? What you all have to remember most Somalilanders still remember when they last welcomed suffering Somali refugees from Ethiopia, they ultimately ended being asked to show their identity cards by the same refugees living in their own hometowns who chose to work for Siad's regime.

^^^^^Patience little child patience Since i'm not able to get a confirmation from the person who sent the '...ngry riddle' quick enough, i think i'll accept your answer. Where will you like me to send your winning prize Lucky?

Herders Hope Camel Cheese Rivals Cheddar Friday November 14, 2003 7:46 PM By EDWARD HARRIS Associated Press Writer NOUAKCHOTT, Mauritania (AP) - Herd boys tug at camels' udders, loosing the raw material for a unique, creamy cheese this desert nation's growers hope to place alongside Roquefort and cheddar on the world's crackers. If foreigners bite, camel cheese exports could put sorely needed cash in the robes of this West African nation's nomads, helping them to modernize herding practices. But there are hurdles: European Union and American import and health regulations demand costly testing impoverished Mauritania, like most African nations, is unable to provide. ``If the Europeans buy that cheese, our milk production will skyrocket. We'll get the technology - better than the money - like the right medicines. Then our herds will really grow,'' says herder Tati Ould Mohamed, watching as an orange bucket filled with frothy milk. ``But the product can't be sold overseas. And that's causing problems,'' says Mohamed, one of 1,000 herdsmen selling milk to Tiviski SARL, touted here as the world's only camel cheese factory. Nancy Abeiderrahmane, the British founder of Tiviski, has waged a decades-long campaign to export the milk and cheese of camels - animals more associated with Bedouin herders than brie. When Abeiderrahmane moved to Mauritania in 1970, many of the country's 2.9 million people lived as herdsmen, but were increasingly consuming imported milk and other processed foods. ``I thought it was absurd that they had all of these dairy animals and were importing all of this ultra-pasteurized milk,'' the 56-year-old Briton says. ``I so missed fresh milk. And I love camel's milk; it's exquisite.'' So, with $250,000, she launched her company in 1987. It started with packaged camel milk, then quickly branched into yogurt and creme fraiche. ``It all made perfect sense,'' Abeiderrahmane says. Over the years, she grew intrigued by the idea of camel cheese. Camel milk doesn't curdle naturally, making cheese production difficult. But by 1994, with the help of a French professor, Abeiderrahmane had developed a method for making camel cheese, which tastes similar to goat cheese, but spreads and looks more like brie or Camembert. But there was no local market. ``Mauritanians don't eat cheese because they don't know it and don't like the taste,'' she says. ``So we made it for the European market, this wonderful cheese with this handsome packaging.'' With little idea of international trade regulations, she traveled to Europe, finding interest from high-end emporiums, including Paris's Fauchon and Harrods of London, she says. But trade regulators in Brussels, the EU headquarters, said the cheese contravened import rules. ``They were amused and wanted to help us, but the bureaucracy is huge,'' Abeiderrahmane says. ``At first they said it wasn't milk, because it wasn't the secretion of cows, sheep, ewes, or buffalos'' as defined by EU laws, she says, although that hurdle fell to her lobbying efforts. But bigger obstacles remained: Mauritania has yet to show it has eradicated foot and mouth disease, which has swept Europe in recent years and which the United States also guards against. It also lacks testing facilities to prove its products are safe for human consumption. ``It may take another seven or eight or nine years,'' Abeiderrahmane concedes. A French restaurateur in the Mauritania capital says he is convinced there is an overseas market for camel cheese. ``A good red wine, a fine Bordeaux - this cheese can stand up to whatever you drink with it,'' says Patrick Peri, owner of Nouakchott's Le Mediterraneen. ``I'm sure that in France, you could sell it in gourmet boutiques in the small towns,'' says Peri, who serves the cheese pan-friend with a pinch of herbs. Tiviski now boasts 240 employees, a gleaming factory of stainless-steel urns and pipes, and 2002 sales of $5 million - only a tiny fraction from camel cheese, packaged in small brown boxes and sold locally. But Abeiderrahmane estimates she could increase cheese production to as much as 530 pounds daily, if the foreign markets were there. For herders like Mohamed, that would be good news. His herd, like many, has dwindled in the face of drought and development, decreasing by 150 last year. With increased milk sales, he could use the cash to vaccinate his herd and stock up against another deadly drought. ``It's good for the country,'' Abeiderrahmane says of Mauritania's cheese ambitions. ``I'm not depriving anyone of anything - except maybe some baby camels a bit of milk.'' ----------------------- ``At first they said it wasn't milk, because it wasn't the secretion of cows, sheep, ewes, or buffalos'' as defined by EU laws, she says, although that hurdle fell to her lobbying efforts. There you have it, according to the EU there is no such thing as camel milk, don't ask me what they call it...

Aamiiin OG Girl and CIID MUBAARAK TO YOU ALL.

The hidden cost of Bush's war Concern about fatalities among Western forces in Iraq tends to overlook another ghastly statistic: the spectacularly mounting toll of the severely wounded. Andrew Buncombe reports on America's invisible army of maimed and crippled servicemen 14 November 2003 Sgt Meinen, of the 43rd Combat Engineer Company, 3rd Armoured Cavalry Regiment, is among thousands of wounded soldiers who have returned from Iraq to uncertain futures, months of difficult and often painful treatment and an American public largely unaware that so many troops are being injured every day. The reality is that, just as Iraqi hospitals struggled to deal with the number of wounded civilians during the invasion of the country, so military hospitals in the US are now overflowing with wounded Americans. Advances in body armour and battlefield medicine mean that an increasing number of soldiers such as Sgt Meinen are surviving injuries that even just a decade ago would have killed them. As a result, while the Bush administration is able to point to a relatively modest number of US fatalities in Iraq ­ yesterday the total stood at 396 ­ there is a huge number of severely wounded soldiers whose injuries and fate go largely unreported. Mr Bush has ordered that the media should not be allowed to photograph coffins containing the bodies of those killed in Iraq, and the return of injured US troops also goes largely unpublicised. This is no coincidence. Senator Patrick Leahy of Vermont told the Senate last month: "The wounded are brought back after midnight, making sure the press does not see the planes coming in with the wounded." But for visitors to the Walter Reed Medical Centre in Washington ­ where Sgt Meinen and two comrades who were injured in the same rocket-propelled grenade attack were treated ­ the wounded are very much on display. Indeed, at this hospital, which deals with injured soldiers (as opposed to sailors or marines), there is barely room for non-war casualty patients. Last week all but 20 of the hospital's 250 beds were reportedly taken up with soldiers injured in Iraq, where there are now some 35 attacks on US forces every day. Fifty soldiers had lost limbs ­ often more than one ­ while dozens of others were being treated for burns or shrapnel wounds. Others require psychiatric help. Officials say that 20 per cent of the wounded have suffered "severe brain injuries" while 70 per cent had wounds with the "potential for resulting in brain injury". About 600 have been dispatched to a specialist burns unit in San Antonio, Texas. On the fifth floor of Walter Reed, where soldiers such as Sgt Meinen and his comrades Pte Trystan Wyatt and Sgt Erick Castro receive physical therapy, staff have reportedly put up a bulletin board with their patients' photographs. It is crammed full of pictures of young men. "We didn't start the board when the war began," Mary Hannah, a therapist, told the Los Angeles Times. "Even the most experienced people here ­ it's beyond their imagining. These are our babies and they just keep coming, coming, coming." The facilities at Walter Reed, the army's main hospital in the US, are so crowded that the 600 or so rooms set aside for families of the injured are apparently insufficient and people are doubling up. The Pentagon is paying to put up hundreds more at local hotels. "I don't think this is going to go away," said the hospital's director, Major-General Kevin Kiley. "Our people are pedalling as hard and fast as they can. We can do this for a long time but at some point ­ if there is no let-up ­ the casualty demand will have to start affecting what Walter Reed is. The whole hospital is on a war footing and emotionally involved. The broader challenge is how do you keep up the battle tempo for a long period of time?" The first stopping-off point for almost all injured soldiers evacuated from Iraq is the US Regional Medical Centre in Landstuhl, Germany, about 100 miles south-west of Frankfurt. To date they have treated a total of 7,714 ill and injured troops. Of these, the Pentagon says 937 had suffered so-called combat injuries, as opposed to non-hostile injuries, though these numbers are disputed by independent experts. "One is going to get you a Purple Heart [a medal for troops injured in battle] and one is not," said a Pentagon spokesman, explaining the difference. "One's for wounds inflicted by the enemy. It could be any type of injury inflicted by someone who wishes to cause you harm." There are no comparable figures for British combatants. We know that 52 British servicemen have died in Iraq, 19 of them since "major operations" officially ended on 1 May. But the Ministry of Defence says that it cannot give any figure for the number of wounded, and none of the defence think-tanks feels able to venture an estimate. One reason is believed to be the extensive involvement in the war of British special forces ­ the MoD is extremely secretive about the SAS and SBS. She added: "This is never going to be a quiet medical centre again. Our people are proud and privileged to be doing it. But we don't have any illusion that it's going away." In addition to the advances in medical treatment, more soldiers are surviving as a result of better equipment. Most troops in Iraq are equipped with $1,600 (£950) Kevlar vests and $325 helmets. The vests, the thickly woven material of which is designed to "catch" projectiles, are fitted with ceramic plates that cover the most vulnerable areas. As a result, most injuries ­ two out of three ­ involve the arms or legs. Around 100 troops have lost arms, legs, hands or feet in the operation to oust Saddam Hussein and occupy Iraq. Most of those seriously hurt receive excellent treatment. Sgt Meinen and his comrades have been fitted with titanium and graphite prosthetics. Speaking by telephone from his home in Colorado, close to his base at Fort Carson, Sgt Meinen was upbeat. "It's really nice," he said of the false limb. "It's better than I thought. I am doing physical therapy now ­ I say I am on vacation." Many of the wounded appear optimistic, hopeful that with retraining and treatment they may be able to return to the armed forces and continue their careers in some sort of capacity. They hope their sacrifice has not been entirely in vain. But there are increasing numbers of veterans from former wars and relatives of soldiers who fought in Iraq speaking out against the ongoing operation and demanding that the troops be brought home. They say it suits the Bush administration not to draw attention to the number of wounded and to ignore the effect on the recruitment and retention of troops as well as public opinion. "The general sense is that it's politically damaging to the Bush administration. It makes it more difficult for them to continue their policies in Iraq,"said Wilson Powell, director of Veterans for Peace. "It may be that those policies are changing. There is a sense that they are trying to accelerate their withdrawal of troops." Mr Wilson, 71, a veteran of the Korean War, said that for a family, the effect of a relative being wounded could be worse than that of them being killed. "Post-traumatic stress disorder goes on for decades. It can affect marriages, relationships with children," he said. "With a death people can move on, people get on with things. If they are wounded, you might have someone who is 50 per cent disabled, who has a sense of shame, who is angry or bitter." complete article>>> The hidden cost of Bush's war

lool, haven't laughed like that for ages.

On the other hand, the name ********ia (a region in Ethiopa) was never a concern for us because our website have never experienced any qabiil fights as a result of somebody mentioning that region. But we will now take the step of censoring that word since you brought it up. I did not want you to ban any word or region name, I was trying to point out the absurd form of 'qabiil correctness' being practiced in here. If some nomads were offended by my post to the point of complaining to you then I would like to offer my sincere apologies to them all.

Admin (the one that edited my last post) I you should explain what makes you think its ok to write Ogadenia in this forum while deleting *****tania from my post. I think the later has several meanings and your attitiude makes no sense unless its political that is... Gediid or whatever you call yourself these days, Saxiib its easy for me to join your train, all it takes is me to toning down my language or to keeping shtum. What about the people who spend most of their daytime searching for negatives stories about Somaliland and nightime dreaming about its demise who are already on board? Anyways count me in and lets see how you'll deal with the unhealthy cargo...

Inna lillhah wa inna ilayhi rajiicuun. Sue and the rest of his family samir iyo imaan. Allah chose to take his soul in the month of Ramadan may HE also have mercy on him. Aamiin.

Angel Dust I shall not be joining you on this journey of yours to find your "centre" for I have indeed managed to find such a place in the heart of beautifull Somaliland and literally its the heart and centre of SL- this place is indeed no other then pretty in dust Burco ( hence the nick ). So I shall leave you and the other displaced nomads to this journey. Dusty. Smart move indeed Dusty. There will be more unexplained deaths on this 'centrist' train to make the Mbagathi gathering look like a picnic. Not all of us have Gediid's unique talent of sleeping while keeping one eye on 'federalist' chanting 'well said' and 'nicely put' when the warrior whipsers the his new, shorter and better route to the cape of no hope. Best wishes Gediid, hope we meet again but boy I'm I glad not to be evited . Liqaye For instance Feisal warabe never calls it puntland but M.......... land. Go on spit it out, do you mean *****tania? Well FOI thats what col. Yusuf and his followers used to call the place before the PC boat docked at Bosaaso. One would have thought the reading few in the Somaliland corner would have been infuriated by Edna claim in her efforts to distancing herself from other Somalis that “tribes in Somaliland have neither hereditary nor ancestry ties with other tribes in Somalia.” This does not only belie the true ethnic, cultural, and linguistic synthesis of the Somalis (one of the most homogeneous in the human race), The truth is somewhere in between if I may say so. Some somalis think they are related to Shaka Zulu while others believe they are the Prophet's direct descendants, how we become a homogeneous nation beats me!. Samurai, how are the two 'Sheikhs' that we claim to be our ancestors related? Let alone the Somalis whose' ancestors come from Portugal and Italy. [ November 09, 2003, 05:07 AM: Message edited by: Admin ]

Lucky Oh what the heLL...no i dont need no fire extinguisher but here goes-ayoub;you snooze you Lose. The answer is Language.Let me know if you need cLarification as to how this came to be the answer? I'm really sorry guys, ramadan and old age are getting better of me . I'm not doubting you Lucky, but,(i don't know how but) if LANGUAGE turns up be the correct answer you'll get your winning 'prize' . Let you know as soon as its confirmed to to be coorect. It's time for a 'snooze' alredy. Ramadaan Kariim to you all.

Even I don't know i'll be getting for 'getting' the correct answer. I'll think of another gift or maybe you should tell me what you consider to be a worthy gift. In the mean time ramadan kariim coz my dinner is at the table . later.

I'll buy you a fire extinguisher

Lucky received it by e-mail as it is sister. Why don't you PM the aswer to me and I'll share my prize with you.

^^^Thats what I keep telling myself.

Rokko I saw that on TV but i think this other 'poor man' who was angry with his lawyer shocked me more. Watch by cliking on the ''Amazing but horrific scenes'' on top right corner of the link below. Lawyer shot in front of TV crew

I've been trying to figure out the answer for this one for weeks, perhaps one of you could help: There are three words in the English language that end in "gry". ONE is angry and the other is hungry. EveryONE knows what the third ONE means and what it stands for. EveryONE uses them everyday, and if you listened very carefully, I've given you the third word. What is it? _______gry?